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Deathwaits84

Premium Ships and FreeXP

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I understand why it currently works the way it does, but that doesn't change the need for something different.

Currently you buy a Premium ship and get a good amount of ship XP that cannot be used without dumping more money into doubloons  to convert at 25xp per doubloons. This just feels like wargaming is attempting to double dip into my pocket for choosing to purchase a premium ship. It is just a greedy practice and will more than likely limit my interest in premium ships as time goes on.

So if you are spending 50+ bucks on a ship then you shouldn't need to invest more to make the XP usable. What SHOULD happen is it automatically converted to freeXP with a penalty. I would say something in the 25-33% range. So instead of getting 4k ship xp for example it would instead give 1000-1333 FreeXP. 

The downsides are it would make obtaining low level ships more easy and would make freexp grinding less reliant on flags for premium ships. 

Now it shouldn't be a big enough change to make obtaining freeXP ships painless. It also makes those premium ships more enticing. So while you might lose some income for people converting xp on premium ships it might be enticing enough to increase ship sales.

I mean you could even give these premium ships a second purchasable camo in the 1-2k doubloon range that provides the changes.

In the end I feel like the current system is penalizing the players that purchase premium ships.

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4 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

 

If freexp becomes even easier to accrue the cost of free xp ships, modules, ship lines etc would also increase to compensate. Premiums already generate greater earnings than tech tree ships in commander xp, free xp, and credits. Another huge benefit is being able to plug in any commander without the need to retrain. This makes them excellent for training commanders.

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11 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

I understand why it currently works the way it does, but that doesn't change the need for something different.

Currently you buy a Premium ship and get a good amount of ship XP that cannot be used without dumping more money into doubloons  to convert at 25xp per doubloons. This just feels like wargaming is attempting to double dip into my pocket for choosing to purchase a premium ship. It is just a greedy practice and will more than likely limit my interest in premium ships as time goes on.

So if you are spending 50+ bucks on a ship then you shouldn't need to invest more to make the XP usable. What SHOULD happen is it automatically converted to freeXP with a penalty. I would say something in the 25-33% range. So instead of getting 4k ship xp for example it would instead give 1000-1333 FreeXP. 

The downsides are it would make obtaining low level ships more easy and would make freexp grinding less reliant on flags for premium ships. 

Now it shouldn't be a big enough change to make obtaining freeXP ships painless. It also makes those premium ships more enticing. So while you might lose some income for people converting xp on premium ships it might be enticing enough to increase ship sales.

I mean you could even give these premium ships a second purchasable camo in the 1-2k doubloon range that provides the changes.

In the end I feel like the current system is penalizing the players that purchase premium ships.

Hi.  I understand what you're saying.  But the 'ship experience' really isnt the point of buying a premum ship - it is credit earning, captain retraining, and for a different gaming experience. 

If you implemented what you suggest, I could immediately convert the 3 million experience on my Belfast to buy the new 2 mil free XP ship.  Such a system is far too valuable, which would require the price of premium ships to increase even further (and they really arent that cheap already), and/or the in-game values for items would need to be substantially increased in cost as a balancing factor. 

If you suggested something like 5 per cent instead, then I have good news for you - 5 per cent of your ship experience already comes to you in the form of free XP (before any bonuses from premium ship camoflages, signal flags etc).  So progress is being made!

 

Edited by UltimateNewbie

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7 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

This is correct, although your ship experience is useful for unlocking the daily crates and getting things out of them, or fulfilling directive requirements.

8 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

credit earning

Never fails.

8 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

captain retraining

That, and giving a particular captain a second (or third, or fourth, or however many you can win/afford to buy in that nation) ship to use for the climb to 19 points.

11 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

a different gaming experience. 

Ask yourself what the ship does differently, that a tech-tree ship or a different premium simply can't do. Those are the ones to get first.

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15 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

If freexp becomes even easier to accrue the cost of free xp ships, modules, ship lines etc would also increase to compensate. Premiums already generate greater earnings than tech tree ships in commander xp, free xp, and credits. Another huge benefit is being able to plug in any commander without the need to retrain. This makes them excellent for training commanders.

Free XP is only easy to accumulate if you have a crap ton of flags.

I habitually run out of the common flags (right this moment I have no XP flags, no commander XP flags, and a grand total of 2 of the regular Free XP flag), and essentially never have special ones except in the rare occasions the game awards them for directives or special missions. This mindset that it's oh so easy to make Free XP is just wrong.

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40 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

"...buy a Premium ship..."

"...choosing to purchase a premium ship."

"...spending 50+ bucks on a ship..."

