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Cit_the_bed

Bots in coop still shooting after undetected

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The bots in coop keep shooting accurately and on target even 10+ seconds after being undetected.

coop seems broken since the patch yesterday.

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Is that all? It's been far worse than that for me, for a long time.

Tried to start a thread on it. Mods didn't like it.

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1 hour ago, Cit_the_bed said:

The bots in coop keep shooting accurately and on target even 10+ seconds after being undetected.

coop seems broken since the patch yesterday.

I've seen it myself but you do have to account for very long range fire that took 10+ seconds to reach you.

Bots always know exactly where you are but the programming prevents them from shooting at you if they cannot see you. I think there are occasional glitches in this programming that allow them to fire even when they can't "see" you.  Something where it skips the "Is target visible?" decision tree before proceeding to firing. I have been shot in smoke by bots at relatively short range (5K) after a pause in their firing. One time it was a single gun, not a full salvo. Never showed detected.

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1 hour ago, z9_ said:

Is that all? It's been far worse than that for me, for a long time.

Tried to start a thread on it. Mods didn't like it.

This, what I want to see changed with the bots is the super spidey sense that tells them that torpedoes have been launched from undetected ships.

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9 minutes ago, Sabot_100 said:

the programming prevents them from shooting at you if they cannot see you.

But not from tracking you with their guns, so that they can fire the instant you get spotted.

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I find that every 3 or so games i have a bot who tries to take me out with torps from behind. And it’s a green bot. This is something that should be addressed.

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Not spotted, lay smoke, fire from smoke (in DD), enemy BB around 8km, no friendlies behind me...….and a single secondary round from the BB fires at me and knocks out engine. :Smile_amazed:

Yes, the torpedo beats are silly as well: you check the BB is going straight towards friendly ships, no aircraft in air, no enemy bots to see the torps, no friendly ships in your area that might make the BB turn, you launch torps! And within 5 secs the enemy BB turns towards you ensuring the torps miss.....how lol

Last is the enemy CV that will have your friendlies firing at it (a DD, CA and BB!), yet will still send its aircraft across the map to attack a DD that is still 6km away from even being in range to fire at it!

 

It happens so infrequently I don't let it bother me, but it's enough to make me hope it doesn't become a more frequent occurrence!

Edited by _WaveRider_

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1 hour ago, _WaveRider_ said:

Not spotted, lay smoke, fire from smoke (in DD), enemy BB around 8km, no friendlies behind me...….and a single secondary round from the BB fires at me and knocks out engine. :Smile_amazed:

Yes, the torpedo beats are silly as well: you check the BB is going straight towards friendly ships, no aircraft in air, no enemy bots to see the torps, no friendly ships in your area that might make the BB turn, you launch torps! And within 5 secs the enemy BB turns towards you ensuring the torps miss.....how lol

Last is the enemy CV that will have your friendlies firing at it (a DD, CA and BB!), yet will still send its aircraft across the map to attack a DD that is still 6km away from even being in range to fire at it!

 

It happens so infrequently I don't let it bother me, but it's enough to make me hope it doesn't become a more frequent occurrence!

Its the upgrade module torpedo acquisition added to the captain skill. It allows bots to see the torpedoes at almost 3 km.

It's no secret bots are getting upgrade modules and captain skills.

I have been fired at in smoke and my only guess is that despite the 20 sec rule a bot probably already committed to fire on me based on my last position. So detection drops, but the bot guesses on shooting at you.

This is a Heuristic algorithm, so the bot now has the ability to take an educated guess on last known position.

As for the crazy torp beats, they learn by watching us. I have witnessed a Bismarck moonwalk to avoid CV torps. As ridiculous as this sounds, it has actually been comical how bots are pulling matrix moves.

But I did figure out one thing. They can't see torps in a smoke bank well. And around islands, if you are really close, then bots are unable to react in time.

