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Grimmortals

You have [edited] the role of DD's

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You have taken away the importance of spotting, capturing objectives and rewarded damage by dd's. This has led to [edited] games as dd's don't play the role they should, as they don't get rewarded for doing whats important. So all to ofton you get dd's that do what they have to get exp, but does [edited] for the team, and the team suffers. Kills me when I am not playing dd, to see the idiots playing those rolls as I cant do what i should when they don't play there roll. You need to truly reward those dd's that do the job. My best games I have done that i got more karma I did little to no damage, but capped, spotted and made then turn broadside to avoid my torps for other s to make massive damage.  Get back to rewarding those efforts, maybe then we can get cruisers to actually play there role to support those dd's as they dont do it at all for the most part, they just try to farm damage with he on bb's, which is fine but they should be gettng bonus for hitting dd's. 50k damage on a bb should equal 10k damage on a dd. that will make them want to hit them.

 

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They should start by reworking cap reward. I don't know why caps should be a reward modifier instead of....you know...flat out reward. Someone who solo cap 3 bases should have 3k base XP. Killing game does win games but capping also win games.

 

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You realize CVs have always been in the game, right? They actually made DDs more effective with CVs around. So it's not that DDs lost a role now, it's that DDs gained a role that was never really theirs in the first place due to a lack of CVs.

Also, 10k on a DD does equal 50k on a BB, depending. You are rewarded for the percentage you take off, not the raw number of damage done. Say you have a DD with 20k and a BB with 100k. You have to do 5x more to the BB for the same credit. DDs are xp pinatas, and that's a good thing, as it heavily incentivizes shooting them.

Now if only people would get good enough at aiming to feel they stand a chance at hitting said DD.

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I'm reading Ops post, and yet not seeing it.

 

I have played DDs exactly as OP says, doing 'the job', and have not been disappointed in the post battle screen. While damage fluctuates between high and low, the XP has been fairly consistent.

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1 hour ago, Grimmortals said:

You have taken away the importance of spotting, capturing objectives and rewarded damage by dd's.

 

This has led to [edited] games as dd's don't play the role they should, as they don't get rewarded for doing whats important.

 

Your idea of what's important for a DD to do is not the only way to win a game through good DD play.

If you want this game to work in a particular way only, you are playing the wrong game.

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1 hour ago, Anonymous50 said:

Your idea of what's important for a DD to do is not the only way to win a game through good DD play.

If you want this game to work in a particular way only, you are playing the wrong game.

IF this is the case, why do they put the "job descriptions" of each ship class in the game?  Or is it just a suggestion?  Cause I see tears in damn near every game chat about some clowns not doing what their "job" is as described in game.....

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3 minutes ago, 99Lightning said:

IF this is the case, why do they put the "job descriptions" of each ship class in the game?  Or is it just a suggestion? 

It's more of a guideline than a rule.

And it has been that way for a while.  A IJN DD is not the same as an RU DD.

And "getting yours" at the expense of the team has always been a thing.  For all ship types.

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3 hours ago, Grimmortals said:

This has led to [edited] games as dd's don't play the role they should, as they don't get rewarded for doing whats important.

WW2 historical roles and expectations went out the window at the cruiser line split when our host decided to change the "value proposition" of the game from a historically based, WW2 mature naval arcade shooter to a young adult, gimmick loaded free-for-all, e-Sales loaded arcade FPS meant to be played on phones and consoles......   Were you here for the Radar de evolution of the game....  Then the HE Spam period.  The Carrier, Update 8.0 nightmare.  And now, Submarines whose whole purpose is to "further dilute" this small map, time compressed naval game into the kiddy shooter they really want....  Cynical??  No, it is what they are actually doing IMO and the real question is:  do roles and historic expectations make the game fun for you???  For me, yes.  And, that means, the game will get to the point where I "retire" from it.......

What is important is "spending money in game"....  Boomers want quality and the Like generation need constant gimmicks and change.  Guess whom our host is catering to.

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13 minutes ago, 99Lightning said:

Cause I see tears in damn near every game chat about some clowns not doing what their "job" is as described in game.....

I would say, the role (not nesecerally the job) of each ship class  is muddied... Especially when you play all the ship classes in the game...

When one feels a ship class has played the match in a disappointing way, *ESPECIALLY* if it contributes to a loss in the match... Then its our JOB to point it out to him...

A job description only gets you so for..  Knowing your "role" while doing your in making the workplace profitable (In our case. Knowing what to do in game to gain the win with the ship you picked)... Goes a long way..

