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LWM Smolensk Review is up.

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Miss Mouse has her review of Smolensk up on Shipcomrade. It's funny as hell.

Here's the link.

As a proud Smolensk owner, can confirm.

Edited by l_Do_Not_Care
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Or we could just click on the new post below yours and read it here ...

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6 minutes ago, l_Do_Not_Care said:

Miss Mouse has her review of Smolensk up on Shipcomrade. It's funny as hell.

Here's the link.

As a proud Smolensk owner, can confirm.

Thanks. You're right, it is pretty funny. :Smile_teethhappy:

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She pretty much outlines what I've been saying for years about soviet bias in this game. 

Where every nation other than soviet has one or two strengths they pay for those by having weaknesses that balance the advantages out. Soviet ships however, do not. They are purposely designed so they don't really have a single strong point. They have multiple,  seemingly minor strengths that on their own don't amount to much...but they do synergize to make their ships be significantly more potent than other nations. Weaknesses on soviet ships are always minor weaknesses that never counteract the strengths the ships have. Most importantly, their weaknesses are nulled out by one or more of their minor strengths. 

For example, 

IJN has allegedly long range accuracy, allegedly stealth and allegedly higher AP penetration. Their weaknesses are pinhata-type citadels from poor armor layouts (that are conducive to getting citadel hits!) and poor acceleration rates. 

Germany has turtleback armor, excellent secondaries and HE armor pen strengths... and pay for those with poor medium to long range accuracy and having a predilection for being on fire. 

Soviet ships are always given insane acceleration and deceleration rates, laser-like ballistics, potent AA and their armor layouts are incredibly and conveniently designed for game meta ..aka 50mm bow plates and as LWM outlines, 'troll' armor setups that make their ships highly resistant to taking damage like other nation ships. On top of that they are always given high number of gun barrels on their ships which makes them extremely good at starting fires given how many times per salvo they can roll the dice. Their weaknesses are wide turn rates (but not the widest of all nations)..and that's about it really. The wide turn rate weakness is nulled out by the acceleration/decel strength which allows soviet ships and only soviet ships to avoid incoming medium to long range fire by making it fall short or wide with ease. 

As I said, soviet ships synergize their strengths. You have ships that are VERY combat maneuverable in terms of being able to stop, full reverse and go full forward so quickly you'd think it was a certain USN's legendary cruiser module that was plugged into them. Top that with the troll armor layouts and when you do get hit, chances are it won't do much. In cruisers and BBs at high tiers they gain 50mm noses...highly convenient for ships that can now bow tank and do the fore-reverse moondancing routine.The laser ballistics combined with the numerous gun barrels and the resulting crazy high fire setting ability is beneficial in itself given HE and fire care less about what angle or distance they hit the target at. Potent AA makes attacking a soviet ship, especially in high tier, as bad as hitting a USN cruiser. 

Smolensk and Kremlin have been released with all these built in advantages and given even more absurd and blatant advantages. LWM clearly outlines what they are... and I think she forgot to mention the small size of the ship makes it extremely difficult to hit.. its basically the size of a Harugumo. Kremlin was given a double advantage: Its 18 inch guns are just right to pen, arm and detonate inside ships..any ship. Overpens are almost unheard of on this ship. Then they are given the sudden-near-zero vertical dispersion at ranges under 15km...which means when you aim the guns at the warterline of a ship you are essentially guaranteed that almost all shells WILL land at that horizontal line..they will spread out from nose to tail of ship as other BBs do (sigma) but they will land AT the waterline where you aimed. Other nation BBs will have most of their shells hitting above or below the aimed waterline. By removing the vertical dispersion (which is not part of sigma) the Kremlin is guaranteed a very high chance of scoring multiple citadel hits...and we see this abundantly and consistently in the game. I would not be surprised Kremlin AP shells have shorter fuse timer than other BBs because Kremlins do penetrate and input very high damage. Need to datamine this.   

