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Kleonixe

Season 14 of ranked and the frustrations from rank 5 to 1.

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So looking at this ranked season so far, I would say I am kind of frustrated with ranks 5-1. While I do admit to having made some pretty bad choices so far in ranked on my ship positioning that has cost me a game or two or spouted off the toxic trash in chat because I was pissed off but, there have been games where I have had almost everyone hiding behind me. Now keep in mind the ship I have been playing has been Stalingrad. The problem that is frustrating me the most is that when everyone hides behind me, I tend to get focused fired because the battleships are hiding behind me not wanting to tank damage as they should. Now I can understand that thunderer and conquerer aren't meant for that but I tend to hold them to similar expectations as other battleships that are tankier given they have a super heal. However, when speaking of other battleships like Kremlin or GK, I have noticed them hiding behind me from time to time as well which can be frustrating because they are meant to be front line ships even though sometimes they will get focused down by the enemy team if they are upfront for too long without support. Now I will admit that I have been too far upfront a few times but there are times where I am back aways from the front lines and I get other battleships hiding behind me which causes me almost every time to get focused by at least 3-5 ships on the enemy team. 

Another frustrating topic that I have been noticing a lot of is the constant usage of Smolensk, conquerers, and thunderers and because of either their super high fire chance due to gun caliber and the nation they are apart of or their high rate of fire with mediocre fire chance. The reason I find this frustrating is not so much because of the ships but because of the number of fires they put up every few minutes right after you put two to three out initially. With the brit battleships, their special he can be deadly to ships like Stalingrad which just love to burn. With the Smolensk, their high rate of fire is lethal in the long term because of the number of shells and smokescreen that the Smolensk gets to help with survivability. Even though I am running a full tank build, I still will get burned down in a matter of a few minutes due to Smolensk's rate of fire and the brit's special he and high fire chance. Even though I do try to use island cover or stay at range, I still get easily melted throughout the game by the high fire chance and rate of fire from those ships. Now before anyone makes any comments, I am not saying that they are bad ships. I am just saying that they are annoying to play against especially given that both Smolensk and the brit battleships can fire at least 15+ km which can be hard to get away from in a Stalingrad with its large turning circle. 

With both of these two things mainly showing up at rank 5, I do feel like I can push on through to rank one but if anyone has any advice on how I can counter the Smolensk and brit bbs, feel free to let me know. Good luck everyone.

Edited by Kleonixe

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The Smolensk has made me hate ranked play in a BB. There should be NO REASON that there is a Russian ship that never existed to be able to fire 130mm at an alarming rate as far as 19.4 km which out distances most ships in the game. At the most this thing should fire 15-16 km just like the other ships with the same caliber of gun. But then you give the damn thing smoke too. This boat is just stupid. 

 

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2 minutes ago, desmo_2 said:

When was Season 11? A year ago?

I meant to put season 14 but I forgot what season it was lol

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3 minutes ago, Filthy_Pelican said:

The Smolensk has made me hate ranked play in a BB. There should be NO REASON that there is a Russian ship that never existed to be able to fire 130mm at an alarming rate as far as 19.4 km which out distances most ships in the game. At the most this thing should fire 15-16 km just like the other ships with the same caliber of gun. But then you give the damn thing smoke too. This boat is just stupid. 

 

She's a good ship in the hands of a skilled player even though I will admit she is kind of noob-friendly. But the range I feel like they need to nerf to Worchester levels or heck even Atlanta levels

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21 minutes ago, clammboy said:

I couldn't read this its too much sorry .

TL:DR - Op is primarily playing the strongest cruiser in the game, and is annoyed that anyone would have the audacity to play ships that counter it (IE Stalingrad and HE firing ships).  He is also annoyed that its a camp fest...which is ironic, because that is what I've seen most Stalingrads do these days (hang back, farm damage, and push late with most of their health intact).

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2 hours ago, Kleonixe said:

both of these two things mainly showing up at rank 5, I do feel like I can push on through to rank one but if anyone has any advice on how I can counter the Smolensk and brit bbs, feel free to let me know. Good luck everyone.

