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DeadIyArT

So what happening with the T10 Italian DD Paolo Emilo?

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So it been almost a year since we hear any thing about it.  New line? premium T10 ship? Coal? steal? RB?

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1 hour ago, DeadIyArT said:

So it been almost a year since we hear any thing about it.  New line? premium T10 ship? Coal? steal? RB?

Maybe they're waiting for Italian DDs to come out before releasing it, though the wait might be painful.

While you're at it, think about the tier 6 Premium Italian DD, the Leone, that's never been released as well.  The CCs were calling it so bad that it'd have been a bad tier 5, let alone a bad tier 6.

 

Edited by Crucis

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If I were to hazard a guess, I think that WG is re-thinking what they want the gimmick to be for RM DDs, and they're sitting on the two ships until they have that ironed out. Or they just forgot about them. It's probably one of those two.

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From what I heard, it seems like the t10 was a proof of concept test for Italian DDs with SAP more than a premium. The t6 (and the t10 if it gets released or repurposed as a premium) likely won’t get released until closer to a DD line release for the Italian tree, now likely not until at least early to mid 2021 since the RU cruiser split, subs, and KM CVs would cover most of the remainder of this development year.

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^

I agree, it may be like radar for the Smalland was kind of a test bed for Radar on Pan-EU DDs. Didn't turn out like they wanted, so they changed the line but kept the Smalland radar. My guess it will be released closer to the IT DD line release.

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21 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Maybe they're waiting for Italian DDs to come out before releasing it, though the wait might be painful.

While you're at it, think about the tier 6 Premium Italian DD that's never been released as well.  The CCs were calling it so bad that it'd have been a bad tier 5, let alone a bad tier 6.

 

wasn't the tier 6 DD the Leone or something.  I want to say it was like the clemson but 2 tiers higher.  The only thing memorable about it was that it was crappy. 

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sap on a gunboat dd was seriously broken but they needed to actually test it to figure that out.

Edited by ITZ_ACE_BABY

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7 minutes ago, Frederick_The_Great said:

wasn't the tier 6 DD the Leone or something.  I want to say it was like the clemson but 2 tiers higher.  The only thing memorable about it was that it was crappy. 

Yes, it was the Leone.  I forgot to include that in my post above.

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People keep spouting this [edited] explain to me why Paolo Emilio has a premium ship name tag and is listed on the global wiki. Test ships don’t get this treatment. 

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11 hours ago, Crucis said:

The CCs were calling it so bad that it'd have been a bad tier 5, let alone a bad tier 6.

The only one I ever saw was in a battle I had in the Edinburgh. He was on my side, and we came back from way behind to clinch a heart-stopping victory. He was top of team. That seemed to indicate that the ship was capable of great things in the right hands, even if it wasn't every CC's cup of tea. Personally I think the game benefits from having a few ships with a very high skill floor, that even experienced players have to work hard with to do great things, and that doesn't match the public face that a lot of people want to put on their gaming when their output is overwhelmingly livestreamed.

OTOH if all you do is put out YT vids of the best, or written reports a la Mouse, it's easier to present your achievements with the ship in a positive light, however much you have to circle it with caveats.

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12 hours ago, DeadIyArT said:

So it been almost a year since we hear any thing about it.  New line? premium T10 ship? Coal? steal? RB?

Paolo Emilio is likely in limbo, probably because everything I saw about her was quite meh and she wasn't worth anything, so there're trying some different gimmicks to make her interesting. The other Italian DD, Leone, was first announced around Halloween 2018, making her the oldest WIP ship currently in the game, but is only remembered for being a T4.5 DD in a T6 world.

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1 hour ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

The only one I ever saw was in a battle I had in the Edinburgh. He was on my side, and we came back from way behind to clinch a heart-stopping victory. He was top of team. That seemed to indicate that the ship was capable of great things in the right hands, even if it wasn't every CC's cup of tea. Personally I think the game benefits from having a few ships with a very high skill floor, that even experienced players have to work hard with to do great things, and that doesn't match the public face that a lot of people want to put on their gaming when their output is overwhelmingly livestreamed.