I think that is what the OP is trying to point out... Role over "job."

 

Edited by Navalpride33
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3 hours ago, Grimmortals said:

 50k damage on a bb should equal 10k damage on a dd. that will make them want to hit them.

The rewards are already like that.  Damage is rewarded by % of ship health pool, not actual damage done.  A hit on a DD that does 10k of damage to a 20k health pool gives the same reward as 50k damage done to a BB with a 100k health pool.

Its not that DDs don't get rewarded.  They get punished badly when they move forward into the kill zone early in the game.  With CVs around they can't find anywhere safe, and they don't have the health pool to withstand a barrage of rockets along with other ships shooting at them.  When escaping most ships, they can go dark, but with CVs around, they can't escape to safety.  That makes DD pilots very nervous about venturing forward to do their job.  And, it makes it hard to get XP as a side effect.

 

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1 hour ago, Asym_KS said:

WW2 historical roles and expectations went out the window at the cruiser line split when our host decided to change the "value proposition" of the game from a historically based, WW2 mature naval arcade shooter to a young adult, gimmick loaded free-for-all, e-Sales loaded arcade FPS meant to be played on phones and consoles......   Were you here for the Radar de evolution of the game....  Then the HE Spam period.  The Carrier, Update 8.0 nightmare.  And now, Submarines whose whole purpose is to "further dilute" this small map, time compressed naval game into the kiddy shooter they really want....  Cynical??  No, it is what they are actually doing IMO and the real question is:  do roles and historic expectations make the game fun for you???  For me, yes.  And, that means, the game will get to the point where I "retire" from it.......

What is important is "spending money in game"....  Boomers want quality and the Like generation need constant gimmicks and change.  Guess whom our host is catering to.

I love your generalization about age, and wants... it's quite amusing. Nothing says I don't have a valid argument like stereotypes.

This game has always been an arcade game of shooty boats with pretty looking designs based on history. 

Your profile says you joined in 2018, the game was three years old by the time you started the account. Radar, HE spam, etc. were all well established by that time, so when exactly was the golden age of "mature" game play you are alluding to? 

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59 minutes ago, VeatherVitch said:

I love your generalization about age, and wants... it's quite amusing. Nothing says I don't have a valid argument like stereotypes.

This game has always been an arcade game of shooty boats with pretty looking designs based on history. 

Your profile says you joined in 2018, the game was three years old by the time you started the account. Radar, HE spam, etc. were all well established by that time, so when exactly was the golden age of "mature" game play you are alluding to? 

Actually, I started in 2017 and the profile is wrong; and, for some reason, our host hasn't gotten around to correct that....  Don't you just love computers !

To be honest, I talk to a lot of players and discuss what a great many of the people I talk to want, think or would spend real money on.  And yes, it has always been a shooter arcade game whose "value proposition" was based in the WW2 era...  Again, playing before the Cruiser Line Split and then after it, saw a remarkable change in the game play dynamics.  Where there were DD roles (of a sort), radar removed them.  Yes, HE spam has been around a while but, the introduction of even more DAKKA ships increased the angst of many BB drivers and we lost a whole lot of dedicated DD Captains to radar......they for the most part did not leave the game; they switched to cruisers and BB's....  There was a "culture shift" after the CLS....  Since then, the proliferation of gimmicky events and pretty obtuse and sometime OP sales have accelerated the arcade side of the game at the cost of the mature, historically based surface warfare game it attempted to emulate....and, not necessarily achieved.   Please explain Update 8.0 as something that wasn't planned to sell an OP product.   Imagine if they left 8.0 is installed and what that disaster would have done to the player population>>>>???  And, the update 8.0 carrier completely ruined DD drivers expectations of stealth, concealment or even suitability on their own.....  Changes since have eased those OP sales gimmicks......somewhat. 

The "Golden Age" is an opinion from experiencing gameplay.........my opinion.  Older and more established players will have their own opinions.  Some will agree and some will disagree.  What will happen pretty soon is the sales arc the involves "Golden Consumables and Ammunition"....  SAP is the marketing test our host is playing with right now.  And, history repeats itself;........so, I'm pretty sure that what they did in WoTs (the Golden bullet concept) will be adapted to WoWs as a sales event of similar and even more Golden products.....  Do you see any new maps, scenarios or historic modes of play???  Versus, ships for sale??  Gimmicks for sale or gimmicky events or modes?  Or, endless grinds for very little???? 