Shoot back. 

Seriously, you are driving a Stalingrad, you have great guns, you should know how to play, position, anticipate and shoot the enemy by now. 

Edited by UltimateNewbie

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1 hour ago, Old_Baldy_One said:

TL:DR - Op is primarily playing the strongest cruiser in the game, and is annoyed that anyone would have the audacity to play ships that counter it (IE Stalingrad and HE firing ships).  He is also annoyed that its a camp fest...which is ironic, because that is what I've seen most Stalingrads do these days (hang back, farm damage, and push late with most of their health intact).

I've also seen more Conqs and Thunderers in the just completed season of CBs than in the past (well, with just the Conqs, since the Thunderer is new).  The way I see it is that if you're playing a Conq or possibly to a lesser degree the Thunderer, your intention is to be patient and burn down your targets rather than spank them silly with multi-citadel volleys, which is why you'd play something like a Yamato or Montana.

And yes, these two HE spamming BBs are well built to counter bow tanking BBs in general, and ships like the Stalingrad and the Kremlin.

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16 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Shoot back. 

Seriously, you are driving a Stalingrad, you have great guns, you should know how to play, position, anticipate and shoot the enemy by now. 

20k games... and the strategic part of that still escapes me...

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36 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

20k games... and the strategic part of that still escapes me...

Well, I’m no expert, but I think good tactical positioning involves:

1) moving close enough to the enemy to do damage, but far enough away so the enemy won’t focus you or so you can have cover or concealment to break contact and heal up.

2) knowing likely places the enemy will be, and moving into a place that give advantageous firing angles into such hidey-holes. 

3) knowing likely enemy avenues of attack, and the timing for not being there when the blind fire torpedoes or the push comes through on your exposed flank.

4) maintaining awareness of where your key counter ships are, eg radar cruisers, or carrier planes etc if you are stealthy; HE spammers and/or DDs if you are are a BB; battleships if you are a squishy cruiser. Knowing where they are, you position yourself to passively avoid them if possible, without constraining your offensive options (eg, a DD driving between two caps, spots a radar cruiser next to cap A, then opts for cap B, etc).

There is also strategic positioning. This typically involves wresting map control from the enemy, fighting for control points, and fighting for time (the most precious strategic resource of all).

1) understanding whether you are on your team’s weak flank, or strong flank. Most yes don’t split evenly; usually 2/3 go one way and 1/3 go the other way. 

2) understanding whether you are facing the enemy’s strong flank or weak flank. If you are strong and they are weak, you should be trying to push, so adopt an aggressive positioning. If you are weak and they are strong, then start kiting early to trade space for time; don’t get caught stuck behind an indefensible position like alone behind an island. Kite early. 

3) understanding what objectives need to be captured by when to win the game - sometimes taking yourself out of battle and taking the undefended objective wins games, sometimes that can cost you games. Typically chasing the indefended cap and still being in effective firing range range of the enemy in transit is strong.

4) awareness of whether your team has a material (ie ship) advantage before exposing yourself to enemy fire, or whether you have a points lead, or both, determines whether you need aggressive or passive positioning. 

 

Hope that helps!

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1 hour ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Shoot back. 

Seriously, you are driving a Stalingrad, you have great guns, you should know how to play, position, anticipate and shoot the enemy by now. 

I do shoot back, especially at those three ships. However, I seem to get focused down all the time because from what I have seen people will hide behind me a lot which keeps me from being really impactful in the fight.

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Just now, UltimateNewbie said:

Well, I’m no expert, but I think good tactical positioning involves:

1) moving close enough to the enemy to do damage, but far enough away so the enemy won’t focus you or so you can have cover or concealment to break contact and heal up.

2) knowing likely places the enemy will be, and moving into a place that give advantageous firing angles into such hidey-holes. 

3) knowing likely enemy avenues of attack, and the timing for not being there when the blind fire torpedoes or the push comes through on your exposed flank.

