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Destroyer_KuroshioKai

The danger of getting to close to a Neustrashimy

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Heres a quick ranked game won on me coming around the corner and eviscerating the two enemy BBs that made the mistake of getting too close to my Neustra.  The ship is quickly becoming a favorite of mine for the unique tactics you can use, like the super heal keeping me alive long enough to get a good angle on BB number two.  I just wish she had a special camo available for tokens right now, I'd love the XP and ECXP bonuses as I rank out.

 

  • Cool 7

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Chung Mu in ranked...........You're already a ship down/up. And why BBs think they can skip around islands with no penalties is beyond me.

Nice little run

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Im not sure how to counter one when i see it. Im having trouble.

I mean if i catch em when their heal is down and force a 1 turret battle i got em, but im genuinely scared of them in the r5+ bracket. 

Unless they royally screw up and eat a torp or something i have a difficult time winning a prolonged battle over the course of the round. 

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3 hours ago, Report_CVs said:

Im not sure how to counter one when i see it. Im having trouble.

I mean if i catch em when their heal is down and force a 1 turret battle i got em, but im genuinely scared of them in the r5+ bracket. 

Unless they royally screw up and eat a torp or something i have a difficult time winning a prolonged battle over the course of the round. 

Per your thread you are playing Jutland, so AP use at close range so they can escape and IFHE is the best bet.  The AP will force them to angle giving a mostly 1 turret DPM level.  At this point switch back to HE and target that gun to knock it out with HE that pens the 20mm turret face.  The issue is this can work 1v1, but it’s going to take a while if they have repair.  That rep is strong enough it won’t lose that much HP if you are not scoring AP pen damage DPM.

It can be difficult if the Neustrashimy knows what they should be doing.  They should be positioning to scout for other DDs and larger ships in a position that they are the likely target, giving some breathing room for DDs that have fantastic DPM but no repair party like Kitakaze.  As I discussed with clan mates you basically should kill the Neustrashimy’s support, then kill it in most circumstances.  That’s complicated by a smart Neustrashimy player letting his other DDs smoke up first while kiting away providing vision.  While spotting it’s hitting priority targets like DDs without repair, kitakaze and Black are among the top targets with its guns.  The exception being when it’s low, or you have enough team mates to blast through the repair effect, always end it, if it gets a repair off it’s right back in the fight. I won a sloppy game where I ate not only a Neptune torp, but a Benham torp as well.  The Benham torp almost killed me, and I had about 30 seconds on my repair.  He didn’t immediately chase me, I got the repair off and traded him finishing off the enemy team.

You just can’t lose too much HP killing the team since with a gun build it still can hurt things.  So far the couple I fought died alone having lost their support.  The strongest point about the boat is it just does not want to die, even one rep gives it a large HP advantage over every other T9 DD, and if using all three reps it has roughly the same HP pool of two Jutland.  It’s an interesting DD to fight because it breaks some of the typical rules fighting DDs.

Hope this helps.

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44 minutes ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

Per your thread you are playing Jutland, so AP use at close range so they can escape and IFHE is the best bet.  The AP will force them to angle giving a mostly 1 turret DPM level.  At this point switch back to HE and target that gun to knock it out with HE that pens the 20mm turret face.  The issue is this can work 1v1, but it’s going to take a while if they have repair.  That rep is strong enough it won’t lose that much HP if you are not scoring AP pen damage DPM.

It can be difficult if the Neustrashimy knows what they should be doing.  They should be positioning to scout for other DDs and larger ships in a position that they are the likely target, giving some breathing room for DDs that have fantastic DPM but no repair party like Kitakaze.  As I discussed with clan mates you basically should kill the Neustrashimy’s support, then kill it in most circumstances.  That’s complicated by a smart Neustrashimy player letting his other DDs smoke up first while kiting away providing vision.  While spotting it’s hitting priority targets like DDs without repair, kitakaze and Black are among the top targets with its guns.  The exception being when it’s low, or you have enough team mates to blast through the repair effect, always end it, if it gets a repair off it’s right back in the fight. I won a sloppy game where I ate not only a Neptune torp, but a Benham torp as well.  The Benham torp almost killed me, and I had about 30 seconds on my repair.  He didn’t immediately chase me, I got the repair off and traded him finishing off the enemy team.