Then there is my devious misdirection move where I send torps at them bow on but a little to direction I decide to flank. I then fire at them from that flank and get them to steer my way so my torps hit them broadside. This hinges on not getting detected initially and your torps are also not being detected either.

It's the most exteme range attack technique I mostly perfected to date. Eventually the bots will learn this.

 

By the way, if you get repeatedly torpedoed in the stern, then that is my fault. I taught the bots that. They seem to learn humor with a unicum zeal.

 

 

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40 minutes ago, SteelRain_Rifleman said:

Its the upgrade module torpedo acquisition added to the captain skill. It allows bots to see the torpedoes at almost 3 km.

It's no secret bots are getting upgrade modules and captain skills.

I have been fired at in smoke and my only guess is that despite the 20 sec rule a bot probably already committed to fire on me based on my last position. So detection drops, but the bot guesses on shooting at you.

This is a Heuristic algorithm, so the bot now has the ability to take an educated guess on last known position.

As for the crazy torp beats, they learn by watching us. I have witnessed a Bismarck moonwalk to avoid CV torps. As ridiculous as this sounds, it has actually been comical how bots are pulling matrix moves.

But I did figure out one thing. They can't see torps in a smoke bank well. And around islands, if you are really close, then bots are unable to react in time.

Then there is my devious misdirection move where I send torps at them bow on but a little to direction I decide to flank. I then fire at them from that flank and get them to steer my way so my torps hit them broadside. This hinges on not getting detected initially and your torps are also not being detected either.

It's the most exteme range attack technique I mostly perfected to date. Eventually the bots will learn this.

 

By the way, if you get repeatedly torpedoed in the stern, then that is my fault. I taught the bots that. They seem to learn humor with a unicum zeal.

 

 

Are you aware of the skills and modules the bots are given then; if you have a link I'd love to see what they have officially.

I always thought the bots were just standard with no added anything tbh - just the excellent bot firing and that knowledge of knowing where everything is, so when they do see you via the game mechanic they can react a split second later.

 

Thank you :Smile_honoring:

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At the start lineup screen before you enter battle you can check out the bots relative strengths, and they do vary. 

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3 hours ago, monpetitloup said:

I find that every 3 or so games i have a bot who tries to take me out with torps from behind. And it’s a green bot. This is something that should be addressed.

I have begged and begged. 

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My favourite bot cheat is when you become spotted at the beginning of a match and find that the bots are already pre-aimed at you - even the BBs with slow turret traverse. If you zoom in on them before you are spotted, you can see them pointing at you.

 

Mind you, its also weird to see bots leaving their spawn with their turrets "fore and aft", which isn't possible on a human-played ship. I guess bots don't have a camera or the code that links turrets to camera/mouse.

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The other bot trick is when a bot CA is firing the main guns at a ship behind him the front turrets will fire at me, forward of him, at the same time.  

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Why your next landing page should be a chatbot | Stryve Digital ...

I always assumed the bots got all of these extra perks (the torpedo avoidance skill is incredibly annoying) to keep them alive a little bit longer and to make them a little more threatening. 

 

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2 hours ago, Turbogerbil said:

Mind you, its also weird to see bots leaving their spawn with their turrets "fore and aft", which isn't possible on a human-played ship. I guess bots don't have a camera or the code that links turrets to camera/mouse.

That is a significant advantage when taking on multiple adversaries or on in close quarters. It is why you should always be cautious about turning across the stern of a bot because you can almost guarantee it's stern guns are pointing straight at your citadel.

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You do realize bots in coop cheat right they know everything you are doing and know where everyone is at in map at all times :Smile_hiding:

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54 minutes ago, LastRemnant said:

You do realize bots in coop cheat right they know everything you are doing and know where everyone is at in map at all times :Smile_hiding:

Then why do they torp each other? Is there a bot fight we don't know about? Or is WG sharing this platform with a different bot vs bot game? Loosers have to play on the human team.