4) maintaining awareness of where your key counter ships are, eg radar cruisers, or carrier planes etc if you are stealthy; HE spammers and/or DDs if you are are a BB; battleships if you are a squishy cruiser. Knowing where they are, you position yourself to passively avoid them if possible, without constraining your offensive options (eg, a DD driving between two caps, spots a radar cruiser next to cap A, then opts for cap B, etc).

There is also strategic positioning. This typically involves wresting map control from the enemy, fighting for control points, and fighting for time (the most precious strategic resource of all).

1) understanding whether you are on your team’s weak flank, or strong flank. Most yes don’t split evenly; usually 2/3 go one way and 1/3 go the other way. 

2) understanding whether you are facing the enemy’s strong flank or weak flank. If you are strong and they are weak, you should be trying to push, so adopt an aggressive positioning. If you are weak and they are strong, then start kiting early to trade space for time; don’t get caught stuck behind an indefensible position like alone behind an island. Kite early. 

3) understanding what objectives need to be captured by when to win the game - sometimes taking yourself out of battle and taking the undefended objective wins games, sometimes that can cost you games. Typically chasing the indefended cap and still being in effective firing range range of the enemy in transit is strong.

4) awareness of whether your team has a material (ie ship) advantage before exposing yourself to enemy fire, or whether you have a points lead, or both, determines whether you need aggressive or passive positioning. 

 

Hope that helps!

Ultimate from reading what you just wrote, I am thinking my strategic positioning might need work to help minimize how much focus fire I am taking from the three heavy he spammers.

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2 minutes ago, Kleonixe said:

I do shoot back, especially at those three ships. However, I seem to get focused down all the time because from what I have seen people will hide behind me a lot which keeps me from being really impactful in the fight.

Then pay more attention to your team’s disposition before exposing yourself to enemy fire, particularly without a pre-formed escape plan.

See my suggestions above. 

Edit: good man.

Edited by UltimateNewbie

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One of the problems early game I seem to run into is trying to figure out which flank to support. I usually go with the weak flank most of the time to try to provide support. Do you think that is a good move Ultimate?

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2 hours ago, Old_Baldy_One said:

TL:DR - Op is primarily playing the strongest cruiser in the game, and is annoyed that anyone would have the audacity to play ships that counter it (IE Stalingrad and HE firing ships).  He is also annoyed that its a camp fest...which is ironic, because that is what I've seen most Stalingrads do these days (hang back, farm damage, and push late with most of their health intact).

Hey old, it's not that I am annoyed that people are playing the ship to counter another, it is just the constant barrage of he that gets old after a while. I am fine with the ships, just not how often I catch on fire in Stalingrad when I have a full tank build for her. 

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3 minutes ago, Kleonixe said:

One of the problems early game I seem to run into is trying to figure out which flank to support. I usually go with the weak flank most of the time to try to provide support. Do you think that is a good move Ultimate?

I think it depends. And this is why being dynamic and reading the flow of battle is very important. 

I typically go to the flank that I spawned on, strong or weak. I think transiting across your team’s backline can cede the initiative to the enemy. 

If in the centre, then I pick a side - usually I have a preferred side of the map for the given ship I am in - open water for battleships and heavy cruisers, closed space like islands for DDs and light cruisers. 

Mine on the flank I am always watching the minimap to see if I am on the strong or weak side, and so whether I need to kite or push, and also whether the other flank completely collapses and exposes my flanks. 

If I think there is time and merit, I might go to assist the other flank from a centre-ish position, but I do so fully aware that it is high risk and I am exposing myself to hits from the whole map  I just hope they are too fixated on the enemy in front of them.

So, in summary I would say no - don’t just drive to the weak flank. Think about the whole battlespace, and your role in it. 

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1 minute ago, UltimateNewbie said:

I think it depends. And this is why being dynamic and reading the flow of battle is very important. 

I typically go to the flank that I spawned on, strong or weak. I think transiting across your team’s backline can cede the initiative to the enemy. 

If in the centre, then I pick a side - usually I have a preferred side of the map for the given ship I am in - open water for battleships and heavy cruisers, closed space like islands for DDs and light cruisers. 