Edited by Asym_KS

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5 hours ago, Grimmortals said:

You have taken away the importance of spotting, capturing objectives and rewarded damage by dd's. This has led to [edited] games as dd's don't play the role they should, as they don't get rewarded for doing whats important. So all to ofton you get dd's that do what they have to get exp, but does [edited] for the team, and the team suffers. Kills me when I am not playing dd, to see the idiots playing those rolls as I cant do what i should when they don't play there roll. You need to truly reward those dd's that do the job. My best games I have done that i got more karma I did little to no damage, but capped, spotted and made then turn broadside to avoid my torps for other s to make massive damage.  Get back to rewarding those efforts, maybe then we can get cruisers to actually play there role to support those dd's as they dont do it at all for the most part, they just try to farm damage with he on bb's, which is fine but they should be gettng bonus for hitting dd's. 50k damage on a bb should equal 10k damage on a dd. that will make them want to hit them.

Heyo Grimmortals,

We have no made any major changes in the way EXP/Credits gets rewarded to ships for actions in a considerable time. Therefore, at least from our end we cannot correlate that to the way in which DDs are choosing to conduct their gameplay. In the last year or two we have seen an increase in ships with the ability to hamper DDs from preforming these functions (yes, I'm talking about Radar) but have consequently balanced this with changes made to Radar (6 second delay for enemy spotting). There is EXP/Credits rewarded for capturing and defending caps:

  • Full Capture:
    • EXP = 2/3rd of killing a ship
    • Credits = 1/3rd of killing a ship
  • Shared Capture/Defense:
    • EXP = % of capture/defense X 2/3rd of killing a ship
    • Credits = % of capture/defense X 1/3rd of killing a ship

While it is hard to force another player to play the game you expect it to be played based on class rolls, you do have the ability to play with friends in a division to ensure a better chance of having capable support in your DD actions. 

In your last point, 50k dmg to a BB should equal 10k dmg to a DD, this in fact is the case, however it is based on %s rather than strict damage numbers.

For example, a 105,800 HP GK and a 19,400 HP Gearing.

  • Doing 50k dmg to the GK would be 47% of its total HP
  • 47% of the total HP of the Gearing is 9,118 DMG5
  • 50k DMG on the GK equals the same reward as doing 9,118 DMG to a Gearing

There is a great How it Works video on the matter if you have further curiosities on how this works:

Fem, 
 

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6 hours ago, AlcatrazNC said:

They should start by reworking cap reward. I don't know why caps should be a reward modifier instead of....you know...flat out reward. Someone who solo cap 3 bases should have 3k base XP. Killing game does win games but capping also win games.

 

Because this game was conceived as battleships bashing each other with big guns. And it was designed and balanced entirely based on damages and kills. Everything else like ship type, game modes, and all the gimmicks are afterthoughts.

The original logo:

image.thumb.png.a99ce703f08a2d0e90494156fead745b.png

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6 hours ago, Grimmortals said:

 

Obvious projection is obvious. 

As Fem stated earlier the economic incentives for DDs hasn't changed. You have failed to consider that there are 3 major factors that affect how DDs are played; the player, the ship and the enemy team.

The player: how a player decides to play their DD is one major factor. If a player does not want to cap they won't do it, if they don't want to spot they won't do it.

The ship: what DD you're in is also a major factor. Japanese DDs are stealthy and are perfect for capping, while French DDs are poor candidates for capping because of their large detection range and lack of smoke.

The enemy team: this is arguably the largest factor. If the enemy team is full of radar ships a DD player is going to be extremely hesitant to enter the cap because the enemy knows exactly when to radar for obvious reasons. Taking radar out of the equation dosen't change the influence of the enemy, a Japanese DD won't enter a cap when there is an American DD nearby because they will likely get slaughtered. 

The point is that the 'role' of a DD is not set in stone like you believe, it's far more fluid then you think, this does not just apply to DDs but all the ships in the game so far.

Edited by Neko_Ship_Akashi
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As a DD main I have found NO loss in my ability to deal lots of damage, do a lot of spotting or XP/Credit income from capping, in fact due to the fact that most BB's sit back further now due to all the daka daka I have found my game play experience has gotten BETTER.  I am a fairly good DD main, CV's don't bug me too much, radar, doesn't bug me much.  What really bugs me, TBH, is the fact that torp spreads seem to ALWAYS leave a nice perfect target sized gap where my torps are at...  But I work around this.

