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Rabbitt81

French DD event: WGing is copying EA's predatory money grab tactics.

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Apex Legends is running a limited time event appropriately named "Iron Whale" :Smile_veryhappy:

Purchasing one loot box is 7 dollars each and 10 loot boxes costs 70 dollars. You can also unlock the bonus item by purchasing all the collection items for 204 dollars. 

Notice the similarities with the loot boxes and buy X amount to get the bonus item...

The French DD event is the new normal for free to play game events. Say goodbye to earning any kind of reasonable reward for your grinding effort. 

Now it's either grind for a chance of getting a reward if RNG is in your favor OR you can pay the ridiculous amount up front.

This money grabbing scheme is weapons-grade toxic garbage and should not be tolerated by the playerbase of WOWS.

WGing, copying EA is not a good idea.

Stop it, get some help.

 

whale.jpg

Edited by Rabbitt81
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Are you talking about loot boxes that drop ships, or...? Because WG has been doing that for something like a year+ now if so.

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2 hours ago, Rabbitt81 said:

WGing, copying EA is not a good idea.

Actually, if you take into account of the timing, it's worse - EA is the one copying Wargaming:cap_haloween:

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This has been going on a lot longer.  One example are the Santa Crates, which have been going for 2 holiday seasons now.  There's countless others.

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It's always amused how the lootbox rubbish is so accepted in this game.  WG knows it too, look how the scummy monetisation envelope gets getting pushed.

Edited by Snarky_Wombat
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3 hours ago, Rabbitt81 said:

Apex Legends is running a limited time event appropriately named "Iron Whale" :Smile_veryhappy:

Purchasing one loot box is 7 dollars each and 10 loot boxes costs 70 dollars. You can also unlock the bonus item by purchasing all the collection items for 204 dollars. 

Notice the similarities with the loot boxes and buy X amount to get the bonus item...

The French DD event is the new normal for free to play game events. Say goodbye to earning any kind of reasonable reward for your grinding effort. 

Now it's either grind for a chance of getting a reward if RNG is in your favor OR you can pay the ridiculous amount up front.

This money grabbing scheme is weapons-grade toxic garbage and should not be tolerated by the playerbase of WOWS.

WGing, copying EA is not a good idea.

Stop it, get some help.

 

whale.jpg

I'm going to point out a big flaw in your comparison: 

EA forces you to buy things in order to have any fun.

Wargaming makes you pay to get things easier or early.

You see the difference? EA makes it mandatory, Wargaming doesn't.  Now I will admit that it is similar, but it's not the same.

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Understand these Destroyers are going to be fully released in the Tech Tree very soon.

Does it suck to get no or barely any mission drops for them?  Yes.

But the Line will be officially, fully released soon.  So don't worry.

 

If you want to see real drama over this, wait until the Santa Crates come back around again.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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Misinformed assertions! Manufactured outrage! Senationalist garbage! 

Seriously OP, you have no idea what you're on about. Early unlocks for French DDs =/= a mandatory $200 purchase for a weapon skin. I didn't get Mogador from crates, so in two patches I'll just grind it for free. WG gets plenty of things wrong, but equating the Apex event with the French DD event is ignorant and factually incorrect.

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10 minutes ago, SkaerKrow said:

Misinformed assertions! Manufactured outrage! Senationalist garbage! 

Seriously OP, you have no idea what you're on about. Early unlocks for French DDs =/= a mandatory $200 purchase for a weapon skin. I didn't get Mogador from crates, so in two patches I'll just grind it for free. WG gets plenty of things wrong, but equating the Apex event with the French DD event is ignorant and factually incorrect.

Though you have to grant him that by prolonging the release of Mogador and Kleber (to be available in 0.8.8 instead of 0.8.7) is a nudge towards spending money and time now to go for the early unlock since you will be delayed by two months instead of one. 

Could it be simply cause WG is running out of content and they want to drag it on? No idea at all.

Last, and on a more general note, Apex Legends isn't the real example of EA tactics. FIFA Ultimate Team is the real flagship when it comes to scummy behavior.

Edited by warheart1992

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55 minutes ago, SkaerKrow said:

Misinformed assertions! Manufactured outrage! Senationalist garbage! 

Seriously OP, you have no idea what you're on about. Early unlocks for French DDs =/= a mandatory $200 purchase for a weapon skin. I didn't get Mogador from crates, so in two patches I'll just grind it for free. WG gets plenty of things wrong, but equating the Apex event with the French DD event is ignorant and factually incorrect.

Agreed.

However ...

It would not that big a step for WG to get to that point. And I hope they don't make that step.

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3 hours ago, TheKrimzonDemon said:

Apparently you don't realize no-one needs to buy any of the boxes, we'll get all those DDs anyway.