OTOH if all you do is put out YT vids of the best, or written reports a la Mouse, it's easier to present your achievements with the ship in a positive light, however much you have to circle it with caveats.

Cthulhu, I don't recall ever seeing one in battle.  I might have, but I just don't remember.

Regardless, the problems with the Leone were two fold as I recall.  First, the shell arcs were super floaty. And second, the Leone had only a pair of dual torp launchers.  Literally only 4 torp tubes for the entire DD.  The thing with the shell arcs is that the Leone (and likely all Italian DDs) is likely to be relegated to being a gunboat with so few torp tubes.  But with such floaty shells, it's hard to see the thing being effective for the average player.  I suspect that the devs will have no choice but to lower the shell arcs to make these RM DDs playable as gunboats.  

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28 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Cthulhu, I don't recall ever seeing one in battle.  I might have, but I just don't remember.

Regardless, the problems with the Leone were two fold as I recall.  First, the shell arcs were super floaty. And second, the Leone had only a pair of dual torp launchers.  Literally only 4 torp tubes for the entire DD.  The thing with the shell arcs is that the Leone (and likely all Italian DDs) is likely to be relegated to being a gunboat with so few torp tubes.  But with such floaty shells, it's hard to see the thing being effective for the average player.  I suspect that the devs will have no choice but to lower the shell arcs to make these RM DDs playable as gunboats.  

Leone has [edited] arcs because she has old guns with WWI shells. The newer 120mm gun has considerably better arcs. Not as good as the Soviet 130mm but like the earlier 138mm gun or Lightning's guns. The main issue is that Italian destroyers don't have very many guns and they seem to(RoF numbers are always sort of questionable) fire fairly slowly.

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1 hour ago, Aetreus said:

Leone has [edited] arcs because she has old guns with WWI shells. The newer 120mm gun has considerably better arcs. Not as good as the Soviet 130mm but like the earlier 138mm gun or Lightning's guns. The main issue is that Italian destroyers don't have very many guns and they seem to(RoF numbers are always sort of questionable) fire fairly slowly.

We have 18” rifles that load near twice as fast as 15” rifles. Real world stats long ago left the playing field. 

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21 minutes ago, Sparviero said:

We have 18” rifles that load near twice as fast as 15” rifles. Real world stats long ago left the playing field. 

2.3 is nowhere near twice 1.8. Your attitude is completely unhelpful when it comes to Italian ships and I'd really like you to quit it. Reasonable and measured consideration is much more likely to be able to drum up support and interest in RM DD or BB and to get paid attention to by WG instead of vitrol and panic.

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9 minutes ago, Aetreus said:

2.3 is nowhere near twice 1.8. Your attitude is completely unhelpful when it comes to Italian ships and I'd really like you to quit it. Reasonable and measured consideration is much more likely to be able to drum up support and interest in RM DD or BB and to get paid attention to by WG instead of vitrol and panic.

Yet it is ok to shackle Italian ships to a standard not applied to any other? Make up your mind. 
 

You keep wanting a double standard where you get a benefit of the doubt after attacking me for no reason. Expect to be called out on things. 
 

You also seem blind that several options were politely brought up and ignored. Really quite the attitude you have on the subject. 

Edited by Sparviero

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Just now, Sparviero said:

Yet it is ok to shackle Italian ships to a standard not applied to any other? Make up your mind. 
 

You keep wanting a double standard where you get a benefit of the doubt after attacking me for no reason. Expect to be called out on things. 

I already pointed out that RoF figures aren't 100% firm and no, I'm not claiming that ships are and knowing that should be fixed to historical RoF. But with 6-7rpm as a baseline it is really hard to see how to tier any 120mm gun Italian DD above Tier 7. Even with boosting that up to 9rpm, even with adding SAP with high damage, even using a 6-gun ship. It just doesn't work. You have the Soviets with 12 rpm and 6 guns at Tier 8, or the Americans with 5 guns and 18 rpm, and there really is just no way to square that circle while remaining within the bounds of how far WG has stretched any ship's performance.

Even at Tier 7 it really rests on  the Navigatori to make it work, a 5-gun ship is just not quite enough. And that makes the tiering a bit annoying to start with. 

