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Sabot_100

Invulnerable Forts?

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Had a couple of Killer Whale games lately where I am shooting heavy cruiser AP at the forts and getting no damage. Seems like this last for a couple of salvos, then goes back to normal with hits causing damage. It may occur again with the next fort. Even had my reliable IFHE hits do no damage. My experience says I should be chunking the forts big time with each salvo. Visually the shells are landing on the fort. Anyone else notice this?

Edited by Sabot_100
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29 minutes ago, Sabot_100 said:

Had a couple of Killer Whale games lately where I am shooting heavy cruiser AP at the forts and getting no damage. Seems like this last for a couple of salvos, then goes back to normal with hits causing damage. It may occur again with the next fort. Even had my reliable IFHE hits do no damage. My experience says I should be chunking the forts big time with each salvo. Visually the shells are landing on the fort. Anyone else notice this?

Sabot, are you in a legitimate heavy cruiser or are you calling a light cruiser a "CA"?  In the case of shooting AP at forts in operations, it makes a big difference.  The AP from 8" CA guns will easily pen forts, while the AP from smaller CL guns often will not.  (And of course, BB AP will crush forts in no time flat.)

 

 

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AP from any CA will destroy forts just like BBs do,

CL guns (e.g. 152mm) need HE up to 7 km or so, then AP becomes a little more effective.

Italian SAP does absolutely nothing to forts. That is actually a bug, as they don't register damage. Zero.

DD-size guns are pitiful against frost, esp from a  distance.

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4 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Sabot, are you in a legitimate heavy cruiser or are you calling a light cruiser a "CA"?  In the case of shooting AP at forts in operations, it makes a big difference.  The AP from 8" CA guns will easily pen forts, while the AP from smaller CL guns often will not.  (And of course, BB AP will crush forts in no time flat.)

Can confirm. Belfast trying to chunk that stupid fort by the transports, getting shot up by that Fletcher disguised as a Nicholas, and watching AP or HE seemingly not do anything.

Almost wish I could use The Foreign Minister. At least with that I could shoot the forts from further away.

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13 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Sabot, are you in a legitimate heavy cruiser or are you calling a light cruiser a "CA"?

Legitimate CA's. Even my Molotov has had no problem penning forts at the spawn point. Just had some recent games where I shoot and expect 8k+ damage and get nothing. For light cruisers I normally only shoot IFHE, which as always been good for some damage. Lately I've seen some no damage salvos with them too. Maybe its just me. Maybe the game doesn't have the shells landing where it is showing me.

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10 minutes ago, alexf24 said:

Italian SAP does absolutely nothing to forts. That is actually a bug, as they don't register damage. Zero.

This was what I was wondering if the program sometimes gave non-SAP rounds zero damage too. Next time I have a game where this happens, I'll have to look at the replay.

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32 minutes ago, alexf24 said:

AP from any CA will destroy forts just like BBs do,

CL guns (e.g. 152mm) need HE up to 7 km or so, then AP becomes a little more effective.

Italian SAP does absolutely nothing to forts. That is actually a bug, as they don't register damage. Zero.

DD-size guns are pitiful against frost, esp from a  distance.

Maybe DD sized guns need to use incendiary rounds for melt that frost, cuz everyone knows how hard ice is.  :Smile_trollface:

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27 minutes ago, Sabot_100 said:

Legitimate CA's. Even my Molotov has had no problem penning forts at the spawn point. Just had some recent games where I shoot and expect 8k+ damage and get nothing. For light cruisers I normally only shoot IFHE, which as always been good for some damage. Lately I've seen some no damage salvos with them too. Maybe its just me. Maybe the game doesn't have the shells landing where it is showing me.

Hmmm.  I guess I haven't noticed this.  But to be fair, I've only been playing my Swedish DD in Killer Whale this past week, grinding out the camo mission.

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I've seen this, I wondered why the ITN line had so much trouble here. Forts have seemed problematic, imho. Raised the issue once before.

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Yeah, I have run AZ and Pensy in Killer Whale and noticed that overall those runs weren't producing the damage numbers they have in the past. It's only 4 runs though, so not a great sample size.  Still watch 8" & 14" AP all the way into the forts for little to no damage was, unexpected. Dunkek AP was also lackluster, but that was mostly due to froggy dispersion.  I still marvel at how the forts can 'disappear' after being sighted, opening fire, and then going full Keyser Soze for a few seconds.

 

 

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Part of the problem with this glitch is that it seems random. Doesn't happen every game, doesn't last the whole game. In one of my recent examples, my AP shots did not hurt the fort but neither did the volleys from several other teamates (one of which was a DD so...) as I watched their rounds hit the fort and the health bar did not move. Then all of a sudden, shots started doing damage, and the fort succumbed to all the incoming fire.

