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grorg

Submarines convince me otherwise

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    Though they can be quite tasty, shout out to Viola's subs, I still maintain that sounds do not belong in this game.

   Point: implementing depth charges makes no sense to me. Someone already in a nonchalant manner said BBS won't get dpc they'll have to huddle with DDS for protection. Ok WG tried this with CV rework, doesn't work MMORPG Noone does that. What it's the defense, I'm a cruiser main am I supposed to cover BBS the whole game now from CV and sub!? implementing subs is going to take a lot of work. 

Point: ok we have the air for CV that's bad enough that I can kill one plane in 10 that's attacking me, now we have a whole new region to worry about below us. How will subs be countered, how do I see them? Will cruisers be given constant radar? I don't see how 2 maybe 3 charges of hydro can detect subs through a whole match. If subs can't be detected should there be a general concealment boost for everyone then?

    Point: already been brought to light that subs will be super slow so how will WG make them fun and engaging when they decide to ruin our lives by inserting them into the main game? Will WG buff speed double our triple so they are more competitive because people are unhappy? Can they go under or through islands because we don't know what's going to happen down there yet do we? 

     Please I'm looking for Debate on this, the introduction of subs to this game that I love is making me want to stop playing altogether. I don't see how this can work after the disaster of the CV rework. 

   Willing to keep in touch, thanks my WG community.

Edited by grorg
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get a grip

it wont be the end of the world

if no one dies because subs are in the game there is no reason to stress out

I am not going to bother typing out my reasonable thoughts of how they might work and modes they would work in

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2 minutes ago, CAPTMUDDXX said:

get a grip

it wont be the end of the world

if no one dies because subs are in the game there is no reason to stress out

I am not going to bother typing out my reasonable thoughts of how they might work and modes they would work in

Here's a thought, sourced from your post--

If subs can't kill anyone, will anyone even want to play them?

 

There's no real way for WG to make this an engaging interaction on both sides. Much like aircraft vs AA, it's going to be one side or the other that has all the fun, and the side that isn't is going to hate it.

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4 minutes ago, KiyoSenkan said:

Here's a thought, sourced from your post--

If subs can't kill anyone, will anyone even want to play them?

 

There's no real way for WG to make this an engaging interaction on both sides. Much like aircraft vs AA, it's going to be one side or the other that has all the fun, and the side that isn't is going to hate it.

He  means, if no one dies in the real world. Which I agree with him.

But I also agree with you, subs just sort of look like underwater cvs. I wont really scream bloody murder though, til I see how they plan to be implemented/ counters etc etc.

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Funny its BB drivers leading the anti sub charge; subs won’t bend you over any more than DDs do now.  Subs have fewer tubes than DDs and their deck guns aren’t going to HE spam you from smoke.  If you played the Halloween event you’d also know subs can’t stay submerged as long as DDs (at least US) can stay in smoke. 

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1 minute ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Funny its BB drivers leading the anti sub charge; subs won’t bend you over any more than DDs do now.  Subs have fewer tubes than DDs and their deck guns aren’t going to HE spam you from smoke.  If you played the Halloween event you’d also know subs can’t stay submerged as long as DDs (at least US) can stay in smoke. 

OP seems to be a cruiser main.

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1 minute ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Funny its BB drivers leading the anti sub charge; subs won’t bend you over any more than DDs do now.  Subs have fewer tubes than DDs and their deck guns aren’t going to HE spam you from smoke.  If you played the Halloween event you’d also know subs can’t stay submerged as long as DDs (at least US) can stay in smoke. 

I was a destroyer player, primarily, before I uninstalled.

I played the halloween event. Here's the thing about that: The opposing force was not played by humans. Other submarine games like Silent Hunter: OpFor is not played by humans.

Nobody wants to play a navy game where they are the surface ship being hunted relentlessly by submarines. Oftentimes in ships that are defenseless against them.

 

I'm pretty sure submarines are a desperate cash grab by WG as their sales base continues to shrink.

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6 minutes ago, KiyoSenkan said:

Nobody wants to play a navy game where they are the surface ship being hunted relentlessly by submarines. Oftentimes in ships that are defenseless against them.

Replace “submarines” with “destroyers” and you’re statement is true *today*, and yet people still play BBs.  You said you were a DD main, tell us, did you give all the BBs you sunk a fair chance at killing you?  Or did you stalk them, constantly out of detection, and torp their butts back to port?  Have DDs simply been a desperate cash grab by WG?

11 minutes ago, Octavian_of_Roma said:

OP seems to be a cruiser main.

I’m not going to study every posters profile on this board, his post was predicated with BBs not being able to counter subs, so I went with the BB angle.