It's still predatory as it only should appeal to people with gambling problems or a poor understanding of money. Terrible value otherwise. 

WG, EA etc. aren't trying to sell this stuff to people valuing time over money, they're trying to sell to people who for one reason or another don't value money at all.

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2 hours ago, Neko_Ship_Akashi said:

I'm not justifying it, just saying that Wargaming isn't at EA's level yet

Sounds like a justification to me.  Where is the bar?  It's only a little bit scummy?  It's this attitude that has permitted the creep of abject greed, gambling systems and games designed to gouge as much as possible.  Started with "DLC", leaving parts out of the game only to buy later and progressed from there.   Yet the collective keeps buying this crap and justifying against our own consumer position time and time again.

My personal opinion, I believe WG is right up there with EA.  Loot boxes everywhere, unbelievingly expensive digital goods, game systems that push you into paying money if you want to smooth out the feeling of grind.  Add the bait and switch tactics WG seems to be fond of and frankly, I'm amazed they haven't brought in premium ammo yet.

Apologies to you though.  I know you are thinking that you're not condoning this stuff but that is just how far we have come with all this nonsense - tacit approval in the mask of perceived neutrality.

End of rant.

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4 minutes ago, BlackAngelCom said:

it only should appeal to people with gambling problems or a poor understanding of money.

No, what it preys on is people's impatience. The "gotta have it now" crowd. The ones who want the Mogador now so they can have all the XP on it ready for the day the Kleber comes out (and the T9-T10 grind is long enough that the extra month probably won't hurt). 

I got the Guepard and the Jaguar as early unlocks, but guess what? I won't be spending every minute of the day grinding out XP on the Guepard just so I can get the Vauquelin the day it releases. I want to take my time over this and enjoy it slowly.

The simple fact is that you don't have to spend a single cent in WOWS to get your hands on some pretty good ships and do well with them. How you spend your money is up to you, but I don't think it's in any higher temporal power's interests or moral remit to be shielding you from your errors if you can't do it properly.

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I am continuously amazed at how little control most people have over their own spending.  They just can't seem to help themselves.

Latest and greatest new digital ship?  MUST BUY!

Latest and greatest new cell phone?  MUST BUY!

Latest and greatest car?  MUST BUY!

Latest and greatest fashion item?  MUST BUY!

I buy what I want, when I want.  If it is over $500, I usually shop, ponder, debate about it for 3-4 months before actually buying it.

Perhaps this is why I have no debt (except for two mortgages, one of which is almost paid off).

For any of you with financial difficulties, I strongly recommend a certain "financial university" plan created by a guy named Dave Ramsey.  It was a game changer for me, but you have to learn financial discipline to achieve financial freedom (I am not affiliated in any way, and I hope this mention doesn't violate any rules, as I strongly believe it can help a lot of people).

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4 hours ago, TheKrimzonDemon said:

Apparently you don't realize no-one needs to buy any of the boxes, we'll get all those DDs anyway

The content for sale is irrelevant. 

I posted on here that the fire nerf to the super cruisers was actually a test to see if the playerbase would push back against nerfing already released premium ships. What happened soon after? We had the proposed Guilio Cesare nerf to deal with. Why? Because WGing perceived that it was acceptable to do so. 

That is the reason for this post, to let WGing know that these scummy EA type of events DO NOT belong in this game.

If there's not much push back to predatory money grab whale hunt events, then be prepared to be largely excluded from future events unless you want to throw cash around needlessly. 

Edited by Rabbitt81
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8 hours ago, Rabbitt81 said:

WGing, copying EA

industry standards are a thing. VW was not the only car company that altered the diesel emissions during testing. that also was industry standard. 

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1 hour ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

No, what it preys on is people's impatience. The "gotta have it now" crowd. The ones who want the Mogador now so they can have all the XP on it ready for the day the Kleber comes out (and the T9-T10 grind is long enough that the extra month probably won't hurt). 

I got the Guepard and the Jaguar as early unlocks, but guess what? I won't be spending every minute of the day grinding out XP on the Guepard just so I can get the Vauquelin the day it releases. I want to take my time over this and enjoy it slowly.

The simple fact is that you don't have to spend a single cent in WOWS to get your hands on some pretty good ships and do well with them. How you spend your money is up to you, but I don't think it's in any higher temporal power's interests or moral remit to be shielding you from your errors if you can't do it properly.

People not understanding the value of their impatience is the same thing as not grasping the real cost in money of what's being proposed. Lootboxes aren't pay to progress faster like a premium account, converting XP or a premium ship. The psychology is different and is why every society ever has cracked down on gambling. Humans have a hard time resisting gambling and are mostly bad at probability. 

