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Wye_So_Serious

If you don't think submarines...

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aren't going to be announced for 2019 Q4 at Gamescom in August you aren't paying attention.

Reasoned speculation here:

No Subs --> Well, maybe subs --> Halloween subs (Q3 2018) --> ASW DDs announced --> 3 recent sub videos

I don't think they have enough time to get the Italian cruisers tested, balanced and the whole arc thing for Q4 so I think it will be subs.

I would gladly accept being incorrect. We'll know in a few weeks.

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3 minutes ago, Wye_So_Serious said:

aren't going to be announced for 2019 Q4 at Gamescom in August you aren't paying attention.

Reasoned speculation here:

No Subs --> Well, maybe subs --> Halloween subs (Q3 2018) --> ASW DDs announced --> 3 recent sub videos

I don't think they have enough time to get the Italian cruisers tested, balanced and the whole arc thing for Q4 so I think it will be subs.

I would gladly accept being incorrect. We'll know in a few weeks.

I sure hope so. I look forward to taking a Wickes or Clemson and utterly crushing the hopes and dreams of submerged baby seals.

Ask the Kaiser's bubbleheads about those pesky 4-pipers. :Smile_teethhappy:

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6 minutes ago, Idaho_Spud said:

I sure hope so. I look forward to taking a Wickes or Clemson and utterly crushing the hopes and dreams of submerged baby seals.

Ask the Kaiser's bubbleheads about those pesky 4-pipers. :Smile_teethhappy:

Meanwhile, while you're trawling for subs at 1/4 speed in straight lines, every red ship in range is looking for the easy DD kill.

And then the subs you didn't kill because you got sniped, sneak off and kill teammates that WG decided don't get their own ASW gear, "because history".

 

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3 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Meanwhile, while you're trawling for subs at 1/4 speed in straight lines, every red ship in range is looking for the easy DD kill.

And then the subs you didn't kill because you got sniped, sneak off and kill teammates that WG decided don't get their own ASW gear, "because history".

Right, because historical realism is the very hallmark of WG products...

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1 minute ago, Hookie_Bell said:

Right, because historical realism is the very hallmark of WG products...

 

It is, until it isn't. They randomly do crap and say "it's historical!", and then ignore history otherwise.

They're very concerned with ships having "roles" and being "differentiated", so I don't put it past them at all to try to make DDs "the sub hunters" and leave other ships largely defenseless against subs, while saying "because history" as an excuse for doing so. 

 

 

 

Edited by KilljoyCutter
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2 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Meanwhile, while you're trawling for subs at 1/4 speed in straight lines, every red ship in range is looking for the easy DD kill.

And then the subs you didn't kill because you got sniped, sneak off and kill teammates that WG decided don't get their own ASW gear, "because history".

 

Maybe, maybe not. Wow's will be the deciding factor. Something's aren't 100% historically the same in game. Maybe wait and see. I personally look forward to submarines if they are introduced. I'd like to see the other perspective. In the Halloween event we seen the game from the submarines point of view. I'd like to see a operation where we have a chance to battle bot submarines first before PvP submarine matches. A trial period and see what the reaction by the community will be.

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10 minutes ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Meanwhile, while you're trawling for subs at 1/4 speed in straight lines, every red ship in range is looking for the easy DD kill.

And then the subs you didn't kill because you got sniped, sneak off and kill teammates that WG decided don't get their own ASW gear, "because history".

I do believe he has history on his side. Germany kind of went 0-2 at sea, didn't they?

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WW2 sub's had a max underwater speed of maybe 16 knots. How would that work. They are not warships they are commerce raiders. Sub's in this game will be a fail..

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3 minutes ago, Ministre_de_la_Marine said:

I do believe he has history on his side. Germany kind of went 0-2 at sea, didn't they?

If "we won the war" was a functional argument, a LOT of things would be different in WG's products. 

The sub-vs-anti-sub action in the Atlantic was not conducted in the middle of raging close-range gunfights between cruisers and battleships -- any DD that dinked around doing anti-sub work while under enemy guns would have been a sitting duck.

 

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2 minutes ago, Raven114 said:

WW2 sub's had a max underwater speed of maybe 16 knots. How would that work. They are not warships they are commerce raiders. Sub's in this game will be a fail..

 

Most of them couldn't even make 10 knots underwater, and those that could make >10 were pretty much all late-war boats that came after the outcome of the war was largely a foregone conclusion. 