You just can’t lose too much HP killing the team since with a gun build it still can hurt things.  So far the couple I fought died alone having lost their support.  The strongest point about the boat is it just does not want to die, even one rep gives it a large HP advantage over every other T9 DD, and if using all three reps it has roughly the same HP pool of two Jutland.  It’s an interesting DD to fight because it breaks some of the typical rules fighting DDs.

Hope this helps.

Kuro, you're really starting to sway me on picking up Neustrashimy.  Looked at it a bunch in the Armory yesterday, but didn't pull the trigger.  I think her combined with Z-46 could be a nice combo to rank out with.

The fact that Neustrashimy is such a rare ship is also a bonus in that not many people are familiar with it and/or no how to counter it.

Edited by Ace_04

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33 minutes ago, Sweaty_Anime_Girls said:

I'm glad I haven't encountered any of those roaches yet in ranked. Dealing with that sounds like a nightmare!

 

12 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

Kuro, you're really starting to sway me on picking up Neustrashimy.  Looked at it a bunch in the Armory yesterday, but didn't pull the trigger.  I think her combined with Z-46 could be a nice combo to rank out with.

The fact that Neustrashimy is such a rare ship is also a bonus in that not many people are familiar with it and/or no how to counter it.

Then you might like this post.

I keep wondering how long the opinion it’s a bad ship will persist.  The typical DD you have gun DPM and a fixed HP pool, Neustrashimy in this case has on the surface a much lower DPM, but the catch is it can potentially live much longer, theoretically keeping your guns going longer.

I ran some numbers against Kitakaze and my Neustrashimy build vs another Kitakaze.  For my brains sake I ignored X factors like saturation mechanics restricting the numbers to raw HE pen damage vs each ship. The numbers are in the ball park of what I suspected.  If  both ships were under fire from a Kitakaze landing every shot for full pen damage, over the course of the life span of the ship Neustrashimy does more gun damage, assuming it can disengage and get all of its full repairs off, than Kitakaze due to the final HP pool of 50,080 HP from Neustrashimy. With that other special Russian captain you get a free 4th repair and probably even more HP, I don’t have that captain, so I just ran my numbers with Ovechkin.

Admittedly it’s unlikely our get perfect repairs off, AP damage cuts into you potential repair pool a bit, and sometimes you use it tactically, and not to strictly recover the most HP possible.  I’d still want to confirm it in the training room a bit before hanging my hat on it, but it seems to indicate what my ranked games are showing, that nibbling at a Kitakaze, a ship universally respected for how dangerous it is gets ground down over time by Neustrashimy.

It is worth noting that the Kitakaze would still have more DPM against thicker plated ships with my Neustrashimy build having 21mm of HE pen, but a max potential pen of 28mm.

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17 minutes ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

Then you might like this post.

I keep wondering how long the opinion it’s a bad ship will persist.  The typical DD you have gun DPM and a fixed HP pool, Neustrashimy in this case has on the surface a much lower DPM, but the catch is it can potentially live much longer, theoretically keeping your guns going longer.

I ran some numbers against Kitakaze and my Neustrashimy build vs another Kitakaze.  For my brains sake I ignored X factors like saturation mechanics restricting the numbers to raw HE pen damage vs each ship. The numbers are in the ball park of what I suspected.  If  both ships were under fire from a Kitakaze landing every shot for full pen damage, over the course of the life span of the ship Neustrashimy does more gun damage, assuming it can disengage and get all of its full repairs off, than Kitakaze due to the final HP pool of 50,080 HP from Neustrashimy. With that other special Russian captain you get a free 4th repair and probably even more HP, I don’t have that captain, so I just ran my numbers with Ovechkin.

Admittedly it’s unlikely our get perfect repairs off, AP damage cuts into you potential repair pool a bit, and sometimes you use it tactically, and not to strictly recover the most HP possible.  I’d still want to confirm it in the training room a bit before hanging my hat on it, but it seems to indicate what my ranked games are showing, that nibbling at a Kitakaze, a ship universally respected for how dangerous it is gets ground down over time by Neustrashimy.

It is worth noting that the Kitakaze would still have more DPM against thicker plated ships with my Neustrashimy build having 21mm of HE pen, but a max potential pen of 28mm.