Big problems I see that might make people feel this way? People base most of their experience in this game around the rewards THEY get, which I totally understand. But if the community focused more on helping the TEAM, support flanks, or spot, or use torps for area denial, keeping ships from pushing a direction or turning targets....

Some of my most enjoyable games have been where I have literally launched over 100 torps and not really hit anything, had 200k spotting dmg and kept the enemy turning, which enabled my BB's to wreck everything.

Just my 2 cents...

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38 minutes ago, Asym_KS said:

The "Golden Age" is an opinion from experiencing gameplay.........my opinion.  Older and more established players will have their own opinions.  Some will agree and some will disagree.  What will happen pretty soon is the sales arc the involves "Golden Consumables and Ammunition"....  SAP is the marketing test our host is playing with right now.  And, history repeats itself;........so, I'm pretty sure that what they did in WoTs (the Golden bullet concept) will be adapted to WoWs as a sales event of similar and even more Golden products.....  Do you see any new maps, scenarios or historic modes of play???  Versus, ships for sale??  Gimmicks for sale or gimmicky events or modes?  Or, endless grinds for very little???? 

SAP isn't gold ammo, especially since it was already technically in the game. Take your conspiracy theories somewhere else.

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29 minutes ago, Femennenly said:

Heyo Grimmortals,

We have no made any major changes in the way EXP/Credits gets rewarded to ships for actions in a considerable time. Therefore, at least from our end we cannot correlate that to the way in which DDs are choosing to conduct their gameplay. In the last year or two we have seen an increase in ships with the ability to hamper DDs from preforming these functions (yes, I'm talking about Radar) but have consequently balanced this with changes made to Radar (6 second delay for enemy spotting). There is EXP/Credits rewarded for capturing and defending caps:

  • Full Capture:
    • EXP = 2/3rd of killing a ship
    • Credits = 1/3rd of killing a ship
  • Shared Capture/Defense:
    • EXP = % of capture/defense X 2/3rd of killing a ship
    • Credits = % of capture/defense X 1/3rd of killing a ship

While it is hard to force another player to play the game you expect it to be played based on class rolls, you do have the ability to play with friends in a division to ensure a better chance of having capable support in your DD actions. 

In your last point, 50k dmg to a BB should equal 10k dmg to a DD, this in fact is the case, however it is based on %s rather than strict damage numbers.

For example, a 105,800 HP GK and a 19,400 HP Gearing.

  • Doing 50k dmg to the GK would be 47% of its total HP
  • 47% of the total HP of the Gearing is 9,118 DMG5
  • 50k DMG on the GK equals the same reward as doing 9,118 DMG to a Gearing

There is a great How it Works video on the matter if you have further curiosities on how this works:

Fem, 
 

Fem, I know that I personally have significantly changed how I play DDs since the CV rework.  Now, with how fast the planes get back in the sky,  I definitely don't try to cap as much nor try to spot as much BECAUSE once a CV that is any good at all finds out the area you are in he/she just keeps on coming back to spot you and let his team shoot you.  It has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with how CVs now interact so quickly with their plane "respawns".  So the impact is as @Grimmortals has stated, but the reason imo it has occurred has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with the CV meta.  Radar is easy to deal with as compared to CVs because CVs can find you anywhere on the map.  So I stay away from caps and close to the fleet for AA support early in the game.  It's not much fun just doing so, but I've learned that is the only way to stay fairly healthy for a while if it is a CV battle.  What do you suggest in this regard?  

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8 minutes ago, Neko_Ship_Akashi said:

SAP isn't gold ammo, especially since it was already technically in the game. Take your conspiracy theories somewhere else.

What a party pooper.....  I am assuming you aren't a new player then and you recreated another account?  Because, if you are as new as your profile says, how would you even know what an in game conspiracy theory would look like....????

What I conjectured will come to pass.  SAP is a marketing test as well as IFHE is....  Another "gimmick" to use to sell ships....  The Golden era consumables are even more of a sale gimmick....  We'll see and good hunting !

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3 hours ago, 99Lightning said:

IF this is the case, why do they put the "job descriptions" of each ship class in the game?  Or is it just a suggestion?  Cause I see tears in damn near every game chat about some clowns not doing what their "job" is as described in game.....

 

3 hours ago, Navalpride33 said:

I would say, the role (not nesecerally the job) of each ship class  is muddied... Especially when you play all the ship classes in the game...

When one feels a ship class has played the match in a disappointing way, *ESPECIALLY* if it contributes to a loss in the match... Then its our JOB to point it out to him...

