Sinop in Ranked/Venizia in CB = Design or ignorance?

[Elo_J_Fudpucker]

Why is it that WG seems to create their own bad situations. 

How many seasons of CB and Ranked have been dominated by 2 or 3 ships and one meta?

Does WG create these imbalance situations on purpose?  Or does it happen out of ignorance?  Does WG insert these OP ships on purpose? Or do they do this having no clue what the end result will be?

[RipNuN2]

[thebigblue]

I'd submit a ticket to customer service with these questions. If they answer, please post their reply so we may also learn.

Sinop and Venezia are great when played to strengths but fantastically vulnerable in a great many situations. Are you sure it's a problem with the ships and it's not simply that you  are getting outplayed?

[Col_Nasty]

Both Ships are FREE tech tree ships available to anyone.

Argument is Moot.

[Karstodes]

Sinop is a  strong ship for sure, and may need some balance.  But at the same time the meta will adapt. Venezia may be a good ship in clan battle, but it is good thanks to the CV making radar less useful, and even so the meta can change again: clan are sheep and will follow the meta that seems the best until an other clan find a counter to it (like @Destroyer_KuroshioKai showed last week). All in all, git gud.

[Elo_J_Fudpucker]

18 minutes ago, thebigblue said:

I'd submit a ticket to customer service with these questions. If they answer, please post their reply so we may also learn.

Sinop and Venezia are great when played to strengths but fantastically vulnerable in a great many situations. Are you sure it's a problem with the ships and it's not simply that you  are getting outplayed?

OMG .. why do people have to put their own thoughts into what I say???...  my own clan uses these ships as primaries and they function well in their roles. 

[KnifeInUrNeck]

8 minutes ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

OMG .. why do people have to put their own thoughts into what I say???...  my own clan uses these ships as primaries and they function well in their roles. 

Oh well then case closed

[MannyD_of_The_Sea]

9 minutes ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

OMG .. why do people have to put their own thoughts into what I say???...  my own clan uses these ships as primaries and they function well in their roles. 

It’s a public forum. If you don’t want to see others express their thoughts, maybe it’s better to not make the post?

[imaginary_b]

17 minutes ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

Does WG create these imbalance situations on purpose?  Or does it happen out of ignorance?  Does WG insert these OP ships on purpose? Or do they do this having no clue what the end result will be?

Your clan is getting dominated by other clans that run Venezia? You have my sympathy. My clan has also had to adjust to the new playstyles.

Venezia is relatively new to the clan battles scene. The meta shifted, as it usually does, while players figure out how to use the ship characteristics and how to counter them. There's definitely a learning curve there. We've shifted some snipers and radar ships to using more smoke.

That wasn't your point, though. Your point was to ask the question "intent or ignorance?"

If your clan still doesn't know how to counter Venezias, I'd have to say ignorance.
Try using more smoke and ships that can fire at decent range from within smoke. I've had some success in Minotaur.

If you really want to improve, though, just ask for help. And watch how other people deal with it. Don't reach for the blame-stick. Blaming and insults don't win games, they're post-facto attempts to justify failure. Put that energy into being more successful instead.

[clammboy]

18 minutes ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

OMG .. why do people have to put their own thoughts into what I say???...  my own clan uses these ships as primaries and they function well in their roles. 

I don't think they would put OP ships in the game on purpose the Sinop seems to be the ship de jour right now for ranked . I never really payed it much mind until now perhaps in this format 7 VS 7 no CVs  she plays stronger than in 12 VS 12 random .

The Venizia IMHO is a really good ship in the hands of good players so in clan battles I guess she gets a chance to really shine . You have to have good aim and really good kitting skills and then this ship becomes very dangerous and extremely annoying to play against .

These ships are like the Tirpitz was in 1vs1 sprint rank it was boarder line OP it had a niche and was great at it . 

[Ossiuum]

33 minutes ago, thebigblue said:

I'd submit a ticket to customer service with these questions. If they answer, please post their reply so we may also learn

Just to remind anyone that submitting tickets for crap like this is a waste of time for their CS people and makes it slower for anyone experiencing actual issues. 

