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Co op Mercy Rule Bah!

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shot-19_11.14_14_35.20-0981.thumb.jpg.7b19a1397e29fb061d669ed9d60d4127.jpgNo quarter ask! No quarter given! Mercy rule co op ers read it and weep!

Jump bad and post your my XPs were stolen by the sniff sniff Mercy Rule!

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I'm weeping

Spoiler

Maybe

 

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1 hour ago, Femennenly said:

In that we recognized Coop battles tend to finish when one of teams reach 0 points much less often then Random battles.

That is why I started this thread to show that co op battles are not ending quickly just due to the so called mercy rule.

1 hour ago, Femennenly said:

We are not adverse to doing this but would like to explore alternative options first.

That is why I suggest this.

I suggest that for co op  teams should be 12 v 12 and there be only 1 victory condition and only 1. The winner is the team that eliminates all of the opponents before time expires. For the human team if any enemy shift is surviving when time expires the human team loses. No points, no capture objectives just sink them all. That gives every human player the opportunity to maximize their damage done XP and eliminates the battle ending quickly.

Since those wanting no so called mercy rule ending in co op this should solve the problem. They only want to win by destroying all the enemy ships so they can get the maximum damage caused XP. They aren't interested in strategy, only destruction and they certainly don't care to lose.

Give them this and be done with it. It could  also be added to random by eliminating capture points and the current ship point system and replacing it with points based on damage dealt. 1 HP damage equals 1 point scored for ones team. The winning team is the one that destroys all the enemy or has the most team points when time expires. That would please those who play random and also want only to destroy other ships and max their damage caused XP.

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Why would we want to eliminate any chance of capping in Co-op when there are a significant number of missions and tasks that require capping and defense ribbons? 

Why would we want to eliminate any chance of capping in Co-op when there good XP and credits are to be had from capping? 

Why would we want 12v12 when all it would do is:

  • Turn the battles into cluttered, claustrophic messes like most Random battles.
  • Greatly increase the chances of bots on the green team. 
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1 hour ago, Femennenly said:

So following up on this as seems to be a popular topic the last few weeks and I have some additional details to share:

  • Coop has the same settings for the battle modes as Random battles do. Therefore the concept of “Mercy rule” is not unique to Coop, however we recognize it occurs more in this mode.
  • In that we recognized Coop battles tend to finish when one of teams reach 0 points much less often then Random battles.
    • E.g: Coop tier VIII battles end by eliminating the whole team in 79% – 92% battles (depending on battle mode).
    • In Random it is true for 17% – 44% of battles.
  • Since Coop and Random battles work on the same system, making a change would separate these modes, and require individual development going forward. 
    • We are not adverse to doing this but would like to explore alternative options first.
  • Some changes were make to Coop 8.10 and we would like to see how these changes will impact this "mercy rule" concern, before proceeding with additional potential changes. 

We will monitor the situation and how the changes impact the length of Coop battles and the way they end. If it will be needed then there will be some additional changes.

Fem, 

You should realize that the OP of this thread isn't making serious suggestions, he's just trolling Co-op players who want to improve the mode.

A "mercy rule" exists to spare the side that's getting steam-rolled in player vs player contest from having to sit through a long drawn-out execution in a battle that's a foregone conclusion.  No such rule is necessary in Co-op, because the opponents are all bots.

The rule kicks in more in Randoms because it takes more kills to completely eliminate a team, while the point system remains the same, that's all.

 

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter
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4 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

You should realize that the OP of this thread isn't making serious suggestions, he's just trolling Co-op players who want to improve the mode.

 

Killjoy, you were doing fine up until you claimed that coop players just want to "improve the mode".  That's utter nonsense.  I made a list of possible improvements to coop in another thread, none of which involved eliminating the mercy rule.  The mercy rule is just fine as is.

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8 minutes ago, Crucis said:

Killjoy, you were doing fine up until you claimed that coop players just want to "improve the mode".  That's utter nonsense.  I made a list of possible improvements to coop in another thread, none of which involved eliminating the mercy rule.  The mercy rule is just fine as is.

And yet it's perhaps the #1 change that Co-op mains ask for, and one of the biggest, most consistently reported aggravations for Co-op mains.

Getting rid of it would remove a major source of frustration for Co-op battles, which would make the game more enjoyable -- that is, it would improve the mode.

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter
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17 hours ago, KilljoyCutter said:

And yet it's perhaps the #1 change that Co-op mains ask for, and one of the biggest, most consistently reported aggravations for Co-op mains.

Getting rid of it would remove a major source of frustration for Co-op battles, which would make the game more enjoyable -- that is, it would improve the mode.

 

No, it wouldn't improve the mode.  Not in the slightest.  This entire thing is a wonderful example of the utter shallowness of people and their inability to think things through in a logical manner.  It's more valuable to just get the battles over more quickly and move on to the next one, than to waste time chasing down some enemy bot ship or 2 just so that 1-3 people can get some minor benefit from it.

Edited by Crucis
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27 minutes ago, Crucis said:

No, it wouldn't improve the mode.  Not in the slightest.  This entire thing is a wonderful example of the utter shallowness of people and their ability to think things through in a logical manner.  It's more valuable to just get the battles over more quickly and move on to the next one, than to waste time chasing down some enemy bot ship or 2 just so that 1-3 people can get some minor benefit from it.

There's nothing valuable about rushing through a series of battles that don't provide any enjoyment or payout, wasting daily multipliers and any camos or signals that might have been used. 

