Jump to content
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
USMC2145

I have a question for you DD players.

45 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

1,379
Members
1,429 posts
7,116 battles

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 5
  • Confused 1
  • Boring 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,911
[O_O]
Members
6,450 posts
15,349 battles

Being overly aggressive and fighting for caps they shouldn't be fighting for.

The only real DD complaint I have is that French DD's are pretty darned helpless when located and targeted by a CV.  If they stay with AA ships they are blasted in chat for not scouting, and reported for same.  Everything else I can pretty well anticipate and/or counter.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9,273
[SALVO]
Members
24,823 posts
25,898 battles
31 minutes ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

The reason is that those players are bad DD players, plain and simple.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,794
[-K-]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
7,214 posts
9,362 battles
1 hour ago, USMC2145 said:

I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD

Radar is fine, you can play around it. Know where the cruisers are, what radar ranges, duration, and cool-downs are, etc.

CVs don't make the game impossible for DDs, just much less fun, especially when a CV decides to troll you personally.

1 hour ago, USMC2145 said:

all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started

High risk, high reward. It's real easy to die in a DD. Lose focus for a few moments, catch a sudden IJN torp mid-ship even at full HP -- and you go straight to port.

1 hour ago, desmo_2 said:

French DD's are pretty darned helpless when located and targeted by a CV

All of them are (with some minor exceptions, like Kidd vs tier 6 CV, that sort of thing)

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
88
[B-Z]
Members
157 posts
22,058 battles

Because if you can't read the minimap in a CV game then why would you be able to read it in a game without CV?

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
230
[RAGE]
Members
341 posts
5,697 battles

DDs are out front spotting for the team and looking for opportunities to cap. It's really common for opposing DDs to spot each other at the same time and due to a low health pool they can get eliminated quickly.

Would you rather they hold back and let the reds have the cap circles?

  • Cool 4
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9,730
[INTEL]
Members
13,067 posts
36,061 battles
20 minutes ago, mumphred said:

DDs are out front spotting for the team and looking for opportunities to cap. It's really common for opposing DDs to spot each other at the same time and due to a low health pool they can get eliminated quickly.

Would you rather they hold back and let the reds have the cap circles?

LOL. Lots of people don't get that. Like the OP....

1 hour ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

It's called statistical inevitability. If DD players knife fight over caps early, on average half will die early. It doesn't mean they are bad players. It is just the nature of DDing.

That's where the fun is, those knife fights in caps. Radar has severely crimped early knife fights, sadly, and CVs simply suck the fun out of DD play completely. What a moronic mechanic.

  • Cool 5
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39
[B-Z]
Members
123 posts
14,295 battles

DD play is high risk and needs really good situational awareness and decision making.

The single biggest mistake is over aggression, and running into CAPs when it is not safe. Work out how to make % plays, rather than gamble.

1. Where are the planes? Coming for you? Abort and bail. Don't know? Go slow until you do know.

2. Where are the Radars? Don't know? Then only try to CAP by backing in with a hard cover escape route. Radars on your CAP? Spot them and call target. Go wide if you have to.

3. Whats your backup like? Is their's likely to be better? Abort.

4. Can I win a gunfight or force the red DD to smoke 1v1. Does this apply to every DD on the red team ? Don't know? Assume worst case.  

I've got 67.5% winrate on Gearing by sailing like this. I'm not trying to get a high caliber every game, I'm trying to survive 20 minutes in every game. Many wins I get just by being the only DD left on the map.

Edited by MeglaGnome
  • Cool 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9,730
[INTEL]
Members
13,067 posts
36,061 battles
9 minutes ago, MeglaGnome said:

DD play is high risk and needs really good situational awareness and decision making.

The single biggest mistake is over aggression, and running into CAPs when it is not safe. Work out how to make % plays, rather than gamble.

1. Where are the planes? Coming for you? Abort and bail. Don't know? Go slow until you do know.

2. Where are the Radars? Don't know? Then only try to CAP by backing in with a hard cover escape route. Radars on your CAP? Spot them and call target. Go wide if you have to.

3. Whats your backup like? Is their's likely to be better? Abort.

4. Can I win a gunfight or force the red DD to smoke 1v1. Does this apply to every DD on the red team ? Don't know? Assume worst case.  

I've got 67.5% winrate on Gearing by sailing like this. I'm not trying to get a high caliber every game, I'm trying to survive 20 minutes in every game. Many wins I get just by being the only DD left on the map.

Those are good rules. I also set out blind torps whenever I enter a cap, based on my experience of where DDs are more likely to be. I get a lot of kills that way.

  • Cool 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,535
[SYN]
Members
8,236 posts
13,957 battles

Most players in this game are bad, bad dd players get punished very quickly and severely, more so than cruisers and much more so than BBs. 

Edited by Kapitan_Wuff
  • Cool 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,871
[USCC2]
Members
6,060 posts
2 hours ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

In those circumstances either bad RNG or a poor player.

In general it happens in all ship types - the Destroyer that gets mauled/deleted, the Cruiser that gets citadeled/deleted, the Battleship that gets torched/deleted, the CV that....ok not all ships.

