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Gin_Blossoms

Winter Holiday Events and Community Crisis is Much Ado About Nothing

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Executive Summary:  The rollout of the highly anticipated Holiday Event Package by World of Warships Gaming Staff on 11 December 2019 as part of update 8.11 was met with mixed reviews by the community.  Community Contributors and players alike complained at the lack of snowflake rewards, the grind for Puerto Rico, the lack of transparency regarding capabilities the mid-tier cruiser that could be earned in conjunction with Puerto Rico, and the cost of the German Admiral Lutjens.  While all of these events ARE FREE, players seemed to think that Wargaming was out for a quick money grab, specifically with the Puerto Rico.  The usual tin-foil hat brigades were out in force covering the Santa Gift events and the lack of rewards (mostly ships) that were not appropriately reflected in their cash payment for random containers.  This resulted in an uproar and an ongoing Public Relations issue, which in my opinion is based on little actual merit and is overall, much ado about nothing.

1.  Wargaming was true to their word that everything can be obtained for free.  If you have other life obligations, your boss is not required to pay you for missing work.  Same concept applies with Puerto Rico, WG cannot be held liable for your inability to meet directive requirements.  Plus, they even anticipated this by placing milestones and a mid-tier reward ship along the way.  I think in large part, the player base is missing the "boat" so to speak and failing to appreciate the hard work the WG staff put into this FREE EVENT and the fact that they created milestones to ensure even those who would not be able to 100 percent complete all aspects of the event would not be left empty handed.

2.  Numerous posts have been made showing the horrible disparity between the Puerto Rico and previous reward ships from Winter Holiday Events such as Prinze Eidel Friedich and Graf Spee.  I think there needs to be a candid discussion on this.  Some memes are floating around showing "700%" difference between how the reward ships are earned.  Maybe this is true, but there are other factors being conveniently ignored.  First, there is more time to complete this mission than in previous seasons.  Second, let us consider this is a TIER X ship and not a Tier VI.  That is a huge difference.  If everyone had the Puerto Rico, they would no longer need to grind for credits and other resources and this would impact the game economy again, leading to another Missouri disaster.  I think this is actually a brilliant concept and I am fine if I cannot get access to it in time.  Many will enter the race, few will win.  Its ok as I am looking forward to the containers and other rewards (ship included).

3.  Admiral Lutjens -- 175,000 coal and doesn't cost a player a dime.  If you are getting your coal everyday, it is just a matter of time before you can afford him.  I fail to see why folks are in an uproar over this.  He is a solid commander and I look forward to having him in time.  In fact, I have already planned a way ahead to EARN him.  For those that are requiring immediate gratification, well you can always buy coal with your wallet.

4.  Snowflakes and Steel -- Last year, players earned a lot of steel during the snowflake event.  This year, not so much.  @NoZoupForYou (a highly respected community contributor) made a video yesterday complaining about how he was let down by the lack of steel in this year's event.  Sorry Zoup, no can do, WG has assessed from this year to last and appropriately modified the steel earnings to AGAIN prevent a Missouri economy crisis.  Shoot, even you had your own video on how the Missouri damaged the WoWS economy.  You of ALL people should understand this.  I really think the CCs need to take a step back, do some introspection, and carefully consider talking points before spewing information on behalf of the community.  I look at you all as the "spiritual leaders" of the community.  You start the war drums...it better be something worth falling on a sword for, such as the CV rework, this holiday whine is pathetic at best.  Let us try to make community discordance and reaction at the level necessary to the topic/issue at hand.

In conclusion, players need to understand that WG is a company and FOR PROFIT organization.  They spent countless hours preparing for this event and I am quite pleased with its rollout and the thought that went into it as to not further damage the economy.  Now, had they been a little more transparent as to the WHY, I think they would have avoided the on-going and clearly now debunked issues, but player base is player base and spin issues beyond the scope necessary.  If everything is a crisis what truly is a crisis?  Another closing thought would be to consider if the Puerto Rico is a MUST HAVE or a NICE TO HAVE or a I WANT.  I do not see it dominating the game like Stalingrad did or other premiums.  I think it is an above average ship, but I do not see it as the end all be all of future events, rewards, competitive play or dominating in random battles like those of the Russian persuasion.  People need to take a pill, relax, reconsider, and then they too will reach the inevitable conclusion as I have, that WG is actually acting in the best interests of the longterm/strategic interests of gaming stability and balance.