Compare this as well: Kremlin guns have just 4m worse dispersion than Yamato at any range..which literally means its effectively just as accurate at long ranges as Yamato. Kremlin AP does more damage than Yamato. Kremlin HE has a whopping 13% higher fire chance than Yamato... and rotates turrets TWICE as fast as Yamato. What is Yamato 'better' at than Kremlin in terms of guns? 900 more HE damage and a slightly faster reload rate...which Kremlin can get better just by applying the -rotation +reload module. So it is impressive to see how blatant the soviet bias has been applied to a battleship that never existed PLUS is being pitted against pre-ww2 design ships. This isn't balance in any way or form. 

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What a ****ing joke

Seriously, does this game need ANOTHER [edited] troll ship? 

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52 minutes ago, Skyfaller said:

She pretty much outlines what I've been saying for years about soviet bias in this game. 

Where every nation other than soviet has one or two strengths they pay for those by having weaknesses that balance the advantages out. Soviet ships however, do not. They are purposely designed so they don't really have a single strong point. They have multiple,  seemingly minor strengths that on their own don't amount to much...but they do synergize to make their ships be significantly more potent than other nations. Weaknesses on soviet ships are always minor weaknesses that never counteract the strengths the ships have. Most importantly, their weaknesses are nulled out by one or more of their minor strengths. 

For example, 

IJN has allegedly long range accuracy, allegedly stealth and allegedly higher AP penetration. Their weaknesses are pinhata-type citadels from poor armor layouts (that are conducive to getting citadel hits!) and poor acceleration rates. 

Germany has turtleback armor, excellent secondaries and HE armor pen strengths... and pay for those with poor medium to long range accuracy and having a predilection for being on fire. 

Soviet ships are always given insane acceleration and deceleration rates, laser-like ballistics, potent AA and their armor layouts are incredibly and conveniently designed for game meta ..aka 50mm bow plates and as LWM outlines, 'troll' armor setups that make their ships highly resistant to taking damage like other nation ships. On top of that they are always given high number of gun barrels on their ships which makes them extremely good at starting fires given how many times per salvo they can roll the dice. Their weaknesses are wide turn rates (but not the widest of all nations)..and that's about it really. The wide turn rate weakness is nulled out by the acceleration/decel strength which allows soviet ships and only soviet ships to avoid incoming medium to long range fire by making it fall short or wide with ease. 

As I said, soviet ships synergize their strengths. You have ships that are VERY combat maneuverable in terms of being able to stop, full reverse and go full forward so quickly you'd think it was a certain USN's legendary cruiser module that was plugged into them. Top that with the troll armor layouts and when you do get hit, chances are it won't do much. In cruisers and BBs at high tiers they gain 50mm noses...highly convenient for ships that can now bow tank and do the fore-reverse moondancing routine.The laser ballistics combined with the numerous gun barrels and the resulting crazy high fire setting ability is beneficial in itself given HE and fire care less about what angle or distance they hit the target at. Potent AA makes attacking a soviet ship, especially in high tier, as bad as hitting a USN cruiser. 

Smolensk and Kremlin have been released with all these built in advantages and given even more absurd and blatant advantages. LWM clearly outlines what they are... and I think she forgot to mention the small size of the ship makes it extremely difficult to hit.. its basically the size of a Harugumo. Kremlin was given a double advantage: Its 18 inch guns are just right to pen, arm and detonate inside ships..any ship. Overpens are almost unheard of on this ship. Then they are given the sudden-near-zero vertical dispersion at ranges under 15km...which means when you aim the guns at the warterline of a ship you are essentially guaranteed that almost all shells WILL land at that horizontal line..they will spread out from nose to tail of ship as other BBs do (sigma) but they will land AT the waterline where you aimed. Other nation BBs will have most of their shells hitting above or below the aimed waterline. By removing the vertical dispersion (which is not part of sigma) the Kremlin is guaranteed a very high chance of scoring multiple citadel hits...and we see this abundantly and consistently in the game. I would not be surprised Kremlin AP shells have shorter fuse timer than other BBs because Kremlins do penetrate and input very high damage. Need to datamine this.   

