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Tired of Some Peoples Stock Troll Answer To Weak Premiums

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No I Don't expect a Better premium than than the tech tree version or even than a premium ship that's already in game,Example compare the  X Puerto Rico to the IX Alaska, When a tier IX is That Much Better Than the tier X!  I'll give another example  compare VIII Montpelier to VIII Cleveland  yes Montpelier is weaker than Cleveland  is Montpelier trash compared to Cleveland? No it's not! And yet the trolls answer is that we're expecting a Super Ship Premium compared to the tech tree version.Another example compare the tier VII Scharnhorst  to upcoming VIII Odin or VIII Bismark to the VIII Odin.So the question is it too much to expect the premium to not be trash when compared to the tech tree version? Well the Trolls 👺 Say it is

 

 

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For some ship classes, I haven't seen a Krespy kreame type/level of premium ship at high tiers at all.

Maybe after release with IFHE do some premiums become useless. Not at release.

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Essentially the thinking goes that a subpar ship can get buffed (think Prinz Eugen getting a heal) but you can't nerf a true premium. Nikolai, Guilio Cesare, and Kutuzov have long been probematic, but can't be changed. Remember the whinging when they tried to fix GC? Better safe than sorry.

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I'll give another example VIII Z-23 https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Z-23

533 mm Vierling2 х 4 pcs.
Rate of Fire0.67 shots/min.
Reload Time90 sec.
Rotation Speed25 deg./sec.
180 Degree Turn Time7.2 sec.
TorpedoG7 Steinbarsch 
Maximum Damage14,400 
Torpedo Speed65 knot
Torpedo Range8.49 km

  to the upcoming https://www.wows-gamer-blog.com/2020/04/z-35-german-tier-ix-premium-destroyer.html?spref=fb&fbclid=IwAR28fSrZ8uGFfeod2XcoDgms2z2y-0YSkRJyoifuWKJ_dFv3PmqdKMMOACs, Range 6 kms?image.png.c1c11e30d8a8d8f2ced821737259c2b5.png

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15 minutes ago, pewpewpew42 said:

Essentially the thinking goes that a subpar ship can get buffed (think Prinz Eugen getting a heal) but you can't nerf a true premium. Nikolai, Guilio Cesare, and Kutuzov have long been probematic, but can't be changed. Remember the whinging when they tried to fix GC? Better safe than sorry.

And Kutuzov was never OP no matter what the Trolls 👺say

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WG have to be careful with releases due to the double standards the community has placed on them. Remember the GC was not allowed to be changed because waaaah! It's my Premium ship!

Yet currently people are asking for changes to the Indy in the form of a buff.

 

Double standards - so until the community grow up, WG will release on the side of caution. Why? Because the community have shown whereas they will not stand for a change to their Premium (nerf); they will also demand a change to their Premium (buff). :Smile_teethhappy: 

All of you who take this stance, brought it on yourselves.

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I'm not sure what you're saying here? Who's defending Puerto Rico, Montpelier, Odin, or Agir? I've seen no one saying they're too strong, or fine as is. (Well maybe Montpelier, I don't think most people knows she exists?)

Your rant doesn't really seem to have much basis.

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15 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

I'm not sure what you're saying here? Who's defending Puerto Rico, Montpelier, Odin, or Agir? I've seen no one saying they're too strong, or fine as is. (Well maybe Montpelier, I don't think most people knows she exists?)

Your rant doesn't really seem to have much basis.

No I'm not saying anyone is saying their Too Strong if anything their Too Weak!  Or perhaps your one of the👺?Not sure how WG  expects anyone to buy this trash

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Better to err on the side of premiums being a little bit weak rather than too strong, because WG cannot or will not nerf premiums.

In the absence of perfect balance, tech tree ships can be good, bad, or average. This should apply to premiums as well but with extra caution on the top end because of the non-nerf policy.

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Just now, shadowsrmine said:

No I'm not saying anyone is saying their Too Strong if anything their Too Weak!  Or perhaps your one of the👺?

Yes, and everyone pretty much admits that? What's the problem?