For clan battles, people will latch onto whatever ship is best, and with CVs around it is Venezia. 

Sinop is the best tier 7 ship in the game so no surprise it is seeing a lot of ranked play, needs to be toned back substantially. 

[kagero__]

38 minutes ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

Why is it that WG seems to create their own bad situations. 

How many seasons of CB and Ranked have been dominated by 2 or 3 ships and one meta?

Does WG create these imbalance situations on purpose?  Or does it happen out of ignorance?  Does WG insert these OP ships on purpose? Or do they do this having no clue what the end result will be?

1. It’s their game. I’d be more than happy to make bad situations for them, but they won’t let me. Sucks.

2. Probably all of them, to a greater or lesser degree.

3. Yes...Yes...Definitely yes...And to answer your last question, yes.

 

[TrinityZodiak]

Remember when Venizia came out and everyone said the entire line sucks, SAP is awful...... yea the ship is good but its not as good as the Stalingrad. 

[Ensign_Cthulhu]

17 minutes ago, Ossiuum said:

Just to remind anyone that submitting tickets for crap like this is a waste of time for their CS people and makes it slower for anyone experiencing actual issues. 

I'm pretty sure @thebigblue was being sarcastic on that score. 

I see the OP is getting frustrated with Ranked again. The potato players are a problem that Wargaming must fix. The shortest-ranged tech-tree battleship at T7 is a problem that Wargaming must fix. This, that or the other is a problem that Wargaming must fix.

The solution to OP's problems always seems to lie somewhere else; never within themselves.

I played one Ranked battle to activate the paltry handful of stars I had left over from last season and grab 500,000 credits from a battle which was thrown in such abysmal fashion that I didn't think I could subject myself to any more. So I decided that was it; I don't need the salt, and I'm not going to do Ranked. The other thing I'm not going to do is come here and whine that it's somebody else's obligation to make sure I don't get windowlicking trash* on my team or ban/nerf ships I don't have the intelligence to develop a counter for.

 

* Earnest newcomers who want to take it seriously and give it their best shot despite their inexperience are a category of player I would have plenty of time for; people who decide (for example) that the job of a cruiser in Ranked is to take a leisurely cruise around the entire map while seemingly keeping the entire enemy team just outside the limit of their own gun range are quite another matter.

3 minutes ago, Slumlord_Dasboot said:

Remember when Venezia came out and everyone said the entire line sucks, SAP is awful...

That caliga is very definitely on the other foot now, isn't it?

[yashma]

1 minute ago, Slumlord_Dasboot said:

Remember when Venizia came out and everyone said the entire line sucks, SAP is awful...... yea the ship is good but its not as good as the Stalingrad. 

Personally I think the Venezia is better than the Stalingrad (it certainly is in a head to head fight), but they're hard to compare as they're very different ship archetypes. 

[clammboy]

21 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

I played one Ranked battle to activate the paltry handful of stars I had left over from last season and grab 500,000 credits from a battle which was thrown in such abysmal fashion that I didn't think I could subject myself to any more. So I decided that was it; I don't need the salt, and I'm not going to do Ranked. The other thing I'm not going to do is come here and whine that it's somebody else's obligation to make sure I don't get windowlicking trash* on my team or ban/nerf ships I don't have the intelligence to develop a counter for.

How much salt could you have encountered in just one game . I have played 14 and everybody has been cool this whole salt thing is a bit much to do about nothing IMHO .

In ranked battles I am 6-8 a losing record . I have played good and I have played bad same as my teams . It's no worse than random battles but there giving you lots more free stuff it seems to be a no brainer .

I'm here to try and win pick up as much free stuff as I can have some fun and when that ceases to be I'm out . 

[enderland07]

News at 5:00, ranked has some ships that are too powerful and teammates are bad.

