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CRZY_TRAIN

Carrier frustration BOTH ways

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As a ship (not a carrier), I cant stand them I feel it ruins the game they are to strong. That is frustration one but nevermind.

The second part is me being a carrier capt which OK i got a Furious (it was given to me), which I kinka stink at (mine sure dont seem strong).  I use it very little and when I do, i try to spot more then abuse people in ships, ill take a shot and leave them alone and move on, unless they are coming for my carrier.  Here is what seems screwy to me...  I was low tier T6 in a T8 battle I did fair but we lost and should not have lost here is why.  We had good ships left, a DD snuck up the river and set smoke. our guys were is great position to at least reset the cap.. well I flew my planes over the smoke several times and did not spot that ship.  His AA hitting the hell out my planes and still no spot.  Our ships firing into smoke nothing hit him, nothing (me) could spot him, 2 or 3 squadrens.  I mean what the heck....  its so stupid to me... they can fire and knock my planes down, cap and win while sitting right there.   It seems well... NOT GOOD for the game IMO.    anyways any good feedback is welcome.. keep the bashing to urself please

Edited by CRZY_TRAIN

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Just clarifying...

Your concern is that ships in smoke can spot and shoot at your airplanes, correct?

Do you know if any other ships could see your planes?

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16 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

As a ship (not a carrier), I cant stand them I feel it ruins the game they are to strong. That is frustration one but nevermind.

The second part is me being a carrier capt which OK i got a Furious (it was given to me), which I kinka stink at (mine sure dont seem strong).  I use it very little and when I do, i try to spot more then abuse people in ships, ill take a shot and leave them alone and move on, unless they are coming for my carrier.  Here is what seems screwy to me...  I was low tier T6 in a T8 battle I did fair but we lost and should not have lost here is why.  We had good ships left, a DD snuck up the river and set smoke. our guys were is great position to at least reset the cap.. well I flew my planes over the smoke several times and did not spot that ship.  His AA hitting the hell out my planes and still no spot.  Our ships firing into smoke nothing hit him, nothing (me) could spot him, 2 or 3 squadrens.  I mean what the heck....  its so stupid to me... they can fire and knock my planes down, cap and win while sitting right there.   It seems well... NOT GOOD for the game IMO.    anyways any good feedback is welcome.. keep the bashing to urself please

A good idea there would have been to drop a fighter, (so you can see if he leaves the smoke) recall, grab TBs, and torp the smoke. The AA tracers give you a rough idea where the DD is.

With Furious, you can also do the same thing with the bombers, just carpet where you think he is.

Just keep making runs as quickly as possible, from different angles.

It's not a guaranteed method, but can be useful if you need a reset.

Also, if it's a Standard match, his smoke won't last long enough for him to cap. (AFAIK most smoke doesn't have the duration to cover a cap attempt in Domination either, although I'm pretty sure USN or IJN DDs can do it)

Furious isn't bad, just the planes are slow, and the bombers require more lead than other nations. (the tradeoff is that, with squirmy targets, you don't need to try and hit them, so much as drop a line of bombs he has to drive through) The planes are also sturdier.

One thing I do, is use the stock TBs. The upgraded ones give you a barely noticeable increase to HP and speed, but the stock ones regen about 15% faster. The same goes for Implacable as well. 

 

Edited by Skpstr

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Maybe because your planes are being spotted by an unspotted ship? If you have concealment expert skill, he could have not spotted your planes, but let's assume he's still spotting your planes with CE skill, use that detection circle and plot that when your planes got first spotted on your map and search for that area, it works when you know where he's spotting your planes, unless if he's not spotted the whole time or no last seen locations, it may take a while to find the little guy, and when they are spotted, they usually turn away or smoke.

Also Furious is a good carrier at her tier (aside from speed that is), and if she ended up at tier 8 or huge maps, I recommend attacking ships that are alone and don't have good Anti-Air and spot for the enemy team outside their Anti-Air range for your team to engage, it keeps players to know where they are last spotted and can be aware of it.

As mentioned above too, it's helpful as well.

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Maybe I didnt make it clear how I wrote it..    A enemy DD snuck up the river and came into our cap which we saw briefly and he set smoke.  OK so far, we all got alerted the cap is being captured.  ok so far....  I drove my planes to the smoke that the DD set.  My planes flying over the smoke and getting hit by the DD's AA fire but the planes never spotted the DD, several attempts never showed the DD but he was there his AA fire was knocking my planes down left and right.  My teams guys shooting into the smoke never to hit the enemy DD, My planes never to spot him..   Right in the open in his smoke.  Our team had 4 ships close enough to hit him if we could see him. We lost to a compleatly invisable ship that was freely firing AA sitting in smoke.  Hope this is clear enough.  

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5 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

My planes flying over the smoke and getting hit by the DD's AA fire but the planes never spotted the DD, several attempts never showed the DD but he was there his AA fire was knocking my planes down left and right

let me say this again, your planes are being spotted by an unspotted ENEMY ship

Edited by Amatsukaze_KaiNi

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2 hours ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

As a ship (not a carrier), I cant stand them I feel it ruins the game they are to strong. That is frustration one but nevermind.