A job description only gets you so for..  Knowing your "role" while doing your in making the workplace profitable (In our case. Knowing what to do in game to gain the win with the ship you picked)... Goes a long way..

I think that is what the OP is trying to point out... Role over "job."

 

^ while this is true to a point, not all DD were created equal.

 

3 hours ago, DrHolmes52 said:

It's more of a guideline than a rule.

And it has been that way for a while.  A IJN DD is not the same as an RU DD.

And "getting yours" at the expense of the team has always been a thing.  For all ship types.

 

49 minutes ago, Neko_Ship_Akashi said:

The ship: what DD you're in is also a major factor. Japanese DDs are stealthy and are perfect for capping, while French DDs are poor candidates for capping because of their large detection range and lack of smoke.

The enemy team: this is arguably the largest factor. If the enemy team is full of radar ships a DD player is going to be extremely hesitant to enter the cap because the enemy knows exactly when to radar for obvious reasons. Taking radar out of the equation dosen't change the influence of the enemy, a Japanese DD won't enter a cap when there is an American DD nearby because they will likely get slaughtered. 

 

^ as they have said, while they are all listed as DDs, not all DDs serve the same function. 

Some are great stealth/Torp boats who can move in and cap a point without being seen.

Some are larger Gunboat DDs who have a visibility that is slightly larger then a torp boat, to massive. These DDs usually get focused on pretty quickly, especially the Higher Tiered RU DDs.

So while people do need to understand their role, what they (and others in the game) also need to understand how the ship the player are currently sailing can best fill the role given its attributes.

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Hapa_Fodder said:

As a DD main I have found NO loss in my ability to deal lots of damage, do a lot of spotting or XP/Credit income from capping, in fact due to the fact that most BB's sit back further now due to all the daka daka I have found my game play experience has gotten BETTER.  I am a fairly good DD main, CV's don't bug me too much, radar, doesn't bug me much.  What really bugs me, TBH, is the fact that torp spreads seem to ALWAYS leave a nice perfect target sized gap where my torps are at...  But I work around this.

Big problems I see that might make people feel this way? People base most of their experience in this game around the rewards THEY get, which I totally understand. But if the community focused more on helping the TEAM, support flanks, or spot, or use torps for area denial, keeping ships from pushing a direction or turning targets....

Some of my most enjoyable games have been where I have literally launched over 100 torps and not really hit anything, had 200k spotting dmg and kept the enemy turning, which enabled my BB's to wreck everything.

As another DD main (albeit 'fairly good' is debatable) I agree with the sentiments above.   However that does lead me to a question for @Femennenly.   How does 'spotting' damage play into exp/credit generation?  

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45 minutes ago, Asym_KS said:

What I conjectured will come to pass.  SAP is a marketing test as well as IFHE is....  Another "gimmick" to use to sell ships....  The Golden era consumables are even more of a sale gimmick....  We'll see and good hunting !

How is it gold if it already existed in the game?

And how is IFHE a gimmick? It helps struggling ships do damage, specifically the lightly armed ships.

Edited by Neko_Ship_Akashi

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1 hour ago, Merc85 said:

Fem, I know that I personally have significantly changed how I play DDs since the CV rework.  Now, with how fast the planes get back in the sky,  I definitely don't try to cap as much nor try to spot as much BECAUSE once a CV that is any good at all finds out the area you are in he/she just keeps on coming back to spot you and let his team shoot you.  It has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with how CVs now interact so quickly with their plane "respawns".  So the impact is as @Grimmortals has stated, but the reason imo it has occurred has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with the CV meta.  Radar is easy to deal with as compared to CVs because CVs can find you anywhere on the map.  So I stay away from caps and close to the fleet for AA support early in the game.  It's not much fun just doing so, but I've learned that is the only way to stay fairly healthy for a while if it is a CV battle.  What do you suggest in this regard?  

Heyo Merc,

I will agree, the nature of DD play has adapted since the rework, however the core mechanics of how EXP is earned by players which is what OP states they feel has changed, has not - which is more what I was addressing. While some things have changed negatively for the destroyer, there has also been positives with the change of the rework beneficial to the DD:

  • Considerably less "First Blood / Dev Strikes" on DDs at the start of the game.
  • Planes no longer have the ability to spot torpedoes.
  • CVs no longer able to provide map wide spotting at once (Remember CVs spotting all three caps at once?). 