Compare this as well: Kremlin guns have just 4m worse dispersion than Yamato at any range..which literally means its effectively just as accurate at long ranges as Yamato. Kremlin AP does more damage than Yamato. Kremlin HE has a whopping 13% higher fire chance than Yamato... and rotates turrets TWICE as fast as Yamato. What is Yamato 'better' at than Kremlin in terms of guns? 900 more HE damage and a slightly faster reload rate...which Kremlin can get better just by applying the -rotation +reload module. So it is impressive to see how blatant the soviet bias has been applied to a battleship that never existed PLUS is being pitted against pre-ww2 design ships. This isn't balance in any way or form. 

It is really a slap in the face to history on how this company make Sovijet ship. Having first hand experience seeing these ship, I can tell you the ships are NOWHERE NEAR what they are in this game.

Some of these boat would call it a miracle to even make it to our ports in Jugoslavija.

When I see these boat in game with how powerful they are,  ---- any american sea man or EU sea man should be disgusted at how they make these ship.

Is a pure lie and spit in face of true history.


EDIT: DEAR DEVELOPER ---YOU PRIZE AND JOY SOVIJET NAVY IS A JOKE. QUIT TRYING TO MAKE LIKE IS SUPER. ALL OF YOU SHIP MADE WITH PART 50 YEARS OLD AND GLUE. QUIT TRYING MAKE LIKE SOVIJET NAVY WAS GOOD. IS A CRIME HOW YOU MAKE YOU SHIPS OUT TO BE.

Edited by LadyAnesjka
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No one said they were perfect, they are trying to make a living , by bringing entertainment to all, if you don't like the game , hit delete on your way out 

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The ship is insane. If you have a hits missions spam the Smolensk. If you have a fire mission spam the Smolensk. If you have a plane kill mission division up with a friend in a CV and spam the division. It eats unwary DD's for breakfast, lunch, supper, and a midnight snack.

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31 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

The ship is insane. If you have a hits missions spam the Smolensk. If you have a fire mission spam the Smolensk. If you have a plane kill mission division up with a friend in a CV and spam the division. It eats unwary DD's for breakfast, lunch, supper, and a midnight snack.

A Smolensk with an assigned spotter is a bad bad thing.

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Wishing I had saved my coal for the Smol than the Georgia right now. Oh well; I made my choice and  I doubt WG would refund my coal at this point.

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5 hours ago, Skyfaller said:

Soviet ships are always given insane acceleration and deceleration rates, laser-like ballistics, potent AA and their armor layouts are incredibly and conveniently designed for game meta ..aka 50mm bow plates and as LWM outlines, 'troll' armor setups that make their ships highly resistant to taking damage like other nation ships. On top of that they are always given high number of gun barrels on their ships which makes them extremely good at starting fires given how many times per salvo they can roll the dice. Their weaknesses are wide turn rates (but not the widest of all nations)..and that's about it really. The wide turn rate weakness is nulled out by the acceleration/decel strength which allows soviet ships and only soviet ships to avoid incoming medium to long range fire by making it fall short or wide with ease. 

You've just hand picked from different ships. None of the ships in these lines share multiples of these characteristics and some like the acceleration/deceleration nonsense is completely false. Why make a whole paragraph out of this?

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7 hours ago, LadyAnesjka said:

It is really a slap in the face to history on how this company make Sovijet ship. Having first hand experience seeing these ship, I can tell you the ships are NOWHERE NEAR what they are in this game.

Some of these boat would call it a miracle to even make it to our ports in Jugoslavija.

When I see these boat in game with how powerful they are,  ---- any american sea man or EU sea man should be disgusted at how they make these ship.

Is a pure lie and spit in face of true history.


EDIT: DEAR DEVELOPER ---YOU PRIZE AND JOY SOVIJET NAVY IS A JOKE. QUIT TRYING TO MAKE LIKE IS SUPER. ALL OF YOU SHIP MADE WITH PART 50 YEARS OLD AND GLUE. QUIT TRYING MAKE LIKE SOVIJET NAVY WAS GOOD. IS A CRIME HOW YOU MAKE YOU SHIPS OUT TO BE.