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1 minute ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

WG cannot be held liable for your inability to meet directive requirements. 

What rot. When they make directive missions that include NEARLY ONE MILLION SHIP XP, you damn well bet they can be held liable. When they have multiple missions in the early stage for EIGHTY FIVE THOUSAND BASE XP, or ONE HUNDRED THIRTY FIVE THOUSAND ship XP in each of several ship types, they have gone too far.

When even someone like Flamu says he can't finish it, that's a pretty good gold standard for total irresponsibility on WG's part.

I usually stick up for WG, but this event is SEVERAL bridges too far. 

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8 minutes ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

In conclusion, players need to understand that WG is a company and FOR PROFIT organization. 

Again, conflating THAT they need to make money, with HOW they go about making that money.

The former is never a defense for the latter.

 

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9 minutes ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

Executive Summary:  The rollout of the highly anticipated Holiday Event Package by World of Warships Gaming Staff on 11 December 2019 as part of update 8.11 was met with mixed reviews by the community.  Community Contributors and players alike complained at the lack of snowflake rewards, the grind for Puerto Rico, the lack of transparency regarding capabilities the mid-tier cruiser that could be earned in conjunction with Puerto Rico, and the cost of the German Admiral Lutjens.  While all of these events ARE FREE, players seemed to think that Wargaming was out for a quick money grab, specifically with the Puerto Rico.  The usual tin-foil hat brigades were out in force covering the Santa Gift events and the lack of rewards (mostly ships) that were not appropriately reflected in their cash payment for random containers.  This resulted in an uproar and an ongoing Public Relations issue, which in my opinion is based on little actual merit and is overall, much ado about nothing.

1.  Wargaming was true to their word that everything can be obtained for free.  If you have other life obligations, your boss is not required to pay you for missing work.  Same concept applies with Puerto Rico, WG cannot be held liable for your inability to meet directive requirements.  Plus, they even anticipated this by placing milestones and a mid-tier reward ship along the way.  I think in large part, the player base is missing the "boat" so to speak and failing to appreciate the hard work the WG staff put into this FREE EVENT and the fact that they created milestones to ensure even those who would not be able to 100 percent complete all aspects of the event would not be left empty handed.

2.  Numerous posts have been made showing the horrible disparity between the Puerto Rico and previous reward ships from Winter Holiday Events such as Prinze Eidel Friedich and Graf Spee.  I think there needs to be a candid discussion on this.  Some memes are floating around showing "700%" difference between how the reward ships are earned.  Maybe this is true, but there are other factors being conveniently ignored.  First, there is more time to complete this mission than in previous seasons.  Second, let us consider this is a TIER X ship and not a Tier VI.  That is a huge difference.  If everyone had the Puerto Rico, they would no longer need to grind for credits and other resources and this would impact the game economy again, leading to another Missouri disaster.  I think this is actually a brilliant concept and I am fine if I cannot get access to it in time.  Many will enter the race, few will win.  Its ok as I am looking forward to the containers and other rewards (ship included).

3.  Admiral Lutjens -- 175,000 coal and doesn't cost a player a dime.  If you are getting your coal everyday, it is just a matter of time before you can afford him.  I fail to see why folks are in an uproar over this.  He is a solid commander and I look forward to having him in time.  In fact, I have already planned a way ahead to EARN him.  For those that are requiring immediate gratification, well you can always buy coal with your wallet.

4.  Snowflakes and Steel -- Last year, players earned a lot of steel during the snowflake event.  This year, not so much.  @NoZoupForYou (a highly respected community contributor) made a video yesterday complaining about how he was let down by the lack of steel in this year's event.  Sorry Zoup, no can do, WG has assessed from this year to last and appropriately modified the steel earnings to AGAIN prevent a Missouri economy crisis.  Shoot, even you had your own video on how the Missouri damaged the WoWS economy.  You of ALL people should understand this.  I really think the CCs need to take a step back, do some introspection, and carefully consider talking points before spewing information on behalf of the community.  I look at you all as the "spiritual leaders" of the community.  You start the war drums...it better be something worth falling on a sword for, such as the CV rework, this holiday whine is pathetic at best.  Let us try to make community discordance and reaction at the level necessary to the topic/issue at hand.