While it can be frustrating for the DD player to be spotted by the CV please consider this in reverse:

  • To maintain spotting on a DD the CV player has to sacrifice a limited defensive consumable for his team 
  • Depending on the DD positioning, the CV player may have to travel away from his intended target's path to drop off the plane.
  • The dropped plane will only (at max) last ~1 minute before departing, less if shot down.

The CV player has to consider the trade off in perusing a DD in relation to other actions they could be taking. 

One major change from pre 8.0 through to now, is that the impact of CVs is more noticeable due to the improved numbers of games. From experience, I feel like I was considerably more "deadly" towards DDs in the RTS CV modes, however since there was far fewer CV players, this was not as noticeable. Nowadays, with a healthier CV population, while their direct impact on a game itself is not as significant, since they are present in more games, their impact is more visible.

In regards to how to counter-play a CV in a DD, you have the foundation of a great tactic, using allies for AA is a good start. This can be extended into using terrain in caps, while you may be detected, if the enemy can't shoot you it doesn't always matter if you're visible. DD play has changed with the reworked CVs, but the ability to adapt, overcome, and succeed is still there if you approach the game with CV strengths and weaknesses in mind.


56 minutes ago, BadWolfz said:

As another DD main (albeit 'fairly good' is debatable) I agree with the sentiments above.   However that does lead me to a question for @Femennenly.   How does 'spotting' damage play into exp/credit generation?  

Heyo BadWolfz,

The How it works video above gives this breakdown at about 3 minutes in. In total it makes up about 15% of the exp earned in a battle and depending on ship class each will have different "earning" rates.

image.png

 

Fem, 

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11 minutes ago, Femennenly said:

Heyo Merc,

I will agree, the nature of DD play has adapted since the rework, however the core mechanics of how EXP is earned by players which is what OP states they feel has changed, has not - which is more what I was addressing. While some things have changed negatively for the destroyer, there has also been positives with the change of the rework beneficial to the DD:

  • Considerably less "First Blood / Dev Strikes" on DDs at the start of the game.
  • Planes no longer have the ability to spot torpedoes.
  • CVs no longer able to provide map wide spotting at once (Remember CVs spotting all three caps at once?). 

While it can be frustrating for the DD player to be spotted by the CV please consider this in reverse:

  • To maintain spotting on a DD the CV player has to sacrifice a limited defensive consumable for his team 
  • Depending on the DD positioning, the CV player may have to travel away from his intended target's path to drop off the plane.
  • The dropped plane will only (at max) last ~1 minute before departing, less if shot down.

The CV player has to consider the trade off in perusing a DD in relation to other actions they could be taking. 

One major change from pre 8.0 through to now, is that the impact of CVs is more noticeable due to the improved numbers of games. From experience, I feel like I was considerably more "deadly" towards DDs in the RTS CV modes, however since there was far fewer CV players, this was not as noticeable. Nowadays, with a healthier CV population, while their direct impact on a game itself is not as significant, since they are present in more games, their impact is more visible.


In regards to how to counter-play a CV in a DD, you have the foundation of a great tactic, using allies for AA is a good start. This can be extended into using terrain in caps, while you may be detected, if the enemy can't shoot you it doesn't always matter if you're visible. DD play has changed with the reworked CVs, but the ability to adapt, overcome, and succeed is still there if you approach the game with CV strengths and weaknesses in mind.

Fem, 

Additionally, you can also disengage AA which will decrease a CV's ability to spot you especially (if alone, and early in game, they try to take out dd's). While in smoke (disengage AA) your footprint is decreased significantly.

 

Edited by Sirzin_6
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2 hours ago, Merc85 said:

Fem, I know that I personally have significantly changed how I play DDs since the CV rework.  Now, with how fast the planes get back in the sky,  I definitely don't try to cap as much nor try to spot as much BECAUSE once a CV that is any good at all finds out the area you are in he/she just keeps on coming back to spot you and let his team shoot you.  It has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with how CVs now interact so quickly with their plane "respawns".  So the impact is as @Grimmortals has stated, but the reason imo it has occurred has nothing to do with the reward system, it has to do with the CV meta.  Radar is easy to deal with as compared to CVs because CVs can find you anywhere on the map.  So I stay away from caps and close to the fleet for AA support early in the game.  It's not much fun just doing so, but I've learned that is the only way to stay fairly healthy for a while if it is a CV battle.  What do you suggest in this regard?  

Use smoke to capture objectives. It lasts long enough unless you are a RN DD. If you are not, wait until the CV recalls his planes, you will have enough time to capture. I have yet to find a CV that is patient enough to keep his planes on the capture point for a long time, even in ranked. 

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