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12 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

Yes, and everyone pretty much admits that? What's the problem?

It sounds that if you don't agree, you'll be one of those trolls.

I'm not sure what triggered the rant, but I don't think Shadowsrmine is looking for anything but agreement(?)

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33 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

Yes, and everyone pretty much admits that? What's the problem?

Well if Odin,Agir,Z-35 go thru as is I don't see how WG giphy.gifExpects to sell many! I know I'm not buying any of them if they go thru as shown and I expect many others will feel the same.Truth to tell if they keep on the they have I and many others will leave and let you wallet warriors with more money than sense who are happy throw your money at them no matter what trash they show you

Edited by shadowsrmine

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41 minutes ago, _WaveRider_ said:

WG have to be careful with releases due to the double standards the community has placed on them. Remember the GC was not allowed to be changed because waaaah! It's my Premium ship!

Yet currently people are asking for changes to the Indy in the form of a buff.

 

Double standards - so until the community grow up, WG will release on the side of caution. Why? Because the community have shown whereas they will not stand for a change to their Premium (nerf); they will also demand a change to their Premium (buff). :Smile_teethhappy: 

All of you who take this stance, brought it on yourselves.

I’m not 100% in agreement with you about the double standards quite simply because many of the premiums were bought with real money not in game credits. The forum explodes every time a tech tree ship gets nerfed so why should people not complain about a premium ship being nerfed regardless if it’s seen by some as OP or not! Everybody has the chance to buy it. It’s up to the individual whether they want to buy or can afford too ... choices are made by each and everyone one of us.

I have many premiums but if it’s nerfed it’s just the way it is and part of the natural game progression same as tech tier ships ... I paid me money on a pixel ship and if it’s nerfed, so be it!

Many premiums and tech tree ships have suffered from power creep and I’d hope one day WG will look at that and make adjustments to make them relevant again but if not, so be it! Natural game progression. 

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1 hour ago, Navalpride33 said:

For some ship classes, I haven't seen a Krespy kreame type/level of premium ship at high tiers at all.

Maybe after release with IFHE do some premiums become useless. Not at release.

The Smolensk is the Krispy Kreme on steroids plus smoke.

56 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

And Kutuzov was never OP no matter what the Trolls 👺say

The Kutuzov like the Smolensk was over powered in the hands of better than average players but unlike the Smolensk it still performed well in the hands of average players.

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7 minutes ago, Bravo4zero said:

I’m not 100% in agreement with you about the double standards quite simply because many of the premiums were bought with real money not in game credits. The forum explodes every time a tech tree ship gets nerfed so why should people not complain about a premium ship being nerfed regardless if it’s seen by some as OP or not! Everybody has the chance to buy it. It’s up to the individual whether they want to buy or can afford too ... choices are made by each and everyone one of us.

Absolutely. And that choice should be made with the knowledge that you do not own anything you buy, nor do you have any rights to it being changed.

Now WG will obviously not want to annoy the player base, but people will not think of balance if it is a ship that benefits them - they think of themselves much of the time. You literally get people arguing for a change to a Premium for balance (if a buff), but will scream blue murder if you want to change something like the GC that beats most if not all the BBs stats wise from the tier above.

 

11 minutes ago, Bravo4zero said:

I have many premiums but if it’s nerfed it’s just the way it is and part of the natural game progression same as tech tier ships ... I paid me money on a pixel ship and if it’s nerfed, so be it!

Many premiums and tech tree ships have suffered from power creep and I’d hope one day WG will look at that and make adjustments to make them relevant again but if not, so be it! Natural game progression. 

Again, totally agree. In the height of the Belfast argument I was quite happy for WG to remove the radar and either add the Fiji torps or the Heal - it would have still had the HE (and the IFHE when the IFHE was better for 152mm).

