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rustydawg

We now have Subs in testing, when will PT boats be introduced??

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Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

I should have said Subs in testing.

Edited by rustydawg
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1 minute ago, rustydawg said:

Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

And DE's, I want Samuel B. Roberts! 

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1 minute ago, agm114r said:

The competition already has them...

Because they need it for the grinding "experience" where you start playing with them, and because they have a whole different focus on ships implemented. 

Although what I give them, the competition has balance proble- ehem "features" that make WoWs look like a wonderfully designed game.

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Just now, SireneRacker said:

Because they need it for the grinding "experience" where you start playing with them, and because they have a whole different focus on ships implemented. 

Although what I give them, the competition has balance proble- ehem "features" that make WoWs look like a wonderfully designed game.

LOL.  I didn't say it was all roses, or perfect...just that they were there.

 

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4 minutes ago, agm114r said:

The competition already has them...

 

I know and they are a little hard to hit in that game, by DD's, until you get in 40 MM and 50 cal range.

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Just now, agm114r said:

LOL.  I didn't say it was all roses, or perfect...just that they were there.

And I am explaining why them having them does not say an awful lot :p

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Actually I think one way they could add PT boats into the game is to use something akin to the carrier template. Instead of one PT boat, players could have a PT Boat Tender (they actually existed) and you would use your PT boats like you would flights of aircraft, kind of like disposable units or ammo. Someone smarter than me would have to figure out the actual mechanics, but I think it is entirely doable. Back in the olden days when we fought naval battle games on the floor using lead miniatures and long measuring tapes, PT boats were in the game rules. Instead of one ship, they were one lead miniature that represented many boats (I forget how many). Course most of us playing were purists and only liked playing "real" ships so you didn't see them often. 

Edited by Taylor3006

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21 hours ago, Taylor3006 said:

Actually I think one way they could add PT boats into the game is to use something akin to the carrier template. Instead of one PT boat, players could have a PT Boat Tender (they actually existed) and you would use your PT boats like you would flights of aircraft, kind of like disposable units or ammo. Someone smarter than me would have to figure out the actual mechanics, but I think it is entirely doable. Back in the olden days when we fought naval battle games on the floor using lead miniatures and long measuring tapes, PT boats were in the game rules. Instead of one ship, they were one lead miniature that represented many boats (I forget how many). Course most of us playing were purists and only liked playing "real" ships so you didn't see them often. 

It would be more fun to run a PT like the DD's and other ships. And return to the tender to get more torps and ammo.

The CV's were just right after the second patch, then they started to go downhill. From T8 up most people in CV's don't get many hits if any at all!

I'm one of most people...LOL.

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I don't think we will see them, personally. As I posted in another thread, with subs, thought I'm not the biggest fan of their implementation as I enjoy the primarily surface combat aspect of the game, it does complete the RPS aspect of balance the designers sought from the start, and I knew it was but a matter of time before we saw them. 
The main issue with the game in the state it was released was that you can't naturally balance around 4 classes. Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard inherently unbalances the game, and  gives one class an unfair advantage over the rest. Adding in Subs balanced the game to Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock, and while it does muddy the waters in terms of who can kill what and how everything works cooperatively, it is inherently balanced. 
As much as I like PTs, I don't think we will ever see that gameplay in the game until many many years on, like WOT adding two-gunned tanks. Once the devs start running out of ideas and lines to make who knows what we will see. 

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7 minutes ago, Sledgehammer427 said:

I don't think we will see them, personally. As I posted in another thread, with subs, thought I'm not the biggest fan of their implementation as I enjoy the primarily surface combat aspect of the game, it does complete the RPS aspect of balance the designers sought from the start, and I knew it was but a matter of time before we saw them. 
The main issue with the game in the state it was released was that you can't naturally balance around 4 classes. Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard inherently unbalances the game, and  gives one class an unfair advantage over the rest. Adding in Subs balanced the game to Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock, and while it does muddy the waters in terms of who can kill what and how everything works cooperatively, it is inherently balanced. 
As much as I like PTs, I don't think we will ever see that gameplay in the game until many many years on, like WOT adding two-gunned tanks. Once the devs start running out of ideas and lines to make who knows what we will see. 

Good point.

And True.

Edited by rustydawg

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PT boats? i think they would reach 60kts and basically move so fast and so small they could only be effectively counter by destroyers. (maybe even a straight up counter to the CV)

PT boats did well with the Americans in hitting Japanese logistic lines in ww2

 

Edited by Skyspartan

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23 hours ago, rustydawg said:

Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

I should have said Subs in testing.

Well, if we wanna be completely honest, they are here.  I do believe the Dunkirk Spec Ops has them on the enemy team.....trying to shoot Schnell Boots with friggin DD and Cruiser guns...derp....

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23 hours ago, rustydawg said:

Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

I should have said Subs in testing.