One note: This is an arcade game and meant to be balanced.  I think we can all agree that balance is flawed at this time, though we may not agree in which way it is flawed.

If ship performance were based on reality then nobody would play anything other than US, and perhaps occasionally a UK, ship at top tier.  Asking for real performance to be reflected in the game is a recipe for stagnation.

That said, I fully agree with the general consensus that Smolensk is, even if not overpowered statistically, very bad for the game.

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On 10/11/2019 at 9:26 PM, Helstrem said:

One note: This is an arcade game and meant to be balanced.  I think we can all agree that balance is flawed at this time, though we may not agree in which way it is flawed.

If ship performance were based on reality then nobody would play anything other than US, and perhaps occasionally a UK, ship at top tier.  Asking for real performance to be reflected in the game is a recipe for stagnation.

That said, I fully agree with the general consensus that Smolensk is, even if not overpowered statistically, very bad for the game.

Fact: It isn't balanced.

Another fact: Soviet ships are CERTAINLY not balanced. 

When only ships of one nation are the ones coming out and remaining unbalanced, there is a reason for it. 

Thus we see Khaba having insane acceleration and speeds while sporting armor its engines could never have even had a hope of pushing that fast... we see soviet cruisers at high tier being granted the ONE bow armor that lets them tank Yamato shells and everything but HE with ease...  we see soviet BBs with crazy accel/decel and gun based benefits plus crazy healing and insane AA and yet no other BB gets anything close to it nor do they get virtually no weaknesses to balance out such OP capability. 

 

You reading this here first: When subs come into the game, all soviet ships, especially the BBs, will be given something that will make them highly resistant to their torpedoes. You wait and see what it is. 

 

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Just now, Skyfaller said:

Fact: It isn't balanced.

Another fact: Soviet ships are CERTAINLY not balanced. 

When only ships of one nation are the ones coming out and remaining unbalanced, there is a reason for it. 

Thus we see Khaba having insane acceleration and speeds while sporting armor its engines could never have even had a hope of pushing that fast... we see soviet cruisers at high tier being granted the ONE bow armor that lets them tank Yamato shells and everything but HE with ease...  we see soviet BBs with crazy accel/decel and gun based benefits plus crazy healing and insane AA and yet no other BB gets anything close to it nor do they get virtually no weaknesses to balance out such OP capability. 

 

You reading this here first: When subs come into the game, all soviet ships, especially the BBs, will be given something that will make them highly resistant to their torpedoes. You wait and see what it is. 

 

None of that is relevant to what I wrote or the post I was responding to.

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On 10/11/2019 at 10:52 AM, Orderofchaos said:

No one said they were perfect, they are trying to make a living , by bringing entertainment to all, if you don't like the game , hit delete on your way out 

Heralds, lift thy trumpets to thine lips in harmonic joy! He hath arrived!

Ug7R4GP.gif

Edited by Battleship_Elisabeth
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On 10/11/2019 at 2:37 PM, General_Lee_Miserable said:

I think her tone comes off as similar to Zoup's now. 

The over-dramatic feel with the "I rewrote this like a zillion times" stuff was over the top. It's just a game. 

Seems a pattern is emerging. Likely a sign of a game going downhill.

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On 10/11/2019 at 1:52 PM, Orderofchaos said:

No one said they were perfect, they are trying to make a living , by bringing entertainment to all, if you don't like the game , hit delete on your way out 

Careful what you wish for: long time players are dropping like flies. So many people I know and played with regularly have stopped. I'm barely playing the game anymore myself. The other day I was so frustrated by the quality of the playerbase and matches, I was on the verge of outright uninstalling.

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24 minutes ago, USS_Taylor_Swift said:

Careful what you wish for: long time players are dropping like flies. So many people I know and played with regularly have stopped. I'm barely playing the game anymore myself. The other day I was so frustrated by the quality of the playerbase and matches, I was on the verge of outright uninstalling.

And now you come to the forum to complain instead....