Now OFC as a whole line it's perfectly possible to solve this via judicious use of plans or wholescale fabrication if necessary, but it's still a serious issue when looking towards putting the ship in game.

I'm attacking you because in seemingly every thread about Italian ships you're there, throwing a fit about how WG is out to get them and is going to ruin everything, just you see, and it makes trying to have any sort of reasoned conversation a pain and puts me off contributing at all. I actually like Italian ships but it's often just not worth it.

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Dude I posted a meme and called mal. Arkey on a bad theory. Then I found a comment rather silly and said as such. To which it was onto a character attack on myself. I do not post on every thread if anything my posting volume is greatly reduced. Yet there you are trying to make me look like the big bad wolf.

We have pages upon of threads about German ships being purposefully nerfed. Please call out every single person who has a hard on for Lesta hates Germany.

Until then get off your high horse. You gleefully ignore  there have been many well thought out threads trying to address issues with Italian ships. Met with either complete silenzio stampa or responses that gross modeling errors will be maintained for balance purposes. 
 

If you want to discuss destroyer tech trees I have old posts and threads on that. However stop with the character assassinato every time you get hurt feelings. 

With that good day to all. 

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On a side note, I'm kinda bothered by the description of Paolo Emilo.  It says in WOWS Wiki, "Paolo Emilio was the predecessor of the Capitani Romani-class light cruisers."  I thought the Paolo Emilo WAS the cruiser or flotilla leader to begin with.  Not a DD.

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17 hours ago, Sparviero said:

 

this guys are something else, theyre balancing a coffin, on one shoulder, while dancing, and im pretty sure coffins arent light, especially if theres a person in it

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7 minutes ago, Airglide2 said:

On a side note, I'm kinda bothered by the description of Paolo Emilo.  It says in WOWS Wiki, "Paolo Emilio was the predecessor of the Capitani Romani-class light cruisers."  I thought the Paolo Emilo WAS the cruiser or flotilla leader to begin with.  Not a DD.

The ship is at least loosely based off an esploratori design but with a mosh mash of other design elements. Esploratore would generically equate to a destroyer leader for many other nations. Lesta is being a bit coy with the text. In this case we are talking about an eventual design study for scout ships for a fleet based in the AOI. 
 

imoo and I’m often attacked for this so form your own opinion.  The original life of this ship started as an ersatz Friant Tier III bridge to the Di Giussano before the decision to use a war prize. Which was a first for a tech tree to see a war prize. 

Edited by Sparviero

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2 minutes ago, tcbaker777 said:

this guys are something else, theyre balancing a coffin, on one shoulder, while dancing, and im pretty sure coffins arent light, especially if theres a person in it

No doubt mad props for the talent this shows. 

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6 minutes ago, Sparviero said:

The ship is at least loosely based off an esploratori design but with a mosh mash of other design elements. Esploratore would generically equate to a destroyer leader for many other nations. Lesta is being a bit coy with the text. 

Ok that makes sense.  Just googled the term and there pops up the Leone.  I remember this ship having a shell velocity equal to that of a Marblehead's torpedoes, as in "very very slow".  However I wonder if as compensation they'd boost the HE percentage.  Sort of a "professional marksman only" kind of premium.

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6 minutes ago, Airglide2 said:

Ok that makes sense.  Just googled the term and there pops up the Leone.  I remember this ship having a shell velocity equal to that of a Marblehead's torpedoes, as in "very very slow".  However I wonder if as compensation they'd boost the HE percentage.  Sort of a "professional marksman only" kind of premium.

For Leone the original rifle was the historical rifle with 750m/s shell. Which was later replaced with a 850 m/s shell. Still both high drag values. The ship still lacks post war pedestal mounts to clear angles of fire. Although with four batteries and a narrow beam it would have probably found a spot next to Wasa quickly. :cap_popcorn:
 

The 135/45 from the 30s was a rather conservative design. So sadly being cotton candy guns is correct.  There were higher performance variants planned for post war destroyers before going with nato standardization. So that might be available given the extension of timeline for other nations. I don’t know. 

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