 

I would far prefer WG to make changes to individual ships rather than these Global changes, changes that have really been brought about by the communities double standard - WG can't tweak individual Premium ships (nerf), so  they have to do it by other means. Unfortunately this means at times other ships get thrown under the bus like the Atlanta. :Smile_honoring:

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1 hour ago, shadowsrmine said:

I'll give another example VIII Z-23 https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Z-23

533 mm Vierling2 х 4 pcs.
Rate of Fire0.67 shots/min.
Reload Time90 sec.
Rotation Speed25 deg./sec.
180 Degree Turn Time7.2 sec.
TorpedoG7 Steinbarsch 
Maximum Damage14,400 
Torpedo Speed65 knot
Torpedo Range8.49 km

  to the upcoming https://www.wows-gamer-blog.com/2020/04/z-35-german-tier-ix-premium-destroyer.html?spref=fb&fbclid=IwAR28fSrZ8uGFfeod2XcoDgms2z2y-0YSkRJyoifuWKJ_dFv3PmqdKMMOACs, Range 6 kms?image.png.c1c11e30d8a8d8f2ced821737259c2b5.png

The Z35 is a tier 8 DD not a tier 9 one.  

However, it seems utterly ridiculous to have a DD with 6 km torps at tier 8, with the possible exception of some super hardcore gunboats (i.e. the Khaba).  Frankly though, the Z-35 just doesn't look like a DD that deserves to get stuck with 6 km torps (unless perhaps she has a second option for her torps, like the Sims does).

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1 hour ago, pewpewpew42 said:

Essentially the thinking goes that a subpar ship can get buffed (think Prinz Eugen getting a heal) but you can't nerf a true premium. Nikolai, Guilio Cesare, and Kutuzov have long been probematic, but can't be changed. Remember the whinging when they tried to fix GC? Better safe than sorry.

:Smile_great:

50 minutes ago, Dr_Powderfinger said:

Better to err on the side of premiums being a little bit weak rather than too strong, because WG cannot or will not nerf premiums.

In the absence of perfect balance, tech tree ships can be good, bad, or average. This should apply to premiums as well but with extra caution on the top end because of the non-nerf policy.

:Smile_great:And in answer to the above do you Really Believe WG say six months after said premium had been out if they were allowed they wouldn't nerf it to make the New And Improved Premium Look and Sell Better$$$ after recent and past behavior

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There's been a lot of meh ships going into latter half of 2019 and continuing into 2020.

 

Poltava, Indomitable, Cheshire, etc.

Then there's also a lot of very meh-tastic tech tree ship lines ever since the RU BB Line came out.

 

It's not just Premiums.  Even the new lines have been pretty "bleh."

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4 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

There's been a lot of meh ships going into latter half of 2019 and continuing into 2020.

 

Poltava, Indomitable, Cheshire, etc.

Then there's also a lot of very meh-tastic tech tree ship lines ever since the RU BB Line came out.

 

It's not just Premiums.  Even the new lines have been pretty "bleh."

:Smile_great:

18 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

:Smile_great:

:Smile_great:And in answer to the above do you Really Believe WG say six months after said premium had been out if they were allowed they wouldn't nerf it to make the New And Improved Premium Look and Sell Better$$$ after recent and past behavior

:Smile_great:As I said and there's an appropriate saying image.thumb.png.d6925035b22f8498117b6eb27bbfdfaa.png

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WG  Has found their money tree giphy.gifAnd plan to shake and strip it till it's dead just like they did with WOT's

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2 hours ago, AJTP89 said:

I'm not sure what you're saying here? Who's defending Puerto Rico, Montpelier, Odin, or Agir? I've seen no one saying they're too strong, or fine as is. (Well maybe Montpelier, I don't think most people knows she exists?)

Your rant doesn't really seem to have much basis.


2 hours ago, Dr_Powderfinger said:

Better to err on the side of premiums being a little bit weak rather than too strong, because WG cannot or will not nerf premiums.

In the absence of perfect balance, tech tree ships can be good, bad, or average. This should apply to premiums as well but with extra caution on the top end because of the non-nerf policy.


2 hours ago, AJTP89 said:

Yes, and everyone pretty much admits that? What's the problem?


2 hours ago, _WaveRider_ said:

It sounds that if you don't agree, you'll be one of those trolls.

