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The_Big_Red_1

Battle of Myeongnyang and Chilcheollyang

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Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Myeongnyang

I find this battle most impressive and interesting of epic proportions. in this battle Admiral Yi was able to beat 330 ships with just only a measly 12-13 ships. if you ask me it makes Nelson's Trafalgar look like small/tiny in comparison. For Yi to win this fight must have been a huge morale boost for those serving under his command

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Chilcheollyang

I find this battle most hilarious and tragic because the Japanese were well aware of the internal political struggles of the Korean court and they used it to maximum effect (Translation: the Japanese played the Koreans like fools) and the Court sent an impotent and incompetent commander: Won Gyun (원균) to a blatantly obvious trap complete with ambush written all over it. of the fleet Yi had carefully built only 12 ships would survive. All of the turtle ships that had participated in that battle sunk/gone. Oh how I would love to roast/go Gordon Ramsey savage on King Seonjo (선조) and his ministers for being complete crooked moronic dunces in basic military strategy except for Ryu Seong-ryong (류성룡) he was the smart one!

Chilcheollyang Battle map \/

Red = Japanese

Blue = Koreans

108257299_BattleofChilcheollyangmaparea.thumb.png.e882644127b2a7eb612c8656ac29b102.png

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Ah, the Korean John Paul Jones. Well, when you have such overwhelming odds in your favor you tend to make mistakes and the ones that had fought him and recognized Yi's ability were not listened to and even the ringer brought in by the Japanese who was used to fighting in changing conditions fell for Yi's tricks.

The Korean movie about this. It is not high quality and it is dubbed but they did a good job with the voice acting.

 

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31 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

Ah, the Korean John Paul Jones. Well, when you have such overwhelming odds in your favor you tend to make mistakes and the ones that had fought him and recognized Yi's ability were not listened to and even the ringer brought in by the Japanese who was used to fighting in changing conditions fell for Yi's tricks.

The Korean movie about this. It is not high quality and it is dubbed but they did a good job with the voice acting.

 

the korean language is much better. any english dub in a foreign film makes my ears bleed.

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7 minutes ago, The_Big_Red_1 said:

the korean language is much better. any english dub in a foreign film makes my ears bleed.

I don't disagree but they did a better job than usual in the dubbing, I think the dubbing was done by the production company instead of farming it out.

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On 6/4/2020 at 7:30 PM, BrushWolf said:

I don't disagree but they did a better job than usual in the dubbing, I think the dubbing was done by the production company instead of farming it out.

anyways i wonder which was a worse naval disaster? Chilcheollyang or Savo Island? both battles the Japanese came out victorious.

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1 hour ago, The_Big_Red_1 said:

anyways i wonder which was a worse naval disaster? Chilcheollyang or Savo Island? both battles the Japanese came out victorious.

A good question, naval war was very different in the east in the 16th century, but I think Savo was the bigger face plant but both countries not only survived they came back better than ever. The losses on both sides in the waters around Guadalcanal were horrendous but only the US could sustain those losses. Except for DD's the Japanese ship yards were tied up in repairing ships from the start of the war and never started a new major ship where we were not only repairing ships far faster than the Japanese could believe we were making more than we were losing to replace losses. WWII was a war of production and neither the Germans nor the Japanese were in any position to compete. The US built ships faster than we were losing them and it was pretty much the same with tanks where we made almost 50k Sherman's during the war and the Soviets built 59k of the similar T-34. Neither tank was great like the Mk V Panther but both were good and in a production war good and lots wins over great and few.

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On 6/5/2020 at 10:35 PM, BrushWolf said:

A good question, naval war was very different in the east in the 16th century, but I think Savo was the bigger face plant but both countries not only survived they came back better than ever. The losses on both sides in the waters around Guadalcanal were horrendous but only the US could sustain those losses. Except for DD's the Japanese ship yards were tied up in repairing ships from the start of the war and never started a new major ship where we were not only repairing ships far faster than the Japanese could believe we were making more than we were losing to replace losses. WWII was a war of production and neither the Germans nor the Japanese were in any position to compete. The US built ships faster than we were losing them and it was pretty much the same with tanks where we made almost 50k Sherman's during the war and the Soviets built 59k of the similar T-34. Neither tank was great like the Mk V Panther but both were good and in a production war good and lots wins over great and few.

another interesting similarity that Savo Island and Chilcheollyang had was that both battles were fought at night. which brings another interesting question how would Savo Island ended up for the USN had Yi been in command instead of Turner?

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1 minute ago, The_Big_Red_1 said:

another interesting similarity that Savo Island and Chilcheollyang had was that both battles were fought at night. which brings another interesting question how would Savo Island ended up for the USN had Yi been in command instead of Turner?

A tough what if but I lean to the Japanese getting a very rude shock probably commensurate to the radar clinic that Lee put on during Second Guadalcanal.

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3 hours ago, BrushWolf said:

A tough what if but I lean to the Japanese getting a very rude shock probably commensurate to the radar clinic that Lee put on during Second Guadalcanal.

so if Yi had been in command at Savo Island, Mikawa would have got his butt kicked? 0-0

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On 6/4/2020 at 9:47 PM, BrushWolf said:

Ah, the Korean John Paul Jones.

Not really. I've seen more comparisons made between Yi and Nelson. Paul Jones is simply known for one relatively small naval action on the other side of the Atlantic from where the rest of the war was happening.

On 6/4/2020 at 9:14 PM, The_Big_Red_1 said:

All of the turtle ships that had participated in that battle sunk/gone.

Here's something I've always wondered, but never got an answer for: Japanese naval tactics for the time were to get in close to an enemy ship, rake the decks with arquebus fire, and then board it and burn it down, since their ships were essentially floating pagodas and carried no cannons. However, even with a complete and utter moron in command, the spiked metal roof of the turtle ships was designed to make arquebus fire useless and ensure the turtle ship was immune to boarding. From what I've gathered, the only things afloat that should have been able to destroy a turtle ship should have been with ships equipped with long-range cannons, like what the British had. As such, with the turtle ships built to be essentially foolproof, how were the Japanese able to destroy them?

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On 6/13/2020 at 11:57 PM, BrushWolf said:

A tough what if but I lean to the Japanese getting a very rude shock probably commensurate to the radar clinic that Lee put on during Second Guadalcanal.

Don't forget that proper application of radar also helped Norman Scott win the Battle of Cape Esperance.

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On 6/13/2020 at 11:52 PM, The_Big_Red_1 said:

another interesting similarity that Savo Island and Chilcheollyang had was that both battles were fought at night. which brings another interesting question how would Savo Island ended up for the USN had Yi been in command instead of Turner?

I personally wonder how the Battle of Friday 13th or Cape Esperance could have gone if Yi was commanding the Tokyo Express against Norman Scott and Dan Callaghan.

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On 6/6/2020 at 1:35 AM, BrushWolf said:

Neither tank was great like the Mk V Panther

Don't make me laugh. The Panther was a 50 ton pile of trash, its gun and armour negated by the fact that its suspension, transmission, and engine were meant for a tank half its size and as such broke down far too often to make the tank a viable piece of a larger war effort. That's why the M4 and the T-34 were better: They were designed from the ground up in order to get the job done as one cog meshing with all the others in the machine.

Don't believe me? Then take it from The Chieftain himself.

 

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10 hours ago, 1Sherman said:

Not really. I've seen more comparisons made between Yi and Nelson. Paul Jones is simply known for one relatively small naval action on the other side of the Atlantic from where the rest of the war was happening.

He is Nelson in his application of tactics and Jones in never giving up.

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