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7 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Replace “submarines” with “destroyers” and you’re statement is true *today*, and yet people still play BBs.  You said you were a DD main, tell us, did you give all the BBs you sunk a fair chance at killing you?  Or did you stalk them, constantly out of detection, and torp their butts back to port?  Have DDs simply been a desperate cash grab by WG?

I’m not going to study every posters profile on this board, his post was predicated with BBs not being able to counter subs, so I went with the BB angle.

He literally says, "Im a cruiser main". lol

"What it's the defense, I'm a cruiser main am I supposed to cover BBS the whole game now from CV and sub!? implementing subs is going to take a lot of work. "

Edited by Octavian_of_Roma
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@KiyoSenkan That phrase means real world deaths. Also if you uninstalled months ago why are you even here polluting the forum?

Also this is a business so with no income there would be no game.

Get a grip and grow up.

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honestly i just want subs in the game so people will stop playing ijn dds. The ijn dds right now take on the subs role right now so when subs come in that are better then ijn dds at killing bbs  because of there lower concealment and better torps people will switch to that from ijn dds. Then maybe wg can slowly begining to remove them and then the game can become healthy 

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28 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Funny its BB drivers leading the anti sub charge; subs won’t bend you over any more than DDs do now.  Subs have fewer tubes than DDs and their deck guns aren’t going to HE spam you from smoke.  If you played the Halloween event you’d also know subs can’t stay submerged as long as DDs (at least US) can stay in smoke. 

At best they'll be filling a niche DDs already fill and at worse they'll be torp planes you don't see coming, lobbing torps every 20-40 seconds from close range.

In no way does this improve the game by existing. 

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Honestly, I feel like subs are a decent way to introduce something new into the game. As with every class, there is going to be a period of balancing to get them right, but in the long run, I feel like it could introduce something new and fresh into the game. I feel like that has been what this game has been needing - something new to help retain players better.

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17 minutes ago, KiyoSenkan said:

I'm pretty sure submarines are a desperate cash grab by WG as their sales base continues to shrink.

Golly gee; I wonder why that is happening...

...maybe because of a significant change that was made, which has ultimately changed little; and has managed to hack off even more players than that which it replaced?

5 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

...did you give all the BBs you sunk a fair chance at killing you?  Or did you stalk them, constantly out of detection, and torp their butts back to port?

My preference is not to be seen, yes. Yet in most cases a torpedo using destroyer still needs to be close enough to a battleship, in order to make an effective attack, that if the sub is spotted, a battleship could potentially be able to shoot at it.

We shall see how it works with subs; presuming they don’t wind up in some separate mode.

 

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I love people who ignorantly think WG's monetization method is the only monetization method.

Keep white knighting for the company that brainwashed you into defending it via Sunk Cost fallacy, my dude.

I'm still here because I'm bored at work and watching this game slow-roast itself to death is amusing. Each cash grab is more obvious and more desperate than the last.

 

Here's a thing to consider: WG uses a Frustration-oriented monetization model. But there are companies that are even more successful and make multiple times more money than all 3 of WG's products combined-- using a Satisfaction-oriented monetization model. They build a relationship with customers, create repeat customers, and foster brand loyalty by treating their customers as human beings instead of wallets with legs. You might have heard of them. Every major retailer. Every major Corporation. Car dealerships of used and new varieties. Companies like Nestle and Nerf and Kleenex. Valve, Blizzard, and Activision.

 

Yeah they want your money, but they don't sell you sandpaper, call it tissues, and insult you when you tell them they're wrong. Which is what WG does. And EA, come to think of it.

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Just now, MuricanClassBattleship said:

Honestly, I feel like subs are a decent way to introduce something new into the game. As with every class, there is going to be a period of balancing to get them right, but in the long run, I feel like it could introduce something new and fresh into the game. I feel like that has been what this game has been needing - something new to help retain players better.

Depending on how you define their existence; WG has spent either eight months or four years trying to balance carriers...

... their track record of ‘balancing’ a class of outliers doesn’t exactly encourage confidence in their ability to do so with another.

As far as money grabs go; I want an I-401, even if it’s just a regular IJN premium, for my ARP Iona and Gunzou captains.

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23 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Replace “submarines” with “destroyers” and you’re statement is true *today*, and yet people still play BBs.  You said you were a DD main, tell us, did you give all the BBs you sunk a fair chance at killing you?  Or did you stalk them, constantly out of detection, and torp their butts back to port?  Have DDs simply been a desperate cash grab by WG?

No, destroyers are not a cash grab. This argument simply doesn't work. You're just trying to paint extreme hyperbole to make me shut up.