I'm not sure what triggered the rant, but I don't think Shadowsrmine is looking for anything but agreement(?)


54 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

:Smile_great:

:Smile_great:As I said and there's an appropriate saying image.thumb.png.d6925035b22f8498117b6eb27bbfdfaa.png


43 minutes ago, shadowsrmine said:

WG  Has found their money tree giphy.gifAnd plan to shake and strip it till it's dead just like they did with WOT's

Sounds like shadows pretty much on target here not that I expect any of the people quoted to see or acknowledge that and there's an appropriate quote for that,There's none so blind as those that will not see

Edited by baccerman
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3 hours ago, BrushWolf said:

The Smolensk is the Krispy Kreme on steroids plus smoke.

The Kutuzov like the Smolensk was over powered in the hands of better than average players but unlike the Smolensk it still performed well in the hands of average players.

So was the Pepsicola was that overpowered too?lol

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4 hours ago, _WaveRider_ said:

WG have to be careful with releases due to the double standards the community has placed on them. Remember the GC was not allowed to be changed because waaaah! It's my Premium ship!

Yet currently people are asking for changes to the Indy in the form of a buff.

 

Double standards - so until the community grow up, WG will release on the side of caution. Why? Because the community have shown whereas they will not stand for a change to their Premium (nerf); they will also demand a change to their Premium (buff). :Smile_teethhappy: 

All of you who take this stance, brought it on yourselves.

 

its not about growing up... it's about weegee releasing new better carrots and power creeping premium vehicles (and old tech tree stuff, its not just premiums that suffer) .. not saying any you have mentioned qualify as I am not familiar with those particular ships, but I am familiar with how weegee causes these problems for themselves.

The next premium has to be better than the last one or people won't buy them, at the same time they have to deal with the vocalites that will scream OP p2w if they come close to making that same premium a little too good...   which makes sense..  i imagine they enjoy 'balans' in their mobile and console games where they don't have a forum to oversee their work...

 

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2 hours ago, baccerman said:





Sounds like shadows pretty much on target here not that I expect any of the people quoted to see or acknowledge that and there's an appropriate quote for that,There's none so blind as those that will not see

I remembered how last time I chatted with Shadow, other members of BASIN joined in to support. I think it was lovely (although I think there was 2 or 3 last time, are the others unable to make it?).

So what part have I not seen then?

What part of what I said isn't true; what part isn't this a story of someone reaping what they took part in sowing?

Edited by _WaveRider_
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1 minute ago, SKurj said:

 

its not about growing up... it's about weegee releasing new better carrots and power creeping premium vehicles (and old tech tree stuff, its not just premiums that suffer) .. not saying any you have mentioned qualify as I am not familiar with those particular ships, but I am familiar with how weegee causes these problems for themselves.

The next premium has to be better than the last one or people won't buy them, at the same time they have to deal with the vocalites that will scream OP p2w if they come close to making that same premium a little too good...   which makes sense..  i imagine they enjoy 'balans' in their mobile and console games where they don't have a forum to oversee their work...

 

If you read what I said you will realise you have stated similar to what I had:

1.  I don't agree that every new premium is weak - take a look at the last one (Mainz). However, because of the uproar from the community if WG even think about nerfing a premium - they have to be cautious.

2. It is about growing up. Some people screamed about leaving the game or never buying a ship again, if WG moved the GC. All WG did was listened and changed the way they release ships.

As already stated, not weak, but certainly not a string of strong releases either. This is the choice the community argued for; for ships that WG will not nerf.

3. It is indeed a tightrope WG has to walk, releasing something people will want to buy, yet something they will not need to nerf in future...why? Because they can't nerf, 'some' of the community screamed against it.

4. I have no love for many of the recent decisions WG have made. I also agree that they  could look at individual ships that may have been power crept.

 

But on the release of Premium ships - well the community spoke and stated WG can only change Premium ships one way - by a buff.

So they ensure a Premium ship released isn't going to be one they want to nerf! If I remember, Shadowsrmine was one that argued against a nerf to the GC - I say stop crying, you got what you asked for, Premiums WG won't nerf.

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