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Col_Nasty

MASS 19pnt build?

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Just got him to 19pnts, I had a secondaries build with Manual but after getting that last point I saw this,

"don't go Manual Secondaries because the Mass and Georgia have a baked in accuracy bonus to their secondaries that nobody else gets while allowing both sides to fire. This gives you 4 points to play around with that's not tied up by AFT, BFT and AR."

Is this true??  

Currently I have  PT-PM-AR-BFT-SI-AFT and MFC  It's basically LWMs suggested build.

Edited by Col_Nasty

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That red highlighted wording isn't exactly correct. Massa secondaries are pretty accurate on their own, sure, but without MFCSA, the Massa secondaries kinda go kinda wonky. Otherwise, stick with the build that you have.

( This post was made by a Bismarck player who plays with full secondaries, so yeah, you can take my word for it )

:SerB:

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2 minutes ago, Shrayes_Bhagavatula said:

That red highlighted wording isn't exactly correct. Massa secondaries are pretty accurate on their own, sure, but without MFCSA, the Massa secondaries kinda go kinda wonky. Otherwise, stick with the build that you have.

( This post was made by a Bismarck player who plays with full secondaries, so yeah, you can take my word for it )

:SerB:

Thanx  Serb,  but I have an extra point left over.   Looking for the best way to respec to my advantage and use it.

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3 minutes ago, BarneyStyle said:

Hey Barney!  Funny that is a little different than the one in the review she did here. She emphasized SI to take advantage of the heal she has but not on her site.   Both are good seconds builds though.  FP is looking better to me as well as EM Thnx

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3 minutes ago, Col_Nasty said:

Thanx  Serb,  but I have an extra point left over.   Looking for the best way to respec to my advantage and use it.

Here's the build I run on my Bismarck

PM , AR , SI , AFT , MFCSA , BOS, JoAT

This works quite effectively, and uses all 19 points. 

:SerB:

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10 minutes ago, Col_Nasty said:

Just got him to 19pnts, I had a secondaries build with Manual but after getting that last point I saw this,

"don't go Manual Secondaries because the Mass and Georgia have a baked in accuracy bonus to their secondaries that nobody else gets while allowing both sides to fire. This gives you 4 points to play around with that's not tied up by AFT, BFT and AR."

Is this true??  

Currently I have  PT-PM-AR-BFT-SI-AFT and MFC  It's basically LWMs suggested build.

The way I understand it, Mass and Georgia have 40% built in secondary dispersion. Makes manual secondaries a take or leave it option compared to the germans. I personally don't use it on my mass and don't plan on it as my caption skills grow, I plan on having FP and then CE in the future. I don't see a significant difference between my secondary damage vs my Bismark which is manual secondaries. 

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1 minute ago, Col_Nasty said:

Hey Barney!  Funny that is a little different than the one in the review she did here. She emphasized SI to take advantage of the heal she has but not on her site.   Both are good seconds builds though.  FP is looking better to me as well as EM Thnx

Sup man, I use this build on GK as well, really helps with fires.  max fun build.  

The SI is a good option too, but I feel I’m set on fire so much once I tried this build my survivability went way up.  Massa has basically good everything except repair and MB dispersion.  So premium modules are a must.  That extra heal is marginal when in a scrap, but not getting set on fire can save you too.  User preference.

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My personal Secondary build:

Expert Loader, Adrenaline Rush, Basic Fire Training, Manual Fire Control, Expert Marksman, Demolition Expert, Advanced Fire Training

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I have a PM-PT-AR-BFT-AFT-MFCSA and I have now gone FP rather than IFHE (since the IFHE nerf).

I keep the AP loaded for the bigger fish, the secondaries assist my DDs/CLs/CAs with the smaller fish - If I need to use HE the fire chance is still good.

For me the smaller cruisers (fire-spitters) tend to keep their distance, so although IFHE secondaries could pen them (26mm or below), it's actually getting close enough to do so (talking same tier).

As the heavy cruisers have around 27mm armour on the centre section that the MFCSA targets - it just seemed wiser to swap the IFHE for FP (of course the old 30% value of IFHE would pen the 27mm). :Smile_honoring:

Also, I didn't use Premium consumables (except for Operations) so the coming change to those all being Premium helps too (for me it is like I have chosen SI)!

Edited by _WaveRider_

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5 hours ago, Col_Nasty said:

Just got him to 19pnts, I had a secondaries build with Manual but after getting that last point I saw this,

"don't go Manual Secondaries because the Mass and Georgia have a baked in accuracy bonus to their secondaries that nobody else gets while allowing both sides to fire. This gives you 4 points to play around with that's not tied up by AFT, BFT and AR."

Is this true??  

Currently I have  PT-PM-AR-BFT-SI-AFT and MFC  It's basically LWMs suggested build.

Even if the red part is true...adding those skills will still improve on what it has as a base.

Where did LWM suggest the last point go?

