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Modeling stupidity - what are your "favorite" nits to pick?

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Overall, the models in WoWs are very strong. BUT, there are also a TON of errors. The late dseehafer was adamant that Tirptiz rode too high in the water (and created several threads to prove that this was the case). This particular nitpick is understandable because premium ships are supposed to be as close to their real-world counterparts as is possible.

However, that doesn't exclude tech tree ships from sporting some truly stupid flubs - especially those that come as a result of Wargaming getting "creative."

I'm just going to post two of my top nits, and see if people add any of their own (I know of a few others off the top of my head):

Nit to pick #1: Iron Duke's single funnel.

It's not that I take issue with Wargaming giving Iron Duke a theoretical refit per se, it's that this particular one makes absolutely no sense. Angling or trunking funnels from the deck-up was a relatively minor change that a lot of navies performed to their battleships at one time or another.

aMMxbIw.jpg

u896452inp_1024x1024.jpeg?v=1451685848

Straight-up MERGING two funnels into one was a lot more work because large amounts of internal space had to be retooled for it to function (you typically didn't outright eliminate a funnel unless you were going in on a complete overhaul, such as with Warspite's last big refit). Clearly, this is not the case with Iron Duke, who otherwise appears to be in a pseudo 1920ish guise, with no reworking to her superstructure, etc. So, given that this is the 1920 iteration of the ship, she should have both stacks.

624Glar.png

Moreover, this funnel change makes no sense from a practical standpoint. The British were notorious for placing their funnels badly with relation to their spotting tops on the foremast. Although the most egregious example was with the Orion class, where some crews were nearly asphyxiated when the ship was moving forward, a backing wind could produce this effect on any dreadnought where the funnel was too near to the mainmast. 

47eDMGG.jpg

This was - to degrees - gradually rectified in successive classes, but was really a problem for a number of ships into the 1930s. IF a funnel were to be eliminated, you can be DAMNED SURE that it would have been the forward one, not the rear one.

D4DU4eb.png

 

Nit to pick #2: Konig's blind bridge

I take pretty big issue with most of Wargaming's German ship refits. Bayern's is passable in the looks department, but grants her completely ludicrous speed; Kaiser's and Konig's are both wholesale visual abortions that ruin what were once really, really lovely (in a minimalist sense) battleships. 

jb6yuQa.jpg

vH0PGcX.jpg

But my biggest beef with Konig's silly refit isn't that it turns her into the military equivalent of a gangling, be-speckled teenager, but that the changes don't even make sense. In fact... they render the ship's conning tower - essentially the heart of the vessel when in combat - completely useless.

The addition of a huge, clumsy rangefinder on top of the "Bruno" turret, capped by an enormous (but apparently [given her pathetic AA rating] never-manned) anti aircraft emplacement actually blocks out all possible forward view from the conning tower. The men stationed there could look up, down, slightly left or right... and they'd see absolutely nothing. It's like putting blinders on a race horse and on the rider. 

rBpCJ2P.png

So, anyway, those are my two. Anyone have any others?

 

Edited by Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal
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Friesland doesn't have a camo based on this:

2ZkbMLr.jpg

anqdXCsuHVMn3hXW4VbvgcJGW_ZqKDSLDl2bPils

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1 minute ago, Lert said:

Friesland doesn't have a camo based on this:

2ZkbMLr.jpg

anqdXCsuHVMn3hXW4VbvgcJGW_ZqKDSLDl2bPils

Nor do the guns elevate high enough. I was really looking forward to being able to do something like this, just to look at it:

Hr._Ms._Friesland_(1956).jpg

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Where do we begin...

5" guns on the Lexington...

15" guns on the Gneisenau...

30 second torpedo reloads..

Aiming as if I am standing still, rather than moving.

And let's not get started with the HSF Harekaze...  or is that Hare-zuki?  Probably the most OP T8 DD there is.

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11 minutes ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

Overall, the models in WoWs are very strong. BUT, there are also a TON of errors. The late dseehafer was adamant that Tirptiz rode too high in the water (and created several threads to prove that this was the case). This particular nitpick is understandable because premium ships are supposed to be as close to their real-world counterparts as is possible.

However, that doesn't exclude tech tree ships from sporting some truly stupid flubs - especially those that come as a result of Wargaming getting "creative."

I'm just going to post two of my top nits, and see if people add any of their own (I know of a few others off the top of my head):

Nit to pick #1: Iron Duke's single funnel.

