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SuperCustodiam

Buffing Japanese Torpedoes and Nerfing Torpedo Reload

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The Shimakaze line has really been power-crept over the years by all the other far more competitive DD lines: the line is focused entirely on delivering the mammoth 610mm torpedo on a very stealthy but fragile platform. I think that IJN 610mm torpedoes should be more respected instead of torpedoes that you can see and react to in 10 seconds or more compared to every other nation that averages about 7-8 seconds, and are more versatile. Basically, if IJN DDs should specialize only in torpedoes, the only thing they have going for them, then they should be the best damn torpedoes in the game, right?

Without further ado, here's my proposed changes to the 610s:

Type 8 610mm Torpedo:

  • Type 8 Mod 1: 1.7km detection, 7km range, moves at 67 kts, and does ~14.6k damage with a reaction time of ~9.4-9.0 sec
  • Type 8 Mod 2: 1.5km detection, 10km range, moves at 59 kts, and does ~15.6k damage with a reaction time of ~9.4-9.0 sec
  • Type 8 Mod 3: 1.6km detection, 8km range, moves at 63 kts, and does ~16.2k damage with a reaction time of ~9.4-9.0 sec

Type 90 Mod 1 610mm Torpedo: 1.5km detection, 10km range, moves at 62 kts, and does ~17.2k damage with a reaction time of ~9.0-8.5 sec

Type 93 610mm Torpedos; special effect: have no bubble trail while moving through the water

  • Type 93 Prototype: 1.3km detection, 15km range, moves at 55 kts, and does ~17.75k damage with a reaction time of ~8.8-8.4 sec (7.7 Sec with TA & TTM1)
  • Type 93 mod 0: 1.2km detection, 20km range, moves at 50 kts, and does ~18.5k damage with a reaction time of ~8.9-8.5 sec (7.7 Sec with TA & TTM1)
  • Type 93 mod 0 DW: 0.8km detection, 20km range, moves at 50 kts, and does ~18.5k damage with a reaction time of ~5.9-5.6 sec (5.1 Sec with TA & TTM1)
  • Type 93 mod 1: 1.4km detection, 15km range, moves at 59 kts, and does ~19k damage with a reaction time of ~8.8-8.4 sec (7.8 sec with TA & TTM1)
  • Type 93 mod 2: 1.4km detection, 10km range, moves at 62 kts, and does ~20.9k damage with a reaction time of ~8.4-8.0 sec
  • Type 93 Mod 2 DW: 0.8km detection, 20km range, moves at 55 kts, and does ~20.9k damage with a reaction time of ~5.4-5.1 sec (4.7 Sec with TA & TTM1)
  • F3 Experimental: 1.7km detection, 8km range, moves at 75 kts, and does ~21.3k damage with a reaction time of ~8.4-8.0 sec
  • Type 93 mod 3: 1.5km detection, 12km range, moves at 67 kts, and does ~23.7k damage with a reaction time of ~8.3-7.9 sec

So, I've done the math on the reaction times, and I've tried to keep the early 610s at a 9.5-9.0 second time, to be a little better but not too much better than they currently are. The Type 93s on the other hand, are a different story, as the earlier ones have more range but are very slow stock, but if you take TA, you can sacrifice all that extra range to make them a little faster and have less time to react to, but you have to specialize your captain for TA, which won't work that well at the higher tiers since the range progressively goes down as you get more powerful torpedoes: sort of a balancing idea I came up with myself. I also don't know if the early Type 93s should do a little less damage, as 18.5k is based off Shimakaze's 20km Type 93s, which might be a little on the high side for mid tiers. Still I tried to keep their reaction times around 8 to 9 seconds, which is still 1 second higher than the average 7 to 8 seconds most other nations have.

The other thing to mention is that the no bubble trail is not only a nod to history, but to allow you to discern Type 93s from regular torpedoes. That way when you're in a game with say a Yugumo and a Z-46 on the other team, and you see a spread of 8 torpedoes with no bubble trails coming at you, you'll know that they're Type 93s, and you REALLY need to dodge as many as you can, as they will hurt a lot more than a Z-46s torps.