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The thing that's standing out to me right now in terms of gunfire from bots is the random railgun shot that comes tearing in at mach 11, perfectly flat trajectory, while you're not spotted. 

 

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5 hours ago, Taichunger said:

I have begged and begged. 

The green bots firing torps at friendlies is INTENTIONAL, not a glitch in the coding. The dev team excuses it as simulating team killers on your own team.

But it happens so often, the reality is two fold -  this allows the AI which controls EVERYTHING to use green bots to sneakily help out the red team when the criteria calls for it, and more importantly, the devs find it hilarious. 

NOTE TO DEV TEAM: your PAYING customers don't find it funny at all.

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48 minutes ago, GrayPanther2018 said:

Then why do they torp each other? Is there a bot fight we don't know about? Or is WG sharing this platform with a different bot vs bot game? Loosers have to play on the human team.

Because taking each other out helps the red team.

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6 minutes ago, capncrunch21 said:

The green bots firing torps at friendlies is INTENTIONAL, not a glitch in the coding. The dev team excuses it as simulating team killers on your own team.

But it happens so often, the reality is two fold -  this allows the AI which controls EVERYTHING to use green bots to sneakily help out the red team when the criteria calls for it, and more importantly, the devs find it hilarious. 

NOTE TO DEV TEAM: your PAYING customers don't find it funny at all.

 

Cite?

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7 hours ago, SteelRain_Rifleman said:

Its the upgrade module torpedo acquisition added to the captain skill. It allows bots to see the torpedoes at almost 3 km.

This is a fallacy.  The bots detect torpedoes as soon as they leave your tubes - regardless of range. It's a cheat built into the system as someone above pointed out to keep the bots alive longer.

They only act on the detection when their tier programming says they can. Higher tier ships tend to act on it right away, lower tier ships not so much. There is also some other hidden coding that modifies this, as I have seen low tier ships dodge torps like T10 ships, and high tier ships blissfully sail straight into a full spread. I think it has to do with how well a match is being won or lost at the time.

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11 hours ago, Cit_the_bed said:

The bots in coop keep shooting accurately and on target even 10+ seconds after being undetected.

coop seems broken since the patch yesterday.

Yea, they are firing torpedoes at close range after the sink too, thats why I did three coops last night then a few randoms coops need to be fixed so I can return to the coop side

 

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7 hours ago, SteelRain_Rifleman said:

Its the upgrade module torpedo acquisition added to the captain skill. It allows bots to see the torpedoes at almost 3 km.

It's no secret bots are getting upgrade modules and captain skills.

I have been fired at in smoke and my only guess is that despite the 20 sec rule a bot probably already committed to fire on me based on my last position. So detection drops, but the bot guesses on shooting at you.

This is a Heuristic algorithm, so the bot now has the ability to take an educated guess on last known position.

As for the crazy torp beats, they learn by watching us. I have witnessed a Bismarck moonwalk to avoid CV torps. As ridiculous as this sounds, it has actually been comical how bots are pulling matrix moves.

But I did figure out one thing. They can't see torps in a smoke bank well. And around islands, if you are really close, then bots are unable to react in time.

Then there is my devious misdirection move where I send torps at them bow on but a little to direction I decide to flank. I then fire at them from that flank and get them to steer my way so my torps hit them broadside. This hinges on not getting detected initially and your torps are also not being detected either.

It's the most exteme range attack technique I mostly perfected to date. Eventually the bots will learn this.

 

By the way, if you get repeatedly torpedoed in the stern, then that is my fault. I taught the bots that. They seem to learn humor with a unicum zeal.

 

 

It's long been known that the bots cheat. They have 100% battlefield vision, they know where you are at all times, they know where your torps are, and they know exactly what ammo you're loading.

Having been gone awhile, it seems like WG is pushing the cheats even harder, it appears to me that bots now have zero RNG when they are about to die.....

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