The second part is me being a carrier capt which OK i got a Furious (it was given to me), which I kinka stink at (mine sure dont seem strong).  I use it very little and when I do, i try to spot more then abuse people in ships, ill take a shot and leave them alone and move on, unless they are coming for my carrier.  Here is what seems screwy to me...  I was low tier T6 in a T8 battle I did fair but we lost and should not have lost here is why.  We had good ships left, a DD snuck up the river and set smoke. our guys were is great position to at least reset the cap.. well I flew my planes over the smoke several times and did not spot that ship.  His AA hitting the hell out my planes and still no spot.  Our ships firing into smoke nothing hit him, nothing (me) could spot him, 2 or 3 squadrens.  I mean what the heck....  its so stupid to me... they can fire and knock my planes down, cap and win while sitting right there.   It seems well... NOT GOOD for the game IMO.    anyways any good feedback is welcome.. keep the bashing to urself please

Here is the difference:

As you get more familiar with CVs, you will get better at dodging flak and know how to get around AA. Skills like blind dropping into smoke is also something that you will learn from trial and error.

But, no matter how much skill and experience you accumulate in surface ships, you will forever be helpless against a CV.

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exactly the point. I was tryin to spot the DD... am i missing something... when a plane flys over my ships when im in a ship the plane lites me up and there team can see me.   I was tryin to lite up the DD so we can reset our cap and my planes never was able to show that DD's position in the smoke but he was there hitting me with HIS AA.  There was no other ships anyplace.     If this isnt clear enough nevermind.  Happy St Patricks day.  

Edited by CRZY_TRAIN

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7 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

exactly the point. I was tryin to spot the DD... am i missing something... when a plane flys over my ships when im in a ship the plane lites me up and there team can see me.   I was tryin to lite up the DD so we can reset our cap and my planes never was able to show that DD's position in the smoke but he was there hitting me with HIS AA.  There was no other ships anyplace.     If this isnt clear enough nevermind.  Happy St Patricks day.  

Could be two scenarios.

1) Another ship or airplane could see your planes. Normal game behavior.

2) He could see planes through smoke. Bug. 

Do you have a replay to share that would allow us to see which it is?

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7 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

exactly the point. I was tryin to spot the DD... am i missing something... when a plane flys over my ships when im in a ship the plane lites me up and there team can see me.   I was tryin to lite up the DD so we can reset our cap and my planes never was able to show that DD's position in the smoke but he was there hitting me with HIS AA.  There was no other ships anyplace.     If this isnt clear enough nevermind.

If you could supply a replay of this battle, that would help to clear things up.

 

Otherwise, I have to agree that there was either another unseen ship, or perhaps a spotter plane or some other aircraft, that was close enough to see your airplanes, that then allowed the red DD to shoot at your planes. Otherwise his AA would have remained silent. Smoke screens work both ways. The only way someone inside a smoke screen can see out is if someone is spotting for him, or someone is proximity detected.

The only other way you could spot that DD in smoke is if he fired his main guns, and the gun bloom would light him up.

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4 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

exactly the point. I was tryin to spot the DD... am i missing something... when a plane flys over my ships when im in a ship the plane lites me up and there team can see me. 

A plane should never be able to see a ship in smoke. If it can, it's not the plane lighting you up. I don't know if you do this, but if you come to a stop to let the smoke cover you, ALWAYS move again, (never in a straight line) and try to avoid backing up. (if you have to, again, not in a straight line) I catch DDs out on this often. I watch the smoke start, see where the DD stops, and I can often hit that without actually seeing the target. If I miss, next attack goes where you will be if you back straight up.

It's either radar, hydro, proxy spot, or gun bloom that gets you spotted by some other ship, which you won't be able to see unless a teammate spots it, because you're in smoke.

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Why are you guys talking about a plane or ship spotting my planes.. I am asking WHY my planes could not lite up or spot that DD when it was right there fireing his AA at my planes..   No other ships just that one DD sitting in smoke in our cap.     simple 

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Lord ok makes a little sense but let me ask you this... IF he is in smoke does this mean my plane can not lite him up?   btw your name sound familar might have been you in the DD   hehe

Edited by CRZY_TRAIN

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2 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

I am asking WHY my planes could not lite up or spot that DD when it was right there fireing his AA at my planes..

Because you can't see through smoke with planes, and AA doesn't "bloom" through smoke like main gun rounds.

I think they're responding to you saying that other times, planes could see you when you were in smoke.

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2 minutes ago, CRZY_TRAIN said:

Lord ok makes a little sense but let me ask you this... IF he is in smoke does this mean my plane can not lite him up?  

Exactly.

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OK SKP so a plane cannot lite up a ship in smoke? is that right?   That is me not knowing that. I thought a plane would lite it up if my plane was close enough.  if thats it then ok i get why i could not lite him up now.  ok I thought if i was close enough it would lite him up.

Edited by CRZY_TRAIN

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 That's why i hate low level brit CV.
The only one ship i know that has a chance of flushing out a DD in smoke is the Ark, 3 torps in that smoke circle and make two good pass then your bound to hit something.
Always good to drop a fighter just on the other side of the smoke  and focus your bombs torps or rockets in the area you want the dd to pop out.
 

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