Other than that, I suggest that IJN ships get new options in each tier respectively:

Tier IV:

  • Yuubari: Type 93 Prototype (also give us a alternative hull with 2x1 2x2 140mms please)

Tier V:

  • Mutsuki: Type 8 Mod 3 stock -> Type 93 Mod 0 as upgrade (Also please give Mustuki a facelift with shatter shields for her torpedo tubes please)
  • Furutaka: Type 8 Mod 1 stock -> Type 8 Mod 2 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 0 as final upgrade
  • Yahagi: Type 93 Mod 1

Tier VI:

  • Fubuki Ayanami: Type 8 Mod 1 stock -> Type 8 Mod 2 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 0 as final upgrade (Give this one a facelfit too, as she isn't actually Fubuki, but Ayanami class)
  • Shinonome Fubuki: Type 8 Mod 3 or Type 93 Mod 0
  • Hatsuharu: Type 8 Mod 1 stock -> Type 90 Mod 1 as upgrade
  • Aoba: Type 8 Mod 2 stock -> Type 90 Mod 1 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 0 as final upgrade
  • Mutsu: Type 8 Mod 1

Tier VII:

  • Akatsuki: Type 8 Mod 2 stock -> Type 90 Mod 1 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 1 as final Upgrade
  • Shiratsuyu: Type 90 Mod 1 stock -> Type 93 Mod 1 as upgrade
  • Yuudachi: Type 93 Mod 0 or Type 93 Mod 0 DW (Not too sure how powerful this would be to make Yuudachi into a tier VII Asashio, but it would be better than what she currently is IMO)
  • Myoko: Type 90 Mod 1 stock -> Type 93 Mod 1 as upgrade (Also please revert the changes on Myoko, and make it 2x4 Hull A, 4x3 Hull B, and 4x4 Hull C)

Tier VIII:

  • Kagero: Type 93 Mod 0 as stock -> Type 93 Mod 1 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 2 as final upgrade
  • Yukikaze: F3 Experimental
  • Asashio: Type 93 Mod 2 DW or Type 93 Mod 0
  • Harekaze: Type 93 Mod 1
  • Akizuki: Type 93 Mod 1 stock -> F3 Experimental as upgrade
  • Mogami: Type 90 Mod 1 stock -> Type 93 Mod 1 as upgrade (Again, revert changes and make it 4x3)
  • Atago: Type 93 Mod 1
  • Kii: F3 Experimental

Tier IX:

  • Yuugumo: Type 93 Mod 1 stock -> Type 93 Mod 2 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 3 as final upgrade
  • Kitikaze: Type 93 Mod 1 stock -> F3 Experimental as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 2 as final upgrade
  • Ibuki: Type 93 Mod 0 stock -> Type 93 mod 1 as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 3 as final upgrade

Tier X:

  • Shimakaze: Type 93 Mod 1 stock -> F3 Experimental as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 3 as final upgrade
  • Harugumo: Type 93 Mod 2 stock -> F3 Experimental as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 mod 3 as final upgrade
  • Zao: Type 93 Mod 1 stock -> F3 Experimental as 1st upgrade -> Type 93 Mod 3 as final upgrade
  • Yoshino: Type 93 Mod 0 or Type 93 Mod 3

Last but not least, nerf torpedo reload: Change it from when upon activation you reset the torpedo tubes reload time to 5 seconds to upon activation, reduces torpedo reload time by 60%. This way the consumable is not super powerful anymore, and makes it so you can't just spam 16 torpedoes in the water. That way, we can have torpedo reload booster and smoke be a thing for Kagero-Yuugumo and Hatsuharu-Shiratsuyu without it being so blatantly overpowered that they had to separate and make you have to choose between smoke and torpedo reload booster.

Well, what do you think? I think this will make IJN DDs a little bit better, and sort of allow them to reclaim the throne for best torpedo boats in the game, giving them more threat in games, making them a bit more comfortable to play, while still retaining that high skill floor they require. They will still be hard, don't get me wrong, but by lowering the reaction time average by about a second will probably help them a lot, compared to the 9 to 10 second reaction time they currently have. I do understand that cruisers having longer range torpedoes might make them a little bit more powerful than they need to be, but I've always found it criminal that you don't break 10km range until tier X, when the Italians get 12km/13.5km torpedoes as early as tier VI.

Edited by SuperCustodiam
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I still do alright in Shimake by using either 12km or 20km torpedoes depending on if it’s a weekday or weekend / holiday.

Rest of the IJN DDs are doing just fine.

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52 minutes ago, Admiral_Thrawn_1 said:

I still do alright in Shimake by using either 12km or 20km torpedoes depending on if it’s a weekday or weekend / holiday.

Rest of the IJN DDs are doing just fine.

For what it's worth, the OP makes an excellent point when he says: 

1 hour ago, SuperCustodiam said:

Basically, if IJN DDs should specialize only in torpedoes, the only thing they have going for them, then they should be the best damn torpedoes in the game, right?

From my perspective, IJN DD's do NOT have the best torpedoes in the game.  They're only the hardest hitting, which is of limited value when it can be incredibly difficult to land torp hits with some of those torps. 

 

One thing I will say though is that that slot 5 upgrade module that gives the mounting ship a minimum detection range of 1.8km on all torps (at least those that have less than that 1.8 km detection range) essentially means that most IJN torps a tier 8+ ship mounting that module might see will either be immune or barely affected by its effects.  Not sure how much that's worth though, because I don't know how many people are using that slot 5 upgrade.

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