 

[LittleWhiteMouse]

1 hour ago, Elo_J_Fudpucker said:

Does WG create these imbalance situations on purpose?

Yes.  Not to an extreme degree, but it makes sense business wise to make new tech tree lines (especially full tech tree lines) have some very powerful destination ships in it to incentivize people playing and paying their way through the grind to have access to them.   Once the next major tech tree release comes out, these now veteran tech-tree ships can be nudged back down to more tame levels either through power creep or direct performance nerfs.

[enderland07]

1 minute ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

Yes.  Not to an extreme degree, but it makes sense business wise to make new tech tree lines (especially full tech tree lines) have some very powerful destination ships in it to incentivize people playing and paying their way through the grind to have access to them.   Once the next major tech tree release comes out, these now veteran tech-tree ships can be nudged back down to more tame levels either through power creep or direct performance nerfs.

Yep.

If WG makes all new lines inferior, no one will want them and people will complain.

The line between "competitive enough to justify" and "too strong" is very thin.

Plus, all new ships have inherent advantages in that people do not immediately know how to adapt/play against them.

[LittleWhiteMouse]

13 minutes ago, enderland07 said:

Yep.

If WG makes all new lines inferior, no one will want them and people will complain.

The line between "competitive enough to justify" and "too strong" is very thin.

Plus, all new ships have inherent advantages in that people do not immediately know how to adapt/play against them.

Bingo.  We've seen this before (and recently) with things like the British heavy cruisers.  If something looks mediocre out the gates, who wants to throw time (or, more importantly, money) at that?

[tfcas119]

10 minutes ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

Yes.  Not to an extreme degree, but it makes sense business wise to make new tech tree lines (especially full tech tree lines) have some very powerful destination ships in it to incentivize people playing and paying their way through the grind to have access to them.   Once the next major tech tree release comes out, these now veteran tech-tree ships can be nudged back down to more tame levels either through power creep or direct performance nerfs.

That does kind of explain why since 2018, most ship lines have felt meh until T8 or 9.

FR BBs: ignoring Normandie’s speed and Lyon’s barrel count, they’re quite meh until Alsace, so good she took a nerf and got a T10 premium version, and Republique is also quite good

US cruisers and RU BBs  feel like an exception, as most of those turned out good (save Seattle)

Brit DDs: don’t get good until Jervis (T7)

FR DDs: meh until Le Fantasque (T8)

RM cruisers: eh until Amalfi (T8)

RN Heavies: you don’t see a lot of these, even if they are probably the most balanced/non meta shifting line released in the game since 2018(and the fact that the best of them is Goliath which is more or less a debate-able worse Zao that pens 50mm plating with HE and overmatched 16mm plating with AP

Swedish DDs: the jump in power from Vastereas (T6) to Skane (T7) is impressive, and they keep getting better after Skane.

[Ensign_Cthulhu]

34 minutes ago, clammboy said:

How much salt could you have encountered in just one game .

An early lead in caps and ships degenerating into a three-red-circle wipeout.

[Captain_Slattery]

22 minutes ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:

Yes.  Not to an extreme degree, but it makes sense business wise to make new tech tree lines (especially full tech tree lines) have some very powerful destination ships in it to incentivize people playing and paying their way through the grind to have access to them.   Once the next major tech tree release comes out, these now veteran tech-tree ships can be nudged back down to more tame levels either through power creep or direct performance nerfs.

Here we had a nice little rant with a side order of salt going on then you had to come in with all your "common sense" and "logic" and you just ruined it!  

All joking aside, excellent post.  I would never have thought about it from that angle.  +1  

[clammboy]

1 minute ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

An early lead in caps and ships degenerating into a three-red-circle wipeout.

Oh sorry I thought you meant people were giving you a hard time in chat for your play or just being rude to everyone .

[clammboy]

3 minutes ago, Captain_Slattery said:

Here we had a nice little rant with a side order of salt going on then you had to come in with all your "common sense" and "logic" and you just ruined it! 

Damn I was thinking the same thing I feel stupid now . +1