I don't think it's that it's a bad ship, but as you mentioned before, a ship geared more toward something like Ranked over Randoms.  There are definitely other Russian DDs better suited for PvP gameplay than Neustrashimy, in my opinion.  But she does look darn tempting to try in Ranked.  If I pick her up, I'd likely try her out starting with this build:

Capture.JPG.8016f5eaa2d4ace4e6348c9b0b000951.JPG

Your thoughts?

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Oh I know it's not a bad ship, and I think that probably also a big reason for why there are seemingly so few of them around is that it has kind of (pun intended?) gone under the radar for a lot of folks. I think a lot of people probably just forgot about it, or don't know very much about it and don't really feel interested in investing the steel because they don't know much about it.

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25 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

I don't think it's that it's a bad ship, but as you mentioned before, a ship geared more toward something like Ranked over Randoms.  There are definitely other Russian DDs better suited for PvP gameplay than Neustrashimy, in my opinion.  But she does look darn tempting to try in Ranked.  If I pick her up, I'd likely try her out starting with this build:

Capture.JPG.8016f5eaa2d4ace4e6348c9b0b000951.JPG

Your thoughts?

I use BFT over AR and PT (everyones gonna shoot me anyways so I plan accordingly).  I have been tempted to drop DE for AR for more gun DPM, but that 11% fire chance has been nice pressuring BBs and large CAs.  Heres my build:  https://wowsft.com/ship?index=PRSD709&modules=11111&upgrades=143222&commander=PAW405&skills=2154987522&consumables=22222&lang=en

I'm itching for T9 CB with this boat now that CB isnt just at T10 anymore.

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22 minutes ago, Capt_of_Satisfaction said:

Good stuff!

Has anyone ever told you you sound like Nick Offerman? :Smile_teethhappy:

I have been told I sound like Ron Swanson, Nicholas Cage, and who ever that guy is just this week!  This cold has really jacked my voice up!

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Oh so tempted 

 I'm on the fence still but one little breeze can I could fall for it and get one

 

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26 minutes ago, Sweaty_Anime_Girls said:

Oh I know it's not a bad ship, and I think that probably also a big reason for why there are seemingly so few of them around is that it has kind of (pun intended?) gone under the radar for a lot of folks. I think a lot of people probably just forgot about it, or don't know very much about it and don't really feel interested in investing the steel because they don't know much about it.

What I see most people get hung up on is price.  They look at the cost of Black and nope out.  The thing is Black was always a ranked reward, and had to be priced accordingly so people could buy her after ranking out the equivalent of 5 times.  My hunch is Steel DDs will be priced around what Neustra is.

There are a few in my clan that thinks the ship is trash because they desire ships with more DPM upfront.

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10 hours ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

Heres a quick ranked game won on me coming around the corner and eviscerating the two enemy BBs that made the mistake of getting too close to my Neustra.  The ship is quickly becoming a favorite of mine for the unique tactics you can use, like the super heal keeping me alive long enough to get a good angle on BB number two.  I just wish she had a special camo available for tokens right now, I'd love the XP and ECXP bonuses as I rank out.

 

Much Much  respect for the work you do on DDs.   We are integrating quite a bit of the stuff you post in my clans DD training regime.  So much good info. 

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Just now, silverdahc said:

Oh so tempted 

 I'm on the fence still but one little breeze can I could fall for it and get one

 

My suggestion is to wait till your coupon is about to expire.  Its why I bought mine, I was going to lose a coupon.  Its not going anywhere right now, and there are several DDs coming down the pike.

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25 minutes ago, Destroyer_KuroshioKai said:

My suggestion is to wait till your coupon is about to expire.  Its why I bought mine, I was going to lose a coupon.  Its not going anywhere right now, and there are several DDs coming down the pike.

Other than Friesland, there's not a whole lot in the pipeline that looks interesting to me at this time.  That'd sure be an interesting choice for Ranked play.

Kinda wish I had Mogodor to try in Ranked as well, as I've seen some pretty good ones so far.  Looks like a pretty fun ship.

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33 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

Other than Friesland, there's not a whole lot in the pipeline that looks interesting to me at this time.  That'd sure be an interesting choice for Ranked play.