It's not that I take issue with Wargaming giving Iron Duke a theoretical refit per se, it's that this particular one makes absolutely no sense. Angling or trunking funnels from the deck-up was a relatively minor change that a lot of navies performed to their battleships at one time or another.

624Glar.png

Totally agree on the Iron Duke. Fun fact: The Duke served throughout WW2 in Scapa Flow as a harbor defence ship and later as a half-sunk floating AA battery. And to the day she went to the breakers in 1948, she had BOTH FUNNELS!

image.png.946cb46bf14aa36d4e6db7025bcf4548.png

My other pet peeve is the grotesque funnel cap "cool modern look" on the pre-1930 German battleships.

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2 minutes ago, AVR_Project said:

Where do we begin...

5" guns on the Lexington...

15" guns on the Gneisenau...

30 second torpedo reloads..

Aiming as if I am standing still, rather than moving.

And let's not get started with the HSF Harekaze...  or is that Hare-zuki?  Probably the most OP T8 DD there is.

Gneisenau's 15" guns aren't that bizarre. In fact, when she was damaged following the Channel Run, the long term plan was to refit her with those.

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Maybe we can petition the devs to at least give us an "A" hull (or rework the existing model) for the Iron Duke that shows the proper two funnels if we ask pretty please? They yielded and put Swordfish on the Ark Royal, so perhaps we can sweet-talk them into giving the flagship of the Grand Fleet at Jutland her due?

@FemennenIy @Umbaretz

Edited by TF77

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2 minutes ago, TF77 said:

Maybe we can petition the devs to at least give us an "A" hull (or rework the existing model) for the Iron Duke that shows the proper two funnels if we ask pretty please? They yielded and put Swordfish on the Ark Royal, so perhaps we can sweet-talk them into giving the flagship of the Grand Fleet at Jutland her due?

@FemennenIy @Umbaretz

Or give us Emperor of India as a throw-away tier 4 premium with a slower reload and nonexistent AA.

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1 minute ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

Or give us Emperor of India as a throw-away tier 4 premium with a slower reload and nonexistent AA.

Not a bad idea. Going forward, I'd like to hear a solemn promise that if they ever introduce the Splendid Cats and the Invincibles that they come out true to form, not "modernized". Ditto the early German battlecruisers.

Thankfully, the Mighty Hood is a real beauty.

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11 minutes ago, TF77 said:

Not a bad idea. Going forward, I'd like to hear a solemn promise that if they ever introduce the Splendid Cats and the Invincibles that they come out true to form, not "modernized". Ditto the early German battlecruisers.

Thankfully, the Mighty Hood is a real beauty.

Sorry, all battlecruisers are now slated to be tier 9 and 10 monstrosities labeled as cruisers. HMS Queen Mary vs. Yamato anyone?

:Smile_sceptic:

Edited by Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal

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2 hours ago, Lert said:

Friesland doesn't have a camo based on this:

2ZkbMLr.jpg

anqdXCsuHVMn3hXW4VbvgcJGW_ZqKDSLDl2bPils

WG ... do that.... please...

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19 minutes ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

Sorry, all battlecruisers are now slated to be tier 9 and 10 monstrosities labeled as cruisers. HMS Queen Mary vs. Yamato anyone?

:Smile_sceptic:

By what alchemy or hatef*ckery can you conjure a T9 version of this? :cap_hmm:

image.png.373ac21e8c91a72e6054447260b64179.png

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6 minutes ago, TF77 said:

By what alchemy or hatef*ckery can you conjure a T9 version of this? :cap_hmm:

image.png.373ac21e8c91a72e6054447260b64179.png

They made Siegfried a tier 9 cruiser. Like I said in that other thread - it crossed a line. Now every battlecruiser is fair game for King Spreadsheet's "magic touch."

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1 hour ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

This particular nitpick is understandable because premium ships are supposed to be as close to their real-world counterparts as is possible.

And yet, look at what WeeGee did to poor PEF.

1280px-Mackensen_class_battlecruisers_sc

5b3e7d32e4571_2018-07-05at22-11-07.png.a

:fish_palm:

1 hour ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

Kaiser's and Konig's are both wholesale visual abortions that ruin what were once really, really lovely (in a minimalist sense) battleships.

To add insult to injury, the only historical version of Kaiser, the Konig Albert, has been condemned to the supercontainer abyss. Way to go WeeGee, way to go. 

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I always like to complain about clipping flags while moving in reverse:Smile_trollface:

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22 minutes ago, Wolcott said:

And yet, look at what WeeGee did to poor PEF.