In conclusion, players need to understand that WG is a company and FOR PROFIT organization.  They spent countless hours preparing for this event and I am quite pleased with its rollout and the thought that went into it as to not further damage the economy.  Now, had they been a little more transparent as to the WHY, I think they would have avoided the on-going and clearly now debunked issues, but player base is player base and spin issues beyond the scope necessary.  If everything is a crisis what truly is a crisis?  Another closing thought would be to consider if the Puerto Rico is a MUST HAVE or a NICE TO HAVE or a I WANT.  I do not see it dominating the game like Stalingrad did or other premiums.  I think it is an above average ship, but I do not see it as the end all be all of future events, rewards, competitive play or dominating in random battles like those of the Russian persuasion.  People need to take a pill, relax, reconsider, and then they too will reach the inevitable conclusion as I have, that WG is actually acting in the best interests of the longterm/strategic interests of gaming stability and balance.

LOL, and this is what we call a shill.

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9 minutes ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

Some memes are floating around showing "700%" difference between how the reward ships are earned.

Not sure if you're trying to be misleading or you misunderstood. It's 700% between the PEF and the Gorizia.... that's the first 3 directives. It's not 700% between PEF and Puerto Rico it's WAAAAAAAAAAAY more than that. 

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Even WG doesn't want to grind for the Puerto Rico, because they got "stuff to do besides grind all day". I guess if it's the players that gotta grind all day for a chance.... that's different though.

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6 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

What rot. When they make directive missions that include NEARLY ONE MILLION SHIP XP, you damn well bet they can be held liable. When they have multiple missions in the early stage for EIGHTY FIVE THOUSAND BASE XP, or ONE HUNDRED THIRTY FIVE THOUSAND ship XP in each of several ship types, they have gone too far.

When even someone like Flamu says he can't finish it, that's a pretty good gold standard for total irresponsibility on WG's part.

I usually stick up for WG, but this event is SEVERAL bridges too far. 

I'm a single person with no kids, but I do have a job and a commute and basic human survival needs.

If I push myself I have 5 hours a day in which I could play this game, a few more per day on weekends, if I'm willing to have no life outside work and WOWS. 

If someone like me is looking at this thing and saying "I cannot possible finish it for free, even paying for one of the dubs boosters would only make it technically feasible"... then it's gone too far. 

 

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3 minutes ago, ArgosRising said:

Not sure if you're trying to be misleading or you misunderstood. It's 700% between the PEF and the Gorizia.... that's the first 3 directives. It's not 700% between PEF and Puerto Rico it's WAAAAAAAAAAAY more than that. 

Important note, it's massively more effort to grind just the intermediate ship less than halfway up the total grind to PR, than it was to grind the notoriously grindy PEF last year.    Not sure how anyone could call that "misinformation" unless they're just going by what WG says and not doing their own investigation, not checking the math independently. 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Again, conflating THAT they need to make money, with HOW they go about making that money.

The former is never a defense for the latter.

 

As usual KC, you put in a few words the realities, greatly appreciated. 

Thank You.

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If you're willing to put the effort into a wall of text in an attempt to refute the claims, at least grant the same passion to those you're addressing.

The event is preposterous.

Edited by mr_angry_eyes
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1 minute ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Not sure how anyone could call that "misinformation"

He stated it like it was 700% difference to get Puerto Rico from the PEF, I was correcting him that it's 700% harder to get the Gorizia, NOT the Puerto Rico which is harder yet. 

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1 minute ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Important note, it's massively more effort to grind just the intermediate ship less than halfway up the total grind to PR, than it was to grind the notoriously grindy PEF last year.  

This. I was expecting a repeat of PEF for the California and I was ready for that. I was even ready to buy the ship at the start.

I might even have done a PEF-level grind for the Gorizia, if they'd tossed in the usual five tech-tree ships with bells, whistles, port slots and permacamos. 

But no. We get this monster.