MAY have had the same glitch vs KW ships where it sure looked like I hit the target but registered no hits or damage. Often harder to confirm the shells really did land on the ship. I have been known to whiff well aimed salvos on occasion  due to RNG.

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3 hours ago, alexf24 said:

Italian SAP does absolutely nothing to forts. That is actually a bug, as they don't register damage. Zero.

Does seem like SAP should be about as effective as IFHE (minus the fire chance). Is WG looking to fix it or is it a OP problem so has a priority below the "radar sees thru islands" issue.

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It seems they will only spend dev time nerfing the Ops economy, not fixing actual issues.

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1 hour ago, SkullCowboy_60 said:

It seems they will only spend dev time nerfing the Ops economy, not fixing actual issues.

1359955957_developerbugs.gif.1a09740fe90458d5b2cc5418f43cb0db.gif

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7 hours ago, Sabot_100 said:

Part of the problem with this glitch is that it seems random. Doesn't happen every game, doesn't last the whole game. In one of my recent examples, my AP shots did not hurt the fort but neither did the volleys from several other teamates (one of which was a DD so...) as I watched their rounds hit the fort and the health bar did not move. Then all of a sudden, shots started doing damage, and the fort succumbed to all the incoming fire.

MAY have had the same glitch vs KW ships where it sure looked like I hit the target but registered no hits or damage. Often harder to confirm the shells really did land on the ship. I have been known to whiff well aimed salvos on occasion  due to RNG.

Can confirm.  Happen to me in a game with a Molotov.  Not every hit registered when shooting a Fort and doesn't happen every game.  Definitely there's a bug.

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Working as intended comrades.
WG hates P vs E and is trying to make people leave.

They aren't that stupid, they can fix it, it's clearly working as they wished it to.

I too noticed that forts and even on shore installations I used to kill with one salvo, are now extremely hard to kill.

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Played Nurn and Dallas last couple of nights in KW. Fired HE, had no issues. Saw other ships including BB and heavy cruisers either one-shot them or finish them from mid health with single salvoes.

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17 hours ago, alexf24 said:

AP from any CA will destroy forts just like BBs do,

CL guns (e.g. 152mm) need HE up to 7 km or so, then AP becomes a little more effective.

Italian SAP does absolutely nothing to forts. That is actually a bug, as they don't register damage. Zero.

DD-size guns are pitiful against frost, esp from a  distance.

This was a fun discovery when that line came out.  Another reason to not like them for PVE.

Considering how long that line has been out now, it's probably a feature.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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3 hours ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

Played Nurn and Dallas last couple of nights in KW. Fired HE, had no issues. Saw other ships including BB and heavy cruisers either one-shot them or finish them from mid health with single salvoes.

Yup. That's the problem in finding this glitch. Most of the time things are normal. That's how I know my shots from certain ranges should be blapping the forts. I've done it many times before with the same ships, same guns, same ranges. Lately, I occasionally will fire that well aimed salvo and wait for the Earth Shattering Kaboom and get nothing. Now either that damn rabbit stole the Q-36 detonator again or something is screwy with the program.

Edited by Sabot_100

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1 hour ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Another reason to not like them for PVE.

SAP is great for taking out DDs and CLs. Not so much for the BBs and forts. AP (usually) works on the forts so it just the BBs that are a problem.

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2 hours ago, Sabot_100 said:

SAP is great for taking out DDs and CLs. Not so much for the BBs and forts. AP (usually) works on the forts so it just the BBs that are a problem.

It's no good to me.  If I'm going to play a CA, I'll just use any other one with normal shells that work against all target types and armor profiles.

I have the Perma-Camo to all the tech tree Tier X Cruisers, to include even the new Goliath... Except Venezia.

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12 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's no good to me.  If I'm going to play a CA, I'll just use any other one with normal shells that work against all target types and armor profiles.

Yeah, even if SAP isn't too much of a penalty, it does mean there is almost always a better choice, a better tool out there. I haven't found the smoke gimmick to be all that useful as it requires a friendly spotter and requires there be no red ships inside 8K.

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In regard to killer whale fort,     with 152mm gun,    different nation have different range where AP can pen.     I find budyonny can pen the furthest at bit over 10km,  while  nurnberg is down about 6km.   Otherwise, use HE  

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On 4/1/2020 at 12:05 PM, centarina said:

In regard to killer whale fort,     with 152mm gun,    different nation have different range where AP can pen.

Kinda strange that 152 AP won't hurt the fort but IFHE will nail them at all ranges. 180mm and up AP seems to work at all ranges. Except when you have the problem in my OP where the game just says NO.

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