Mine on the flank I am always watching the minimap to see if I am on the strong or weak side, and so whether I need to kite or push, and also whether the other flank completely collapses and exposes my flanks. 

If I think there is time and merit, I might go to assist the other flank from a centre-ish position, but I do so fully aware that it is high risk and I am exposing myself to hits from the whole map  I just hope they are too fixated on the enemy in front of them.

So, in summary I would say no - don’t just drive to the weak flank. Think about the whole battlespace, and your role in it. 

Alright thanks, man, I think this advice will help me get around the issue that I am currently having when it comes to getting past rank 5.

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2 minutes ago, Kleonixe said:

Alright thanks, man, I think this advice will help me get around the issue that I am currently having when it comes to getting past rank 5.

Cool, good luck!

 

btw, please feel free to forget everything if I am on the red team :-p

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1 minute ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Cool, good luck!

 

btw, please feel free to forget everything if I am on the red team :-p

I hope your aren't lol. Plus I would rather stay alive than dead. But if I have to die, then I will go down swinging.

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comrade, you have the balansgrad. it's probably a better tank than most battleships. i have premium dcp rp and floatplanes on monty, with 5% flag, so something like 86 second cd on repair party, and rarely do i get to repair twice. most players won't push until they're the last ship floating on the team. then they either snipe a couple barely floating red ships, or run to the farthest corner of the map trying not to die. support is nonexistent in wows. 

smol can and indeed prefers to shoot over medium high islands a la pepsi. even if you see it, your guns probably shoot too flat to hit it behind the island. you can try to pressure the ship spotting for smol, but if it's a battleship and your team is all hiding, good luck. go dark or reverse out of range. i haven't seen conq or republique at rank 10 but thunderer is there a lot and ohio.

someone said there's no irrevocable ranks above rank 12, is that right?

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2 minutes ago, Kleonixe said:

I hope your aren't lol. Plus I would rather stay alive than dead. But if I have to die, then I will go down swinging.

Haha. 

Well, on that, it’s better to take a little bit of damage throughout the battle, because you can heal up and still take the heat off your team, than a whole bunch of damage all at once but nothing for the rest of the battle.

But if you do have to eat a lot of damage, at the individual level it’s better to do that at the end of battle, because a full HP cruiser or DD can strategically deny a low HP cruiser or DD even without firing a shot; conversely your full hp ship can still take caps or risk shooting at a low HP counter ship and potentially survive, where a low HP ship cannot.

I think BBs are the exception though, as if you haven’t ranked damage all battle then you haven’t been doing your job; your team is less healthy than they could have been, and your enemies could have been losing time between salvos traversing their turrets, etc. 

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1 minute ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Haha. 

Well, on that, it’s better to take a little bit of damage throughout the battle, because you can heal up and still take the heat off your team, than a whole bunch of damage all at once but nothing for the rest of the battle.

But if you do have to eat a lot of damage, at the individual level it’s better to do that at the end of battle, because a full HP cruiser or DD can strategically deny a low HP cruiser or DD even without firing a shot; conversely your full hp ship can still take caps or risk shooting at a low HP counter ship and potentially survive, where a low HP ship cannot.

I think BBs are the exception though, as if you haven’t ranked damage all battle then you haven’t been doing your job; your team is less healthy than they could have been, and your enemies could have been losing time between salvos traversing their turrets, etc. 

I agree with you on that, I do prefer to have as much health as possible even though that doesn't happen all the time lol

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My final observation about this thread: god damn autocorrect for changing words into things I clearly did not type. Sigh. Sorry for the litter of typos and fail words - too many to edit. 

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56 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Hope that helps!

Tactically I do well enough, I just don’t seem to be able to read the situation strategically.

As @Destroyer_KuroshioKai rightly pointed out in a replay review, I don’t seem to able to recognize when to leave well enough alone, and to go somewhere else.

I wouldn’t say that’s completely true; I’ve recognized potential threats to a Standard base and been in place to deal with them when they developed, but that’s still more tactical than strategic...

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