Kinda wish I had Mogodor to try in Ranked as well, as I've seen some pretty good ones so far.  Looks like a pretty fun ship.

 I'm waiting on the Somers and the Hayate

 I only have steel for 2 ships,   I'm tempted to get neuteredshimmy but I don't know

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7 minutes ago, silverdahc said:

 I'm waiting on the Somers and the Hayate

 I only have steel for 2 ships,   I'm tempted to get neuteredshimmy but I don't know

I couldn't remember the currency cost for Friesland, but found out its 1 million FXP.  That makes the decision on using steel for Neustrashimy an even more tempting one.

Honestly, I'm not familiar enough with Somers or Hayate to have an opinion on them yet.  Aren't they both "jack-of-all-trades" hybrid torpedo/gunboat DDs?

Edited by Ace_04

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18 minutes ago, silverdahc said:

 I'm waiting on the Somers and the Hayate

 I only have steel for 2 ships,   I'm tempted to get neuteredshimmy but I don't know

See I really want to like Hayate, but I just can't right now, and I'll tell you the main reason is its concealment.

Maybe I'm just a bit biased here since Harekaze is pretty much my favorite premium in the game, but I look at what I think Hayate should or could be and I think tier 10 Harekaze: another IJN true hybrid destroyer, given the tech three lines split pretty radically in the direction of torpedoes and guns, so something like that would be unique and interesting.

My issue right now regarding that concealment is that I just don't see why I would want to play Hayate when there are already other tier 10 tech tree destroyers that fulfill the same role but better.

A key part of this problem is the fact that Hayate must choose between smoke and TRB. That alone, I am absolutely fine with, but then consider the fact that if you do take TRB, you have best case 6.1km concealment with no smoke (or heal) and just average speed. That's pretty yikes if you ask me. And then if you do take smoke instead of TRB, then really I don't think the ship could be considered a hybrid at all, the torpedo reload would just be way too long and it just kind of seems to me like a Grozovoi without heal or DFAA. Why would I want to play that?

What I would like to see them do is buff the concealment on the Hayate to a much more competitive level, like, at least 5.8km, maybe even 5.7. If they really feel this alone would make the ship overpowered, I would like for the health to be nerfed in exchange (Hayate actually has a pretty good amount of health right now), maybe and/or nerf the fire chance because that seems super high right now. This kind of also goes in line with Harekaze, having the lowest health pool of all tier 8 destroyers and lower than many if not most tier 7s. It means that you have to think about which engagements you do and don't take since you don't have much health to be careless with, but having best in class concealment allows you to do so. I love that playstyle and it's what I would like to see out of Hayate. Unfortunately, the way it is right now absolutely does not lend itself to that. I've been considering making a full post about this but I'm not sure yet.

Edited by Sweaty_Anime_Girls

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6 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

I couldn't remember the currency cost for Friesland, but found out its 1 million FXP.  That makes the decision on using steel for Neustrashimy an even more tempting one.

Honestly, I'm not familiar enough with Somers or Hayate to have an opinion on them yet.  Aren't they both "jack-of-all-trades" hybrid torpedo/gunboat DDs?

See my above comment. I get the feeling that Hayate is intended to be a true hybrid destroyer, but for the reasons I stated, I feel that it fails at that right now simply because I can't find any reason why I would want to play it over something like Grozovoi.

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33 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

Honestly, I'm not familiar enough with Somers or Hayate to have an opinion on them yet.  Aren't they both "jack-of-all-trades" hybrid torpedo/gunboat DDs?

Somers is weird.  It's got the same 5" guns every american DD has, but 4 twin turrets.  So that's a lot of barrels!  But... they keep nerfing the fire rate.  Last I saw it's got a 6 second reload so if you're looking at shells per minute it's got less than Gearing, less than all the 5-gun Fletchers and Bensons... it's barely ahead of Sims and Benham.  Why release a ship with the heaviest broadside on any US DD yet released and then do that to it?

3x4 16 KM Gearing torpedoes should make it an unmatched torpedo threat in the 12-16 km range, but with those guns you're going to want to run from every DD you meet.  Seems sorta like a Benham with better concealment but without the hilarious nonstop torpedo output.  I'm trying to maintain the hype for it because TIER TEN STEEL DD but I don't know.

Edited by Brhinosaurus

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