But the thing is, there may be players who prefer playing a ship type, however I don't believe those players only play that ship type; most play all. :Smile_honoring:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
976
[KAPPA]
Members
3,110 posts
8,239 battles
1 hour ago, _WaveRider_ said:

In those circumstances either bad RNG or a poor player.

In general it happens in all ship types - the Destroyer that gets mauled/deleted, the Cruiser that gets citadeled/deleted, the Battleship that gets torched/deleted, the CV that....ok not all ships.

But the thing is, there may be players who prefer playing a ship type, however I don't believe those players only play that ship type; most play all. :Smile_honoring:

It can happen under certain circumstances, but usually those circumstances are... kinda dumb, either for the CV or for the DD. One thing that comes to mind was a French DD getting into the middle of our 3 CVs in record time. Happened while I was regrinding Langley. Was early into french DDs, so I wasn't used to them doing that yet.

It was only because the DD didn't use torps he could guarantee would hit and our own CVs being good at dodging that nothing came of it. For minutes. Salvo after salvo missed. Rocket after rocket, too!

I eventually got annoyed with bad rocket dispersion/saturated hits and whipped out my torps. 2-3 hits later, the DD regretted his choices. Another minute later and the DD burned out. Seriously, those things can be annoying to deal with if you get them saturated enough! :cap_haloween:

Another time while regrinding Langley, I had 3 CVs all target my CV in the first minute or two. Lost over half my health near the start and was forced to retreat. Slowly. Langley is probably the slowest ship in the game, so... very slowly.

It was kinda sad, as they never attacked me again the rest of the match. They had me, yet... didn't confirm the kill. Eventually we won because of that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
83
[TF-64]
Members
540 posts
19,083 battles

As others have said, high risk for high reward. Knowing how and when to approach a cap isn't quite as simple as manyake it sound. You have to keep one eye always on the mini-map. Let that eye wander for a sec and I promise you, your team isn't where you thought they were headed. Approach a cap and the red team is in even a small bit better positioned to support him and you may be on the fast track back to Port.

Blind torps are your best friend and worst eny at the same time. I have eaten torps well thrown into the right alleyway and boom dead, only to get a flesh wound award for offing a DD I never saw. Usually the same guy that killed me. 

Good DD play is hard. Even the best can be the first one out due to any number of factors. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
975 posts
4 hours ago, mumphred said:

DDs are out front spotting for the team and looking for opportunities to cap. It's really common for opposing DDs to spot each other at the same time and due to a low health pool they can get eliminated quickly.

Would you rather they hold back and let the reds have the cap circles?

Lol, spotting trying to cap may be one thing, but as the OP has said way to many DD players just plain commit suicide for no reason. I would rather have a DD hang back than rush into a cap and die 2 min into the game. Dying like that just puts a huge disadvantage on your team. There is no reason to rush into a cap at the start of a game just to die. Better to hang back and play the long game if the cap is contested and things look bad for you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,015
[USA-N]
Members
785 posts
9,238 battles

The answer to the OPs question lies in a concept called "hit points".

Hit points represent the sum total quotient of health that sustains a player as they take "damage".

"Damage", for the better understanding of the OP, reduces hit points.

Ergo, for the same incoming damage, a ship possessing fewer hit points than others, such as the DD, will arrive sooner at the critical threshold of zero hit points, when compared with a ship that has a relatively larger quotient of hit points.

There is also the fact that DDs are scary to many players, as they can behold the enemy without being perceived themselves, allowing the enemy team to focus fire upon the target so revealed by the sneaky little DD. This activity is known as "spotting". Players regret being "spotted", as the barrage of incoming "damage" is significantly deleterious to their "hit points". This often results in them exiting the game, to cheer their team from the sidelines, often with helpful advice about where to progress, and how to go about that progression.

It is the great melancholy of being relegated to spectator status which causes players to fear being spotted, and so prioritise the erstwhile DD as a primary choice of target. Hence the popular refrain from wise battle group leaders (usually driving a Kremlin) "Primary the DD, ladies."

These range of factors are why DDs are often first to exit the map.

The DD player is brave, selfless and cunning. He is the true warrior of the waves, the eyes and backbone of every battle group.

Edited by SidTheBlade
  • Funny 3
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,671
[O7]
Members
1,030 posts
4,418 battles
5 hours ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

In a game without CVs I only die when I want to

There are different kinds of complaints depending on the DD player skill level, you can read about it here:

https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/c2m2ki/you_can_pretty_much_tell_how_good_a_dd_player_is/

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
367 posts
10,522 battles

I don't mind radar, you just have to know what ranges they are and their duration, enemy ship positioning, and how close you are to cover. I gotten daisy chained before, but because I was behind an island and there was nobody flanking me, I just waited for the radar to end. If nothing else, it prevents the red team from gaining points while your team caps somewhere else to get an advantage. I find that with some DD players, as soon as the radar icon pops up, they panic and run out from behind perfectly serviceable cover to get deleted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
987
[INTEL]
Members
3,057 posts
16,815 battles

DD play is all about constant situational awareness and planning ahead.  You can't be lazy about it and get away with it as much as you can with the other types.  It also takes a lot of experience to learn and apply map positioning.  If you don't learn this, you run the constant risk of putting yourself into a place you can't get out of.