I hope so... But first we need a complete Regia Marina tech tree and start with the most famous PT boats, the Decima Flottiglia Mas, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decima_Flottiglia_MAS?wprov=sfla1

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Just now, KnightFandragon said:

Well, if we wanna be completely honest, they are here.  I do believe the Dunkirk Spec Ops has them on the enemy team.....trying to shoot Schnell Boots with friggin DD and Cruiser guns...derp....

Yes please!!!  I want a KM E- boat!!!  And then a RN 'Tramp Steamer "Q" Ship' to blow the hot rod E-Boat out of the water!

German_E-Boat_S_204_surrenders_at_Felixstowe_on_13_May_1945.jpg

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23 hours ago, rustydawg said:

Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

I should have said Subs in testing.

But...the subs they are launching are essentially PT boats with a cloaking device...

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23 hours ago, rustydawg said:

Just like the title says. If they make PT's they should be harder to hit and have to go to a rear base or tender to reload torps. 

Just my thoughts. 

I should have said Subs in testing.

But would they really work?

 

There are no guns to shoot with as at best the tended to have 20mm to 40mm AA guns. You had two torps and unlimited reloads is bad enough for DDs that, with a few exceptions, did not reload torps. They had 2-4 torps as a rule.

 

There is also the problem of tiers. Are they really different enough from each other to make more than one tier? There were variations in weapons added, but not enough variation for real tiers I believe. Considering the span of armament from 76.2mm guns to 18" guns in WoWs, Clemson gets a single point increase for doubling the number of 102mm guns. So going from .50 cal to 40mm, which is all AA in WoWs and mid range AA at best, is not doing much. PT boats were mounting 37mm guns from P-39 fighters!

 

The closest to working would be a CV like arrangement with a tender to refresh PT boats as Taylor suggested. But then you have a mother ship to shoot that is for all intents and purposes a freighter with a few 5" guns and some AA. Think Katori with fewer, smaller guns and no torps. Those ships won't last long.

 

So, PT boats would likely just be weaker CVs, with slower "planes" that fire torpedoes or rockets. The PT boats would have more HP than planes. Probably 2,000-3,000 HP as a SWAG. So people want MORE CVs?

 

Since various navies called them various things, MTBs (Motor Torpedo Boats) would probably work best for a general name as it is descriptive and fairly generic.

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1 hour ago, rustydawg said:

It would be more fun to run a PT like the DD's and other ships. And return to the tender to get more torps and ammo.

It probably would be fun to fly around in one no doubt. The only problem is a boat made of plywood would probably be taken out by one secondary shell....  Using the carrier model currently in the game, the PT boats could very well be "piloted" by the player like aircraft. Again it makes sense to look at them less as ships and more as ammo or airplanes in order to fit them into the game. 

EDIT: Kiz has a good point about torpedo reloads and it supports my case for using aircraft as the PT boat model. 

Edited by Taylor3006

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If they made PT's work like CV planes the secondaries and AAA caliber guns would give grief. Even if they didn't the small caliber guns would start shooting when PT's are in their range.

11 hours ago, Kizarvexis said:

But would they really work?

 

There are no guns to shoot with as at best the tended to have 20mm to 40mm AA guns. You had two torps and unlimited reloads is bad enough for DDs that, with a few exceptions, did not reload torps. They had 2-4 torps as a rule.

 

There is also the problem of tiers. Are they really different enough from each other to make more than one tier? There were variations in weapons added, but not enough variation for real tiers I believe. Considering the span of armament from 76.2mm guns to 18" guns in WoWs, Clemson gets a single point increase for doubling the number of 102mm guns. So going from .50 cal to 40mm, which is all AA in WoWs and mid range AA at best, is not doing much. PT boats were mounting 37mm guns from P-39 fighters!

 

The closest to working would be a CV like arrangement with a tender to refresh PT boats as Taylor suggested. But then you have a mother ship to shoot that is for all intents and purposes a freighter with a few 5" guns and some AA. Think Katori with fewer, smaller guns and no torps. Those ships won't last long.

 

So, PT boats would likely just be weaker CVs, with slower "planes" that fire torpedoes or rockets. The PT boats would have more HP than planes. Probably 2,000-3,000 HP as a SWAG. So people want MORE CVs?

 

Since various navies called them various things, MTBs (Motor Torpedo Boats) would probably work best for a general name as it is descriptive and fairly generic.

The competition has tiers, and only 2 or 4 torp shots with no reload, in their version of random.  They also have depth charges for subs. Some guy, in a PT, even dropped a depth charge next to a DD and took it out.

So if WG wanted PT's they could do it. The PT's on the US side even had rockets.

Edited by rustydawg

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1 minute ago, rustydawg said:

If they made PT's work like CV planes the secondaries and AAA caliber guns would give grief. Even if they didn't the small caliber guns would start shooting when PT's are in their range.

The competition has tiers, and only 2 or 4 torp shots with no reload, in their version of random.  They also have depth charges for subs. Some guy, in a PT, even dropped a depth charge next to a DD and took it out.

So if WG wanted PT's they could do it.

Depends on if WG wants to do partial lines or not. I've heard they don't like partial lines, but don't know if that is true or not.

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