1280px-Mackensen_class_battlecruisers_sc

5b3e7d32e4571_2018-07-05at22-11-07.png.a

:fish_palm:

To add insult to injury, the only historical version of Kaiser, the Konig Albert, has been condemned to the supercontainer abyss. Way to go WeeGee, way to go. 

I don't understand why, either. Yes, KA is strong, but is she strong proportionally to, say, Nikolai? I'd argue no.

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2 hours ago, Battlecruiser_PrncsRoyal said:

Gneisenau's 15" guns aren't that bizarre. In fact, when she was damaged following the Channel Run, the long term plan was to refit her with those.

IIRC she was originally designed to carry 15" rifles, but they weren't ready. The 11" option was always meant to be temporary.

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My gripes tend to be turret related. Monarch for instance, wth are Nelson type turrets doing on a KGV preliminary design? They should be squared off, just like KGV, Lion, Conq, and Thud. Other notables are Kii and Izumo. The IJN was very much done with roof mounted sighting hoods, just like the Royal Navy, after WWI ended. Nagato and possibly the original plan for the Amagi were to be the last ships to have turrets like that. The Tosa and Kii classes, plus their follow-ons were to have up-to-date sighting ports mounted on the sides of the turrets, to say nothing of the Yamato class preliminaries. Kii has several other issues with her half-done refit and one more she shares with Izumo is the improper (or for Izumo, complete lack of) turret mounted rangefinders. The IJN was very big on massive rangefinders, including the secondary ones mounted to turrets. Kii's are too small, and Izumo lacks them completely (leading to a critical lack of redundancy, something you'd expect of a BB design). Ashitaka's triple 25's I can understand from a balance POV, but some things go too far (mostly still talking about Kii's lazy half-refit, needs more bulge and reinforced deck slopes, as seen on Nagato and Amagi). 

Edited by CaptHarlock_222
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2 hours ago, AVR_Project said:

Where do we begin...

5" guns on the Lexington...

 

That's because tech tree ships are considered to be 'composite sketches' of the class as a whole. Lex did not get that refit, but Saratoga did, and so would Lex had she survived to get it. It's a balance thing in that case, unless you want to go around at T8 with minimal LR AA mounts and quad 1.1" guns.

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1 hour ago, TF77 said:

By what alchemy or hatef*ckery can you conjure a T9 version of this? :cap_hmm:

image.png.373ac21e8c91a72e6054447260b64179.png

Easy. Suppose a fictional upgrade, ship now does 32knts, those guns are now 18" with 30sec traverse. Add appropriate armor for T9, stick AA mounts all over the place. RN heal, a decent detection, and an Italian smoke that only has a gun bloom of 4 km. Oh and hydro so it's like DoY. Done, sell for 250K coal or in 3 premium shop bundles a $120, $150, and $180. Ignore riot from any historically minded players, (already tuned out ship is OP crowd) and profit.

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33 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

Easy. Suppose a fictional upgrade, ship now does 32knts, those guns are now 18" with 30sec traverse. Add appropriate armor for T9, stick AA mounts all over the place. RN heal, a decent detection, and an Italian smoke that only has a gun bloom of 4 km. Oh and hydro so it's like DoY. Done, sell for 250K coal or in 3 premium shop bundles a $120, $150, and $180. Ignore riot from any historically minded players, (already tuned out ship is OP crowd) and profit.

You forgot the fugly "modern" funnel caps and pink weeb perma camo. :Smile_teethhappy:

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3 minutes ago, TF77 said:

You forgot the fugly "modern" funnel caps and pink weeb perma camo. :Smile_teethhappy:

Nah, get some random artist to make a perma camo that has no relation to ships and includes components that look suspiciously like the beverage he was drinking while designing and then sell that for 8K doubloons extra. You got to go all the way with these things.

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1 hour ago, CaptHarlock_222 said:

That's because tech tree ships are considered to be 'composite sketches' of the class as a whole. Lex did not get that refit, but Saratoga did, and so would Lex had she survived to get it. It's a balance thing in that case, unless you want to go around at T8 with minimal LR AA mounts and quad 1.1" guns.

Of course, the 4 x 2 8" guns could make for a pretty comical "duel of the secondaries" against a Kaga or GZ. :Smile_teethhappy:

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Make Lexington the Saratoga! Issue solved....My beef is where are Essex, Yorktown, Wasp and Bogue? Where is Indomitable? Where are Hiryu and Akagi?They dangled the CVs in front of us for months and now won't fill out the lines....and note that I am not necessarily a CV player to any great degree....

Edited by GrandAdmiral_2016

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