:Smile_hiding:

 

Edited by MWSVette1
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1 minute ago, MWSVette1 said:

And now you come to the forum to complain instead....

:Smile_hiding:

 

Why wouldn't I? I've invested more time (and money) in this game than any other game I've played. I used to love it and would play every day. I'm really bummed about what it has turned into.

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2 minutes ago, MWSVette1 said:

And now you come to the forum to complain instead....

:Smile_hiding:

 

ZeCSZg2.gif

When you look in the mirror in the morning, after spending the night nobly crapping on people in Wargaming's defense, do you feel dirty?

I know, I know - redundant question. You do you, Sir Shillingham.

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On 10/11/2019 at 6:37 PM, Skyfaller said:

Soviet ships are always given insane acceleration and deceleration rates, laser-like ballistics, potent AA and their armor layouts are incredibly and conveniently designed for game meta ..aka 50mm bow plates and as LWM outlines, 'troll' armor setups that make their ships highly resistant to taking damage like other nation ships. On top of that they are always given high number of gun barrels on their ships which makes them extremely good at starting fires given how many times per salvo they can roll the dice. Their weaknesses are wide turn rates (but not the widest of all nations)..and that's about it really. The wide turn rate weakness is nulled out by the acceleration/decel strength which allows soviet ships and only soviet ships to avoid incoming medium to long range fire by making it fall short or wide with ease. 

Sorry to say this, but you are grossly exaggerating here. You claim that Soviet ships always get insane acceleration, laser like ballistics, potent AA, troll armor, high gun counts and 50mm plating for a weakness that according to you is not even one in return. I shall visualize why you are wrong on one of the few ships that actually meets your last point, 50mm plating, Moskva. Although I should mention that only three ships get above the norm plating, namely Moskva, Khabarovsk and Stalingrad. But anyway.

1. Insane acceleration and deceleration rates

This point is flat out wrong. Moskva may be fast in a straight line, but her acceleration and deceleration rates do not differ from those found on other ships except British light cruisers. Test this yourself in a training room, use a stock Moskva and stop the time it takes you to go to full speed from stand-still. Then compare to say a stock Des Moines, a stock Hindenburg, a stock Zao. You'll find that the time to accelerate will not differ.

2. Laser like ballistics

The only point where you actually are correct.

3. Potent AA

Moskva's AA is nothing special really. Gonna pull some numbers comparing her to Hindenburg and Henri, two ships that can't really claim amazing AA for themselves.

  Hindenburg Henri IV Moskva
Short Range 144 @ 2km - 116 @3.1km
Medium Range 343 @ 4km 350 @ 3.8km 235 @ 3.5km
Long Range 154 @ 5.2km + 7x1540 112 @ 6km + 5x1680 146 @ 6.6km + 6x1820

So say that a plane drops from 1km away, and then multiplying the ranges at which the guns fired with their dps, you get 1819.8 for Hindenburg, 1540 for Henri IV and 1648.7 for Moskva. Plus whatever the flak bursts add, although in the current state they are not much of a threat unless the CV is unaware that dodging is a thing.

4. Troll armor

No. The armor only actually works if you play her properly. She is not some Henri where your shells magically disappear or a Zao where every second salvo into the broadside results in nothing like overpens. Nuking Moskvas is easy if they don't angle or if they overangle.4. Troll armor

5. High gun count

There is no T10 cruiser with a lower gun count. Only one T9 cruiser that is currently WiP has a lower count and then you are already at T8 with Hipper and Eugen and their eight guns. 

6. Wide turn rates (but not the widest of all nations)

How many non-soviet cruisers turn wider than Moskva again? Or battleships for that matter? The only non-soviet ship with a similar turning radius is Großer Kurfürst...

 

As much as I hate Smolensk's current state and believe that Kremlin and Sinop need smacks with the nerf hammer, this outright lying about Soviet ships in-game is on an equally low level as WG's propaganda history-rewriting videos where they claim Soyuz would have carried the world's third strongest naval gun. But if people want to fight lies by speaking lies themselves, go ahead, just don't expect much to come from it.

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