Edit: And CV's negate most of that.  You can't run and you can't hide (if only temporarily).

 

Edited by ClassicLib
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
326
[BB35]
[BB35]
Members
393 posts
11,062 battles

I quit playing DDs not due to radar or CVs.

1. I quit due to the fact BBs snd cruisers want me to take caps and spot but they will not move up to support me. I see them on the bottom row of the map and or behind islands.

2. Team will want me to take cap A. I get in it, then only to watch all my support ships turn off to go to cap B.  

3. I spot a enemy DD and no one shoots at it besides me. And Ive seen cruisers within range but they wont shoot. Guess they dont want to get detected.

 

All 3 above gets your DD support killed

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
987
[INTEL]
Members
3,057 posts
16,815 battles
1 minute ago, Gemlin said:

I quit playing DDs not due to radar or CVs.

1. I quit due to the fact BBs snd cruisers want me to take caps and spot but they will not move up to support me. I see them on the bottom row of the map and or behind islands.

2. Team will want me to take cap A. I get in it, then only to watch all my support ships turn off to go to cap B.  

3. I spot a enemy DD and no one shoots at it besides me. And Ive seen cruisers within range but they wont shoot. Guess they dont want to get detected.

 

All 3 above gets your DD support killed

You have to give up caring about what the team wants.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,128
[S0L0]
Alpha Tester, In AlfaTesters
4,455 posts
6,507 battles

Bad DD player, will always find a way to die... griping about CVs just makes them feel less personally responsible.  Most average or slightly better DD players gripe about CVs because it made a hard job a lot harder, due to having to play with more CVs and less stealth.      DDs are and have always been most OP ship in the game in the best players hands..... Absolutely only real counter to a Unicum in a DD...Another Unicum in a DD,  or a mildly competent or above CV player who knows who's  in that DD.    They'll always hate CVs.... probably only thing in the game their skill can't counter.   

  • Cool 1
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
636
[LLMF]
Alpha Tester
2,425 posts

7 Ways to Die in the Big Blue Thing... starring any DD.  DD's succumb to quick sand faster than any other ship. Things can go wrong very quickly mainly due to the obvious low HP pool. Mix in the short damage control action (which IMHO should be increased for DDs some) and DDs can't escape a lot of thing breaking hits. Even with all the right captain enhancements. 

So with so many ways to die I can see why so many just YOLO and spam torpedoes without really looking at the mini-map or whether there is any chance for the torpedoes to hit any red ship. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,115
[TDRB]
Members
5,142 posts
13,741 battles
Quote

My question is what is the excuse for that happening

There can be justifiable reasons for this. One is DD's are a priority target with or without CV's/radar ships in the battle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,280
[PVE]
Members
4,263 posts
18,638 battles
10 hours ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

For me, it's about extremes.....  I'm just an average player.  I really like the WW2 roles and responsibilities, the less technical ships and having to use tactics versus technology to fight cooperative (notice I didn't say team) battles.

Unfortunately, our host decided that smoke and stealth was too much for CA/BB's to deal with because it slowed the game down...  After all, you have to "think" about smoke.....  Ergo, to eliminate thinking, RADAR was introduced...........and, Oh No, not WW2 radar but radar from about the 1969 era where it was 100% effective........  And, at the same time, more HE Spam gun boats came into being !  That eliminated DD's stealth, which was their best defensive option....  BUT, that didn't speed the game up enough...........  So, they took carriers and decided to make some money.........Update 8.0 just about broke the player base.  And, after months of messing around, the game is still screwed up.

I abandoned random matches.  Abandoned DD play because it, in Random matches "isn't "value added" because all you do is to "react" to radar and planes.....  And, if you manage to do your job despite planes and radar, in the end, when you are the last ship, planes can and do hunt you down and there is nothing to stop them because "they repair and are replaced" and a vast majority of DD's don't have repair.......... 

So, what is the point to even play a DD anymore???  It's a losing proposition to begin with and who in the heck wants to be a target all game long with little or no hope of earning enough value for your time???  Non-Value-Added they are.

Edited by Asym_KS
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
647 posts
72 battles
10 hours ago, USMC2145 said:

Now i want to make it clear this does not pertain to all of you. I hear a lot from DD players how CV and radar have made the game impossible for DD and many use that for the reason they die in the first few minutes of the game. What i do not understand is how is it game after game when there are no CV and very few if any radar ships you look up and all the DD are dead pretty much before that match has even started. My question is what is the excuse for that happening???

They make a mistake and have a 20-25K healthpool and take massive damage by everything.

What baffles me is when you see T10 BB with 90-100 K HP and massive heals dead in the same time as the DD. Im like "Dude!!? The game JUST started"!?!?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×