"...players that purchase premium ships."

I think I've found the source of dissatisfaction. I have about 35 premium boats ranging from Tier 2 to Tier 9 (soon Tier 10 with Moskva). I have only ever paid money for ONE boat, TEXAS, and even then, I was donating to the TEXAS fund and not giving WG cash. While I have my gripes with this company, I find my general satisfaction still buoyant.

-> Oh, and I generally put 19pt captains on my premiums so their experience can be used on any captain. <-

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55 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

you shouldn't need to invest more to make the XP usable.

Usable for what?  I'll tell you -> usable to progress up the tech tree !  The entire idea of progression is to learn the lower tier ship before graduating to the higher.  As far as I can tell, that is what you're really objecting to.

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57 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

If freexp becomes even easier to accrue the cost of free xp ships, modules, ship lines etc would also increase to compensate. Premiums already generate greater earnings than tech tree ships in commander xp, free xp, and credits. Another huge benefit is being able to plug in any commander without the need to retrain. This makes them excellent for training commanders.

Costs were increasing regardless of what was going on.  Recall how IX DD Black costed around 14k or 15k Steel, then when IX DD Neustrashimiy was put out, it was around 21k, like Steel grew on trees.  I think X BB Bourgogne is the most expensive Steel ship in the game about 30k.  She's been around a while.  Makes me wonder how much X BB Shikashima is going to cost with "inflation" in this game.

Fun stuff.

FreeXP costs had already gone up long before also, just for sh*ts and giggles by WG.  750k FreeXP for Missouri was deemed a lot by players.  Alaska bumped it up to what?  1 million?  Now we're at 2 million FreeXP ships.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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You already got what you paid for, what you knew you were getting when you paid for it. Why do you think you deserve more than everything you already agreed to?

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like said above most people really don't care about the fxp or even buy prem ship because of it, it's the other bonuses that matter !!

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54 minutes ago, Kartaugh said:

Free XP is only easy to accumulate if you have a crap ton of flags.

I habitually run out of the common flags (right this moment I have no XP flags, no commander XP flags, and a grand total of 2 of the regular Free XP flag), and essentially never have special ones except in the rare occasions the game awards them for directives or special missions. This mindset that it's oh so easy to make Free XP is just wrong.

You can already grind as much FXP as you want in any given day.  It doesn't need to get any easier.

Remember that currencies have to be balanced, the easier it is to obtain, the more things cost.  Devaluing a currency too much is how you end up paying 15 million widgets for a small item.

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Free XP wasn't supposed to be an item that was earnable in big chunks.  With flags and camos, it is possible now.  WG sees the players with millions of FXP and has adjusted the economy to account for it.  That hurts the average player more than the enthusiast.  We certainly don't need any premium ships with a baked in FXP earning potential to skew the economy further, to make it even harder for casual players to earn the top tier FXP ships.

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2 hours ago, Burnsy said:

Devaluing a currency too much is how you end up paying 15 million widgets for a small item

You mean like this?

50_Billionen_Mark_Stolberg_Eschweiler_001.jpg

 

Note that this is the European billion. This is a 50,000,000,000,000 Mark note.

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Ok let me clarify my concern a little better now I have a little more time.

My concern is that unlike non-premium ships all of that shop XP you earn is completely wasted unless you spend 1 doubloon per 25xp. So if I look at my Mass I have around 600k FreeXP. So to convert that over I would need 24k doubloons (about $99 dollars). So , again in my opinion, if you choose to support the game and buy a ship, you shouldn't have a stat that is completely worthless without sinking more money than the ship itself to just use.

I am fully aware there are uses for FreeXP and that it shouldn't be fast to acquire. Which is why I am suggesting they don't do a 1:1 match. I mean even a 5:1 would be much better than the current system.

The problem is one of greed. The only reason to not do it is because they can double dip us to death. We buy a premium ship, then have to buy more doubloons to make the ship xp mean anything. For me there is a big difference between buying a ship which takes time to model, balance, and release.... VS buying a hundred bucks in doubloons just to make the shipXP a useful currency on a premium ship.

Now this game isn't as pay to win as some of their other titles. That said I was playing with a little over a dozen friends that have all left the game mostly due to the greedy nature of the shop. There were other little things that contributed, but the major one was the way the shop operates.

In the end I think something needs to be done to address the issue. Even if it is just changing the rate at which they convert. Maybe premium ships could be 100 or even 200XP per Doubloon. Look at it as a quadratic equation, it is going to touch the X access twice. So you can either sell a very small amount of FreeXP conversions at a high cost or you can sell a much higher number of them at a lower cost. The profit margins stay the same, but you INCREASE player satisfaction and build a bigger/better community for it.