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All CLs and dakka DDs thank those of you who do not use FP or BOS. 

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6 hours ago, Col_Nasty said:

Just got him to 19pnts, I had a secondaries build with Manual but after getting that last point I saw this,

"don't go Manual Secondaries because the Mass and Georgia have a baked in accuracy bonus to their secondaries that nobody else gets while allowing both sides to fire. This gives you 4 points to play around with that's not tied up by AFT, BFT and AR."

Is this true??  

Currently I have  PT-PM-AR-BFT-SI-AFT and MFC  It's basically LWMs suggested build.

As a note...MFC requires a high level of situational awareness to get the most benefit from it.

If you are distracted by aiming/dodging/etc & not locking on targets as soon as they are spotted or as soon as the last target dies then all the other 2ndary skills are being wasted.

There is a bonus just for locking on a target even w/out MFC (not the awesome 60% of course but still something...used to know exact but forget as I haven't played in awhile) & even if you don't lock a target your 2ndaries will start firing (on both sides of the ship) if anything comes into/gets detected w/in range.

If you do keep up on them than by all means keep up w/them because 60% dispersion bonus w/all those 2ndaries is awesome but if you find yourself often thinking, "damn...I wish I would have remembered to lock on a target" then it's best (for now) to swap it out for other skills & practice remembering to lock on targets until it becomes 2nd(ary) nature (-: see what I did there :-). Then when you switch back later you will (theoretically anyway...YMMV) see a major difference.

As a note...this is all theoretical as I never had the situational awareness to make MFC work for me...but have seen many posts of awesome results from those that have.

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image.thumb.png.fbe580b9c3118a1df3bd465642e9f61f.png

BFT isn't worth three points. It's a absolutely minuscule buff of about 8 shots in a minute extra from the 5 guns per side. BFT is only good in secondary builds at T9 & t10 where you can also get the additional reload buff module in Slot 6.

  1. Priority Target
  2. Expert Marksman
  3. Superintendent
  4. Advanced Firing Training
  5. Manual Secondaries
  6. Fire Prevention
  7. Preventative Maintenance (or Expert Loader if that's your thing).

There's a patch coming up that removes the whole "buying premium consumables", but I have no idea when that is. If that happens you might want to consider swapping out Superintendent for Basics Of Survivability, dropping fires down below 35 seconds and saving yourself 1,110 HP if you have to tank a fire the whole way.

Edited by macktkau2
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7 hours ago, macktkau2 said:

image.thumb.png.fbe580b9c3118a1df3bd465642e9f61f.png

BFT isn't worth three points. It's a absolutely minuscule buff of about 8 shots in a minute extra from the 5 guns per side. BFT is only good in secondary builds at T9 & t10 where you can also get the additional reload buff module in Slot 6.

  1. Priority Target
  2. Expert Marksman
  3. Superintendent
  4. Advanced Firing Training
  5. Manual Secondaries
  6. Fire Prevention
  7. Preventative Maintenance (or Expert Loader if that's your thing).

There's a patch coming up that removes the whole "buying premium consumables", but I have no idea when that is. If that happens you might want to consider swapping out Superintendent for Basics Of Survivability, dropping fires down below 35 seconds and saving yourself 1,110 HP if you have to tank a fire the whole way.

Another possible secondary build?    image.thumb.png.a01b683c2bc6bf37c6d45ed35bd85d8f.png

Edited by shadowsrmine

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10 hours ago, macktkau2 said:

If you don't take fire prevention you're going to get burnt to a crisp.

Dear Sir,

shhhh...

Respectfully,                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    HE Spammers

Edited by Pugilistic
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I take manual fire control for secondaries because it puts a lot more concentrated secondary fire on a ship. Using this skill, the odds of my sinking a DD while it is spotted vastly increase. This usually won't happen without the skill and all that you are doing by letting a DD get away with low health is to make its reloads faster if it has AR, as it should. Test this for yourself in the Training Room. 

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On 4/26/2020 at 3:12 PM, BarneyStyle said:

My build is close to this; I run SI and CE instead of BFT and FP. That extra heal comes in handy quite often, because of the short consumable cooldown, and helps offset the lack of FP. CE is great on any ship, Mass gets fairly respectable concealment with it.

Honestly, the two mandatory things for Mass are ManSec and AFT (without them you might as well play NC or AL), everything else comes down to to your preferences.

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On 4/27/2020 at 8:15 AM, macktkau2 said:

If you don't take fire prevention you're going to get burnt to a crisp.

@macktkau2   I find you burn pretty much as fast whether you take fire prevention or not...............................Most of the time because half of the Red Team have focus fired you to oblivion as in fact my G.Kurfurst  Had 'Fire Prevention'  and they still burned burned down all the time I'm using this build now to see if that works betterimage.png.a7a4a72fc93f645fe74b2898c2eef746.png

Edited by shadowsrmine
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