And this "chasing down the carrier" thing is a giant canard -- most of the time it happens it's 1+ red bot BBs that are still afloat when the "mercy rule" kicks in, already engaged in combat with the green team.  

I'm sick of getting off a volley or spread on an enemy ship at medium or close range... only to have it stop halfway to the target and the after-battle screen come up.  "Mercy rule" kicking in is one of the biggest letdowns that can happen in this game.  In the middle of a fight, slugging it out with the enemy, and then clunk.   

 

 

 

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter
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1 hour ago, KilljoyCutter said:

You should realize that the OP of this thread isn't making serious suggestions, he's just trolling Co-op players who want to improve the mode.

I am doing no such thing! I to would like to see co op altered/improved more. If anything is being trolled it is the senseless bunk being proffered about a so called mercy rule. I have played many co op battles today and only the most recent one ended with 1 enemy bot remaining.  I had several more but the I net here in this nursing home kept going out before I could screen cap and post.

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To prevent the "mercy rule", all the human team has to do is lose two ships. Just let a couple of team mates die and you can farm the bots. If the match drags on, be careful about your capping points and you should be good. 

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3 hours ago, KilljoyCutter said:

I'm sick of getting off a volley or spread on an enemy ship at medium or close range... only to have it stop halfway to the target and the after-battle screen come up.  "Mercy rule" kicking in is one of the biggest letdowns that can happen in this game.  In the middle of a fight, slugging it out with the enemy, and then clunk.   

Absolutely agree. It is the most frustrating rule in the game.

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I find co op over way to quick. Not enough targets, not enough loot. Why I only play it anymore when getting used to a new ship for a few games. Maybe make it 9 verses 12. Run out of enemy ships to shoot to soon. And rarely see any teamwork, usually every man for himself trying to secure as much damage and kills as possible, at the expense of shooting and torping team mates. Might as well get rid of bots, have no teams, just let every player kill other players. Spawn everyone spread out around the map. Last player floating with most kills/damage wins....

Edited by Frigate007
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13 minutes ago, Frigate007 said:

I find co op over way to quick. Not enough targets, not enough loot. Why I only play it anymore when getting used to a new ship for a few games. Maybe make it 9 verses 12. Run out of enemy ships to shoot to soon. And rarely see any teamwork, usually every man for himself trying to secure as much damage and kills as possible, at the expense of shooting and torping team mates. Might as well get rid of bots, have no teams, just let every player kill other players. Spawn everyone spread out around the map. Last player floating with most kills/damage wins....

Another attempt to turn co-op into an entirely different thing than it is.

 

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12 hours ago, Taylor3006 said:

all the human team has to do is lose two ships

Specifically, not as mutual suicides or exchanges for a ship of the same type. 

I'm reminded of the scene in "Alien: Resurrection" in which a bunch of the xenomorphs gang up on one of their number and deliberately tear it apart so that the acid will melt a hole in the floor of their cage. Let's hope it doesn't come to that! :Smile_trollface:

14 hours ago, KilljoyCutter said:

I'm sick of getting off a volley or spread on an enemy ship at medium or close range... only to have it stop halfway to the target and the after-battle screen come up.  "Mercy rule" kicking in is one of the biggest letdowns that can happen in this game.  In the middle of a fight, slugging it out with the enemy, and then clunk.   

This. If you're not addressing this, you're not actually addressing the problem.

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6 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Another attempt to turn co-op into an entirely different thing than it is.

 

What is it now? What purpose does it serve other than to guarantee a 100% win rate?

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51 minutes ago, Frigate007 said:

What is it now? What purpose does it serve other than to guarantee a 100% win rate?

To avoid the crowded, claustrophobic, and often toxic nature of Randoms.

To be an enjoyable, relaxing distraction after work, as opposed to the adrenaline junky freebasing of PVP.

To just have a good time trying new ships and blowing up bots and checking out aspects of the game.

 

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@Femennenly I understand not wanting two sets of code for the modes but it seems like you could address the issue by just giving the bots a larger initial point lead. If both teams start with something like 450 points rather than the default 300 it would probably help. 
 

It is frustrating to see the game end abruptly when there are still targets you are actually shooting. 

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20 hours ago, Femennenly said:

So following up on this as seems to be a popular topic the last few weeks and I have some additional details to share:

  • Coop has the same settings for the battle modes as Random battles do. Therefore the concept of “Mercy rule” is not unique to Coop, however we recognize it occurs more in this mode.
  • In that we recognized Coop battles tend to finish when one of teams reach 0 points much less often then Random battles.
    • E.g: Coop tier VIII battles end by eliminating the whole team in 79% – 92% battles (depending on battle mode).
    • In Random it is true for 17% – 44% of battles.
  • Since Coop and Random battles work on the same system, making a change would separate these modes, and require individual development going forward. 
    • We are not adverse to doing this but would like to explore alternative options first.
  • Some changes were make to Coop 8.10 and we would like to see how these changes will impact this "mercy rule" concern, before proceeding with additional potential changes. 

We will monitor the situation and how the changes impact the length of Coop battles and the way they end. If it will be needed then there will be some additional changes.

Fem, 

IOW we will watch what happens and hope that by the time 6 months passes everybody will have forgotten about this.  Got it.  

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7 minutes ago, comtedumas said:

IOW we will watch what happens and hope that by the time 6 months passes everybody will have forgotten about this.  Got it.  

I'm willing to wait and see what they actually do.

 

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13 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

I'm willing to wait and see what they actually do.

 

Make a reminder then, in 6 months you wont remember otherwise.

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