 

The premium crates are $3 each. They may contain, besides the ship mission,  two things of monetary value - 1 day of premium time (assuming this is needed) or 150 doubloons. May, it can also give coal, which is an in game free resource. At its most inefficient, a day of premium sells for $1.49 and the doubloons, 1250 for 6.69. One may win EITHER but not both the day and the 150, so let's take the more valuable of them, ignore coal entirely and say the box is worth $1.50 guaranteed. Again, the doubloons even at worst rate are 80 cents and the coal is nigh zero, so the box doesn't guarantee $1.50 at all. I could do $1.00 instead, doesn't matter. This isn't a good rate. This is not a holiday crate where it's all bonus. 

The Armory sells these for a worse rate, 750 doubloons equivalent to $4. And the best bulk discount on that rate is 10%, so $3.60, massively more expensive than the cash shop. It also sells regular crates for 150 doubloons, which is clearly negative expectations as they don't contain doubloons or premium at all. 

Premium box at best rate is $3. Being VERY generous, $1.50 is buying a shiny slot machine token that gives ship mission or nothing. Exact odds depends on what the drop rate is which they don't state, but it's not great. 

This is gambling. 

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I don't understand the comment "they make you." They don't make me, anyone can choose. I choose to buy Santa crates for the Dragon flags.

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22 minutes ago, BlackAngelCom said:

People not understanding the value of their impatience is the same thing as not grasping the real cost in money of what's being proposed. Lootboxes aren't pay to progress faster like a premium account, converting XP or a premium ship. The psychology is different and is why every society ever has cracked down on gambling. Humans have a hard time resisting gambling and are mostly bad at probability. 

 

The premium crates are $3 each. They may contain, besides the ship mission,  two things of monetary value - 1 day of premium time (assuming this is needed) or 150 doubloons. May, it can also give coal, which is an in game free resource. At its most inefficient, a day of premium sells for $1.49 and the doubloons, 1250 for 6.69. One may win EITHER but not both the day and the 150, so let's take the more valuable of them, ignore coal entirely and say the box is worth $1.50 guaranteed. Again, the doubloons even at worst rate are 80 cents and the coal is nigh zero, so the box doesn't guarantee $1.50 at all. I could do $1.00 instead, doesn't matter. This isn't a good rate. This is not a holiday crate where it's all bonus. 

The Armory sells these for a worse rate, 750 doubloons equivalent to $4. And the best bulk discount on that rate is 10%, so $3.60, massively more expensive than the cash shop. It also sells regular crates for 150 doubloons, which is clearly negative expectations as they don't contain doubloons or premium at all. 

Premium box at best rate is $3. Being VERY generous, $1.50 is buying a shiny slot machine token that gives ship mission or nothing. Exact odds depends on what the drop rate is which they don't state, but it's not great. 

This is gambling. 

Not really, you can gain something from gambling, your statistics show that you are already buying a loss. That's not gambling it's just chucking money away. Just get the $200 dollar 2 ship deal, that way you know you aren't just throwing away money. Right?

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4 hours ago, Neko_Ship_Akashi said:

I'm not justifying it, just saying that Wargaming isn't at EA's level yet.

When you look at what they charge for premium ships and then compare the power creep and economic benefits they get.... yeah I would say they are worse actually.

One ship costing as much as the premium edition of a new release game is ridiculous. 

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9 hours ago, Rabbitt81 said:

Now it's either grind for a chance of getting a reward if RNG is in your favor OR you can pay the ridiculous amount up front.

Alaska, Azuma, Musashi, Lazo, Benham, Siroco, Nelson, Salem, Georgia, JB.  These are just a few of the, I dunno how many premium ships that I have in my port that I got for free via some sort of event or grind.  They were not a lotto.  I did the grind, I got a 100% chance of getting the ship. Didn't spend a penny on them.

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28 minutes ago, Burnsy said:

Alaska, Azuma, Musashi, Lazo, Benham, Siroco, Nelson, Salem, Georgia, JB.  These are just a few of the, I dunno how many premium ships that I have in my port that I got for free via some sort of event or grind.  They were not a lotto.  I did the grind, I got a 100% chance of getting the ship. Didn't spend a penny on them.

And what does that have to do with the subject of the post? 

Oh, maybe you mean WG gave me something for free so it's ok to fleece the players.

That's the mindset that allows these things to progress. 

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44 minutes ago, Rabbitt81 said:

And what does that have to do with the subject of the post? 

Oh, maybe you mean WG gave me something for free so it's ok to fleece the players.

That's the mindset that allows these things to progress. 

I quoted the part it has to do with.  You said:

" Now it's either grind for a chance of getting a reward if RNG is in your favor OR you can pay the ridiculous amount up front. "

That isn't true in many examples, like the ones I listed. They gave away some really nice premium ships not via "chance" at all, just do the requirement, get the thing.  No loot box or RNG involved.

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