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22 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

Ok let me clarify my concern a little better now I have a little more time.

My concern is that unlike non-premium ships all of that shop XP you earn is completely wasted unless you spend 1 doubloon per 25xp. So if I look at my Mass I have around 600k FreeXP. So to convert that over I would need 24k doubloons (about $99 dollars). So , again in my opinion, if you choose to support the game and buy a ship, you shouldn't have a stat that is completely worthless without sinking more money than the ship itself to just use.

I am fully aware there are uses for FreeXP and that it shouldn't be fast to acquire. Which is why I am suggesting they don't do a 1:1 match. I mean even a 5:1 would be much better than the current system.

The problem is one of greed. The only reason to not do it is because they can double dip us to death. We buy a premium ship, then have to buy more doubloons to make the ship xp mean anything. For me there is a big difference between buying a ship which takes time to model, balance, and release.... VS buying a hundred bucks in doubloons just to make the shipXP a useful currency on a premium ship.

Now this game isn't as pay to win as some of their other titles. That said I was playing with a little over a dozen friends that have all left the game mostly due to the greedy nature of the shop. There were other little things that contributed, but the major one was the way the shop operates.

In the end I think something needs to be done to address the issue. Even if it is just changing the rate at which they convert. Maybe premium ships could be 100 or even 200XP per Doubloon. Look at it as a quadratic equation, it is going to touch the X access twice. So you can either sell a very small amount of FreeXP conversions at a high cost or you can sell a much higher number of them at a lower cost. The profit margins stay the same, but you INCREASE player satisfaction and build a bigger/better community for it.

XP earned on free line ships works the exact same way, once you earn the next ship in the line, the xp must be converted to do anything.

Premium ships in this game are designed to be credit earners and captain trainers.  That's what they do. 

Ship XP costs money to unlock, that's part of how WG makes their money. WG isn't going to change the whole design some 5+ years in.  Not to mention that the price of premium ships would need to increase, to account for the newly added value.  This would negatively impact premium ship sales.

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13 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

My concern is that unlike non-premium ships all of that shop XP you earn is completely wasted unless you spend 1 doubloon per 25xp.

That is true, and the case with all Elite ships, not just premiums.  People sometimes gripe about it, but that's the way it is.  Game has survived it so far.

 

15 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

The problem is one of greed.

Greed !?  Are you the pot or the kettle?

 

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21 minutes ago, Deathwaits84 said:

Even if it is just changing the rate at which they convert.

WeeGee is in make the money mode so things are geared towards that ... not making it easier on the player and less for them.

hell if really want pay to convert they do have sales every so often that makes is less of a bad idea  :Smile_veryhappy:

wouldn't putting that gold instead of convert fxp into prem time a better value?

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3 hours ago, Burnsy said:

You can already grind as much FXP as you want in any given day.  It doesn't need to get any easier.

Remember that currencies have to be balanced, the easier it is to obtain, the more things cost.  Devaluing a currency too much is how you end up paying 15 million widgets for a small item.

Have you tried grinding 2 million FXP when you're making 250-450 per match?

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4 minutes ago, Kartaugh said:

Have you tried grinding 2 million FXP when you're making 250-450 per match?

I have nearly every FXP ship that has ever been made available.  I am missing the Smalland currently but am at 1.7M saved up and will have it soon enough.
 

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2 minutes ago, Burnsy said:

I have nearly every FXP ship that has ever been made available.  I am missing the Smalland currently but am at 1.7M saved up and will have it soon enough.

Congrats. I have exactly two of them, Nelson and Alaska, and that took about 5 years.

P.S.: And something tells me you aren't earning 250-450 FXP per match, because you likely have obscene amounts of flags and camos.

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3 minutes ago, Kartaugh said:

Congrats. I have exactly two of them, Nelson and Alaska, and that took about 5 years.

I understand but you have comparatively few games in that 5 year span.   You can play the game as little or as much as you wish, but if you play it little, you can't also expect all the rewards.

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29 minutes ago, Kartaugh said:

 

P.S.: And something tells me you aren't earning 250-450 FXP per match, because you likely have obscene amounts of flags and camos.

I have purchased some permanent camos for my T10s, but I have never purchased one time use flags or camos.  I get them all from testing on the test server, watching twitch streams, ranked and clan battles, reading the news articles, forum competitions, game missions, game events and forum give away codes.

I have spent a good amount of money on this game in premium ships and premium time, for sure, but I do not purchase consumable ship items.

 

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