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Being Constructive: A vision for, CVs and Subs in CBs.

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Often I feel like there is vision that is missing  to all these classes in the game working together.  Or at least I have failed to read anything from WG in regards to what they envision the game with subs should look like. 

One thing that seems very clear though is that the current implementation of submarines strongly require the need for team work. For example if you are in a BB  you need a sub killer with you to keep you safe. 

So the vision should focus around team work. Clan Battles and Clan Brawls are the most obvious team work modes to envision all the classes working together. 

 So what I would love to see is a weekend long clan brawl with the following structure: 


Tier 8 with 10 "ships"  per side

Capital ships: Max 1- CV and 1-BB or  2 BB

Cruisers:  Max 6 

DDs: Min 1 ,  Max 4

Subs: Min 1 , Max 4


Along with that set of rules add the following changes: 

- CVs can choose to replace 1 of their current air squads with a depth charge squad 

- Subs have poor air concealment when surfaced (close to the same as their regular surface detection). 

- Regular dive bombers can attack subs that are near  the surface for reduced damage.  

- All cruisers that have depth charges modeled get depth charge consumable. 

Something like this might give people an inspiration or the ability to see how all the classes could possibly work together.    Though I do think that "diversity" needs to be forced hence the "min" requirements. Mostly in order to prevent fleets that are 8 cruisers and 2 CVs.    


Personally I think battles like this could be a lot of fun as callers and teams have to coordinate their different weapon systems in concert with each other. 


Edited by eviltane
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321 posts
10,659 battles

An inherent difficulty in WoWs is that it is a "team" game but rewards are earned and given on an individual basis (yes, there is a modifier for those on the winning team).

To maximize the chances of a win, IMO, it is important for all ships to prioritize destruction of the enemy ships equipped with depth charges.  Alongside this, the ships that have depth-charges should prioritize ASW (since they are the only members of the team that are reliably effective in an ASW role), and those ships with depth charges should prioritize staying alive over engaging enemy heavy ships (BBs and CAs).

In this way, the goal would be to eliminate the enemy's ASW assets -- increasing the ability of your submarines to conduct offensive operations against the enemy -- while also facilitating the ability of your DDs and CLs with depth-charges to hunt enemy subs.

What is the problem?  There are ships, and thus players, who would need to conduct actions and demonstrate patterns of behavior that are in the TEAMS best interest but are not necessarily in the individual PLAYER'S best interest.

Subs highlight a general challenge that Wargaming faces...the incentive structures don't necessarily reward good team play.

(Another gripe is that subs are simply too fast...Cachelot and U-69 have a max speed of 24.0 kts on the surface.  USS New Mexico has a max speed of 21.0 kts.  The Type VIIc U-boat (most produced u-boat and ostensibly the basis for the U-69) had a max speed on the surface of 17.7 kts and a submerged speed of 7.6 kts.  We will hear about how this is a game and game balance requires certain ahistorical or non-historical elements...but how is it good game balance to have Tier 6 subs be FASTER than Tier 6 BBs?) 



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