As for "giving BBs a fair chance", being seen by a battleship isn't a fair chance at all. It heavily favors the battleship. Stealth is the destroyer's defense against guns that can and will erase them with next to no effort.

Source: I also played battleships. Fairly well-rounded player, honestly.

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58 minutes ago, CAPTMUDDXX said:

get a grip

it wont be the end of the world

if no one dies because subs are in the game there is no reason to stress out

I am not going to bother typing out my reasonable thoughts of how they might work and modes they would work in

Thanks for your assurances do you think there is anything you can share to convince myself and others other than get a grip.

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1 hour ago, grorg said:

Point: implementing depth charges makes no sense to me.

1 hour ago, grorg said:

Point: ok we have the air for CV that's bad enough that I can kill one plane in 10 that's attacking me, now we have a whole new region to worry about below us. How will subs be countered, how do I see them? Will cruisers be given constant radar? I don't see how 2 maybe 3 charges of hydro can detect subs through a whole match. If subs can't be detected should there be a general concealment boost for everyone then?

^^^ Apparently, you did not partake in the submarine event of last year. These questions are redunedent now.

 

1 hour ago, grorg said:

Point: already been brought to light that subs will be super slow so how will WG make them fun and engaging when they decide to ruin our lives by inserting them into the main game? Will WG buff speed double our triple so they are more competitive because people are unhappy? Can they go under or through islands because we don't know what's going to happen down there yet do we?

From what I know Subs are getting their own game mode this year. Last year was proof of concept in a PVE setting..

Last year It was a huge success... Gamers from other games enjoyed it as well.

I am confident, Subs will save face of WG after the "rework" debacle. The issue I have is, the lack of communication about the mode... This problem happen in the past with the Savage/Rouge wave event.

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5 minutes ago, Navalpride33 said:

...the lack of communication about the mode...

Lack of communication is part of the reason the rework which shall not be named was such a debacle.

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@grorg It is right there in my last sentence! I am not going to bother typing my reasonable thoughts/suggestions to WG about subs usage in the game. It is already in replies to many senseless threads like yours. Seek and you might find them.

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1 hour ago, KiyoSenkan said:

Here's a thought, sourced from your post--

If subs can't kill anyone, will anyone even want to play them?

 

There's no real way for WG to make this an engaging interaction on both sides. Much like aircraft vs AA, it's going to be one side or the other that has all the fun, and the side that isn't is going to hate it.

Great point m8 how do we make it fair for everyone .

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4 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Lack of communication is part of the reason the rework which shall not be named was such a debacle.

I would also add, from patch 0.8.0.1 to currrent.... They're also changing the AA structure on the fly basis.. 

WG's failure to revamp the CV, with out considering redoing AA  to fit the reworked class, Is just bad...

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1 hour ago, CAPTMUDDXX said:

get a grip

it wont be the end of the world

if no one dies because subs are in the game there is no reason to stress out

I am not going to bother typing out my reasonable thoughts of how they might work and modes they would work in

I like this  ^^^^ makes sense +1

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2 hours ago, grorg said:

 

    Though they can be quite tasty, shout out to Viola's subs, I still maintain that sounds do not belong in this game.

   Point: implementing depth charges makes no sense to me. Someone already in a nonchalant manner said BBS won't get dpc they'll have to huddle with DDS for protection. Ok WG tried this with CV rework, doesn't work MMORPG Noone does that. What it's the defense, I'm a cruiser main am I supposed to cover BBS the whole game now from CV and sub!? implementing subs is going to take a lot of work. 

Point: ok we have the air for CV that's bad enough that I can kill one plane in 10 that's attacking me, now we have a whole new region to worry about below us. How will subs be countered, how do I see them? Will cruisers be given constant radar? I don't see how 2 maybe 3 charges of hydro can detect subs through a whole match. If subs can't be detected should there be a general concealment boost for everyone then?

    Point: already been brought to light that subs will be super slow so how will WG make them fun and engaging when they decide to ruin our lives by inserting them into the main game? Will WG buff speed double our triple so they are more competitive because people are unhappy? Can they go under or through islands because we don't know what's going to happen down there yet do we? 

     Please I'm looking for Debate on this, the introduction of subs to this game that I love is making me want to stop playing altogether. I don't see how this can work after the disaster of the CV rework. 

   Willing to keep in touch, thanks my WG community.

One plane in ten? Then explain why even DD's are tearing up my squadrons?

1 hour ago, CAPTMUDDXX said:

get a grip

it wont be the end of the world

if no one dies because subs are in the game there is no reason to stress out

I am not going to bother typing out my reasonable thoughts of how they might work and modes they would work in

My very real fear is that subs will be a train wreck that will make the CV rework look like it was perfectly executed, they are going to be impossible to balance.

 

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