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spmdougherty

My Pan-European BB tech line proposal

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with a big hat-tip to the other players on their suggestions. Similar to Vibirus Unitis, (good but not crazy good accuracy, low detection for a BB, slightly lower HP pool, maybe add a better than average heal and good damage control at tier 6+ to buff) but with vastly improved AA above tier 5. More sneaky sniper than muh brawler with decent HE and AP damage output at medium and long-range because of more guns per ton than other BBs in tier. Higher tiers (7 and up) with above average speed, tier 6 and below average to below average speed.

Tier 3

Spanish dreadnought Espana

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_battleship_España

Tier 4

SMS Tegetthoff

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_Tegetthoff_(1912)

Tier 5

Spanish dreadnought Reina Victoria Eugenia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reina_Victoria_Eugenia-class_battleship

Tier 6

SMS Monarch

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ersatz_Monarch-class_battleship

Tier 7

Turkish dreadnought Reşadiye

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Erin upgraded for WW2 service.

Tier 8

Spanish battleship Jaime I

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Littorio-class_battleship with slimmed-down stats to fit into the overall play style of the line.

Tier 9

Turkish dreadnought Sultan Osman I

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(1913) with extensive upgrades for WW2 era service, but you could also use this design as the basis for a fictional up-gunned Agincourt successor of 1920s-1930s standards.

Tier 10

'Greek battleship Vasiliefs Nikephoros Fokas'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Dakota-class_battleship_(1939) with nerfed secondaries, lower detection, no American super-heavy AP, and a low for tier HP pool.

 

If Wargaming decides to use the Turkish ships in the Pan-Asian tech tree instead of pan-European, replace Resadiye with Vasilefs Konstantinos (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bretagne-class_battleship with similar upgrades to the Bretagne's upgraded module as stock) at Tier 7, and  maybe an upgraded version of the Littorio design for Spanish service replacing the Sultan Osman I (or up-gunned successor) at tier 9.

 

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Huh, a South Dakota at T10? And a Greek one at that, do you have any information on it?

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High tier ships will need to be paper or conjectural, from T8 -10 your proposals for ships are based on some very old designed ships...I mean you can use the names and such, but using those ships as examples are way under powered. (also the T5...ugh, it is more like a T3)

There are some paper Dutch BB/BCs that would fit the bill.  An imaginary AH BB, if AH had not dissolved after WWI would be okay.  Greeks bought used stuff, never designed much, wouldn't even think of making a Greek ship T4 let alone a T10.

There have been some more researched proposals out there, perhaps searching the forums?

 

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30 minutes ago, Arri_Shi said:

Huh, a South Dakota at T10? And a Greek one at that, do you have any information on it?

It's purely conjectural. I picked the SD hull because it fits the rest of the line (smaller guns compared to what is tier typical, but more of them on smaller than tier typical hull). The Greeks only have either the Salamis (which is more of a battlecruiser) or the Bretagne variant.

 

19 minutes ago, Morpheous said:

High tier ships will need to be paper or conjectural, from T8 -10 your proposals for ships are based on some very old designed ships...I mean you can use the names and such, but using those ships as examples are way under powered. (also the T5...ugh, it is more like a T3)

There are some paper Dutch BB/BCs that would fit the bill.  An imaginary AH BB, if AH had not dissolved after WWI would be okay.  Greeks bought used stuff, never designed much, wouldn't even think of making a Greek ship T4 let alone a T10.

There have been some more researched proposals out there, perhaps searching the forums?

 

The Greek ships are there purely for the sake of variety. The Dutch designs are more battlecruiser-ish. This line is designed to be more of sniper-ish play-style with better than average concealment.

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22 hours ago, spmdougherty said:

 

It's purely conjectural. I picked the SD hull because it fits the rest of the line (smaller guns compared to what is tier typical, but more of them on smaller than tier typical hull). The Greeks only have either the Salamis (which is more of a battlecruiser) or the Bretagne variant.

 

The Greek ships are there purely for the sake of variety. The Dutch designs are more battlecruiser-ish. This line is designed to be more of sniper-ish play-style with better than average concealment.

No problem with variety, but a much lower tier :)

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I would say wrong tier with that, SD. Maybe put Project 5 Design 1917, it's an Austro-Hungarian design that has 8 -16.5 inch guns. I have that as my 9 in my proposed line.

Edited by Starfleet1701

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15 hours ago, Starfleet1701 said:

I would say wrong tier with that, SD. Maybe put Project 5 Design 1917, it's an Austro-Hungarian design that has 8 -16.5 inch guns. I have that as my 9 in my proposed line.

With extensive upgrades for WW2-era AA I could see that.

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6 hours ago, spmdougherty said:

With extensive upgrades for WW2-era AA I could see that.

Hey all of my proposed desgins are with hypothetical WW2 era AA hulls in mind. I mean, what did you expect them to go out as is? lol.

Edited by Starfleet1701

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Seems to me that you're vastly over-tiering many of these designs, particularly some of the Ottoman and Greek options. Even with completely absurd upgrades the hulls are simply inadequate for the tiers where you've placed them. Sultan Osman I for example is basically a tier five or six at best, not even close to top tier. There's also the matter of your line jumping back and forth with caliber on a regular basis, which is something Wargaming generally tries to avoid in line progressions. 

As such, a safer bet may actually be to lean more heavily into the Austrian designs, which even with only AA additions could span tiers three through seven or eight at a minimum. 

There's always room for many premiums or reward ships from Greece, Spain, and other countries, but the Austrian designs are your best bet for a single consistent line with progression in gun caliber, armor, and other improvements.

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This is similar to a tech tree I laid out. Was gonna post when I spotted this one. Mine only had a few small changes. Most prominently the inclusion at tier 7 and 9 the Austro-Hungarian planned projects for post WW1, Projekt III and Projekt V (same as Starfleet1701 said) respectively with SMS Monarch and Sultan Osman I removed from the main tree. I also had Reşadiye at tier 6. I also kept Osman and, as well as Salamis as Alternates for tiers 6 and 5 respectively. Other than that it is identical to your layout so obviously I like your setup and second your suggestion of a Pan-Euro BB line.
 

I was, however, looking to see if other countries may have looked at something good for tier 10 even if it was Luxembourg's leadership going "Man, look at this "Yamato" Japan built! Wish we had need for a navy. It'd be nice to have something like that! Jimmy! Draw me a cool picture of a battleship like that so I can make a toy to play with in the bath tub!" Okay, maybe not that extreme but you get my point. Someone else, be it Finland, Sweden,  The Netherlands, or whoever, had to have at least thought about it enough that there is record of a "What if we built something like that?" somewhere in archives. Especially with how many countries were playing rebuild from scratch. Doesn't mean they went anywhere with designing...just a pipe dream of somebodies leadership wishing is all.

Edited by Warmatt16

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