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4 minutes ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

Executive Summary:  The rollout of the highly anticipated Holiday Event Package by World of Warships Gaming Staff on 11 December 2019 as part of update 8.11 was met with mixed reviews by the community.  Community Contributors and players alike complained at the lack of snowflake rewards, the grind for Puerto Rico, the lack of transparency regarding capabilities the mid-tier cruiser that could be earned in conjunction with Puerto Rico, and the cost of the German Admiral Lutjens.  While all of these events ARE FREE, players seemed to think that Wargaming was out for a quick money grab, specifically with the Puerto Rico.  The usual tin-foil hat brigades were out in force covering the Santa Gift events and the lack of rewards (mostly ships) that were not appropriately reflected in their cash payment for random containers.  This resulted in an uproar and an ongoing Public Relations issue, which in my opinion is based on little actual merit and is overall, much ado about nothing.

1.  Wargaming was true to their word that everything can be obtained for free.  If you have other life obligations, your boss is not required to pay you for missing work.  Same concept applies with Puerto Rico, WG cannot be held liable for your inability to meet directive requirements.  Plus, they even anticipated this by placing milestones and a mid-tier reward ship along the way.  I think in large part, the player base is missing the "boat" so to speak and failing to appreciate the hard work the WG staff put into this FREE EVENT and the fact that they created milestones to ensure even those who would not be able to 100 percent complete all aspects of the event would not be left empty handed.

2.  Numerous posts have been made showing the horrible disparity between the Puerto Rico and previous reward ships from Winter Holiday Events such as Prinze Eidel Friedich and Graf Spee.  I think there needs to be a candid discussion on this.  Some memes are floating around showing "700%" difference between how the reward ships are earned.  Maybe this is true, but there are other factors being conveniently ignored.  First, there is more time to complete this mission than in previous seasons.  Second, let us consider this is a TIER X ship and not a Tier VI.  That is a huge difference.  If everyone had the Puerto Rico, they would no longer need to grind for credits and other resources and this would impact the game economy again, leading to another Missouri disaster.  I think this is actually a brilliant concept and I am fine if I cannot get access to it in time.  Many will enter the race, few will win.  Its ok as I am looking forward to the containers and other rewards (ship included).

3.  Admiral Lutjens -- 175,000 coal and doesn't cost a player a dime.  If you are getting your coal everyday, it is just a matter of time before you can afford him.  I fail to see why folks are in an uproar over this.  He is a solid commander and I look forward to having him in time.  In fact, I have already planned a way ahead to EARN him.  For those that are requiring immediate gratification, well you can always buy coal with your wallet.

4.  Snowflakes and Steel -- Last year, players earned a lot of steel during the snowflake event.  This year, not so much.  @NoZoupForYou (a highly respected community contributor) made a video yesterday complaining about how he was let down by the lack of steel in this year's event.  Sorry Zoup, no can do, WG has assessed from this year to last and appropriately modified the steel earnings to AGAIN prevent a Missouri economy crisis.  Shoot, even you had your own video on how the Missouri damaged the WoWS economy.  You of ALL people should understand this.  I really think the CCs need to take a step back, do some introspection, and carefully consider talking points before spewing information on behalf of the community.  I look at you all as the "spiritual leaders" of the community.  You start the war drums...it better be something worth falling on a sword for, such as the CV rework, this holiday whine is pathetic at best.  Let us try to make community discordance and reaction at the level necessary to the topic/issue at hand.

In conclusion, players need to understand that WG is a company and FOR PROFIT organization.  They spent countless hours preparing for this event and I am quite pleased with its rollout and the thought that went into it as to not further damage the economy.  Now, had they been a little more transparent as to the WHY, I think they would have avoided the on-going and clearly now debunked issues, but player base is player base and spin issues beyond the scope necessary.  If everything is a crisis what truly is a crisis?  Another closing thought would be to consider if the Puerto Rico is a MUST HAVE or a NICE TO HAVE or a I WANT.  I do not see it dominating the game like Stalingrad did or other premiums.  I think it is an above average ship, but I do not see it as the end all be all of future events, rewards, competitive play or dominating in random battles like those of the Russian persuasion.  People need to take a pill, relax, reconsider, and then they too will reach the inevitable conclusion as I have, that WG is actually acting in the best interests of the longterm/strategic interests of gaming stability and balance.

1. Theoretically yes, it can be done for free. However, with ANY, and I mean ANY, other plans besides WOWS, you cannot get PR. It's practically impossible. A good player with nothing else to do that plays multiple hours a day still cannot do it. Only top players who dedicate their entire Christmas MAY be able to get it for free. So no, it's not free, it's false advertising, and you've just pissed off the rest of the base who have no hope after telling them that a reasonable grind would work. Also, the Campaign is designed to get you to start thinking it's easy, then you hit a wall, and being to far in to give up you pay to finish. That's manipulative and underhanded. The campaign was advertised as a fun (but time consuming) holiday event. Instead it's a blatant cash grab. 

2. The Doubloon price for PR is 58K, $290. Considering T9s are around $100, that's a completely absurd price. There is no sign that PR will have MO economy, it'll be like another T10 premium, which while profitable aren't mints. There is zero justification for that price compared to other ships in the game.

3. Sure he's free. But that's the price of the Georgia. T9 premium BB or special captain? Which one is worth more? It's that comparison that's ridiculous. WG is saying the captain is worth the same as the ship, which is just wrong. People aren't too worked up there, just wondering why WG thinks he's worth the same as a ship.

4. You play the T8s and T9s and get steel. You play a T10 get...4 camoes. Kind of confusing. In the vast majority of cases the reward for a T10 ship is worse than the T9 rewards. That makes sense how?

 

The reason for the outrage is WG took a fun holiday event and turn it into the grind to end all grinds (they basically want you to grind out multiple full lines in a month), or a cash grab. While it's in their right, if they want people to keep playing the game, this isn't the way to keep players happy. Corporations can do whatever they want. But if their customers don't like what they, then they'll stop paying, and the company goes under. So it's in the companies best interest to keep players happy. And pulling the rug out from under people like this is not how you keep them happy.

It's funny, WG just spent a long time telling us that regrinds for RB would take a long time. Then they come and tell us we need to basically due the equivalent to a full RB regrind in a month. They deserve every bit of the shitstorm that's brewing.

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1 minute ago, ArgosRising said:

He stated it like it was 700% difference to get Puerto Rico from the PEF, I was correcting him that it's 700% harder to get the Gorizia, NOT the Puerto Rico which is harder yet. 

Right -- to be clear, I was referring to his claim that it was "misinformation", when ironically he was stating misinformation about the information he was calling misinformation. 

 

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I think it's also important to note that they are directly selling a Tier 10 for money now. Which they promised they'd never do.

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Just now, ArgosRising said:

I think it's also important to note that they are directly selling a Tier 10 for money now. Which they promised they'd never do.

It's not directly when you launder your money through doubloons first! /s

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12 minutes ago, Black_Sheep9 said:

LOL, and this is what we call a shill.

Yeah, name calling is generally unjustified, but this sounds like it came straight from WG.

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22 minutes ago, Gin_Blossoms said:

Rabble, rabble, rabble, I'm a WG employee under an alt account, rabble, rabble....

:Smile_trollface:

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It was a nice concept that turned into a poorly received cash grab. The vast majority of players (except for the typical white knighting) see it for what it is, even the Russian player base is not happy from what I've heard.

It was designed to get players to put effort into it, fall short and then spend cash to complete it. The vast majority of players will never even come close to completion of it.

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Just now, ArgosRising said:

I think it's also important to note that they are directly selling a Tier 10 for money now. Which they promised they'd never do.

 

If someone wants the PR immediately, turns out that they have to pay over $200 "worth" in Doubloons.

 

For other players to consider...  coming out of the PTS, the three dubs boosters were largely speculated to cost in the 8k to 16k range, for all three, and based on PTS, to result in a finished Puerto Rico around 2 weeks into the event from combined instant and per-minute points. 

What we got instead of that... was 24k dubs for the three boosters, and that won't even result in getting the PR finished in time.   No, for that, you also have to grind.  Almost $100 for the ship, and still, the grind.  

If you actually want it immediately, you have to spend, what was it, $234 "worth" in dubs. 

 

And they don't understand why a majority of the playerbase, cutting across whales and free-to-play players, cutting across those who are normally critics and supporters, are hammering them for this move.

 

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Just now, Xenite said:

It was designed to get players to put effort into it, fall short and then spend cash to complete it.

Exactly this. For those who don't understand why people are so upset, this is a HUGE part of it. It's very clearly designed to get you to invest, realize you can't finish it and then spend money to complete it so you didn't just waste several weeks grinding without the reward. It's underhanded and it's greedy to the highest degree.

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