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34 minutes ago, Wye_So_Serious said:

aren't going to be announced for 2019 Q4 at Gamescom in August you aren't paying attention.

Reasoned speculation here:

No Subs --> Well, maybe subs --> Halloween subs (Q3 2018) --> ASW DDs announced --> 3 recent sub videos

I don't think they have enough time to get the Italian cruisers tested, balanced and the whole arc thing for Q4 so I think it will be subs.

I would gladly accept being incorrect. We'll know in a few weeks.

Nope. We've heard squat on subs. They're still trying to make CVs work, and the French DD line and Italian cruisers are in the pipeline. Russian BBs are due for a round of adjustments as well. Also, the NTC is still a thing, and they're probably busy reworking the part they had to scrap. Also, subs are very likely coming as an operations things first, so making them the Gamescom things wouldn't make a whole lot of sense. Short of full lines ready to go in a few months with appropriate ASW mostly worked out isn't something I imagine is possibly anywhere near. My guess is it will be the Italians and the French DDs, possibly some European ships, going with a European theme. They don't have to be ready by August, just mostly have the lines down and the major characteristics figured out. Those lines will be close enough to done to work for Gamescon.

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7 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

Nope. We've heard squat on subs. They're still trying to make CVs work, and the French DD line and Italian cruisers are in the pipeline. Russian BBs are due for a round of adjustments as well. Also, the NTC is still a thing, and they're probably busy reworking the part they had to scrap. Also, subs are very likely coming as an operations things first, so making them the Gamescom things wouldn't make a whole lot of sense. Short of full lines ready to go in a few months with appropriate ASW mostly worked out isn't something I imagine is possibly anywhere near. My guess is it will be the Italians and the French DDs, possibly some European ships, going with a European theme. They don't have to be ready by August, just mostly have the lines down and the major characteristics figured out. Those lines will be close enough to done to work for Gamescon.

I sincerely hope that you are correct but have my doubts. I doubt that WG thinks “They’re still trying to make CVs work.”  The CV rework debacle leads me to believe that WG will bring out submarines first and balance them later. 

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45 minutes ago, Wye_So_Serious said:

aren't going to be announced for 2019 Q4 at Gamescom in August you aren't paying attention.

Reasoned speculation here:

No Subs --> Well, maybe subs --> Halloween subs (Q3 2018) --> ASW DDs announced --> 3 recent sub videos

I don't think they have enough time to get the Italian cruisers tested, balanced and the whole arc thing for Q4 so I think it will be subs.

I would gladly accept being incorrect. We'll know in a few weeks.

Subs are coming, but I don't think they will be announcing them at Gamescon.  The botched CV rework has taken up an excessive amount of dev time and that is going to delay the release of subs until, probably early next year.

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8 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

Nope. We've heard squat on subs. They're still trying to make CVs work, and the French DD line and Italian cruisers are in the pipeline. Russian BBs are due for a round of adjustments as well. Also, the NTC is still a thing, and they're probably busy reworking the part they had to scrap. Also, subs are very likely coming as an operations things first, so making them the Gamescom things wouldn't make a whole lot of sense. Short of full lines ready to go in a few months with appropriate ASW mostly worked out isn't something I imagine is possibly anywhere near. My guess is it will be the Italians and the French DDs, possibly some European ships, going with a European theme. They don't have to be ready by August, just mostly have the lines down and the major characteristics figured out. Those lines will be close enough to done to work for Gamescon.

French DDs are next week for the Q3 arc. Perhaps the Italian line is being pushed up for Q4 due to the CV thing but I wouldn't discount the sub idea for this year particularly given the NTC idea.

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Just now, Slimeball91 said:

Subs are coming, but I don't think they will be announcing them at Gamescon.  The botched CV rework has taken up an excessive amount of dev time and that is going to delay the release of subs until, probably early next year.

Shame that the botched CV rework doesn't appear to have taught WG any actual lessons...

 

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Can anyone point me to where WG says everything they do is historical and realistic?  Not to be a WG nut hugger, but that is one seriously big straw man people are attacking.

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No subs please.

They don't belong. This is not a sub game.

They make no sense, not to mention they stressed NO SUBS for years.

Shame on you WG if you do.

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6 minutes ago, Landing_Skipper said:

The CV rework debacle leads me to believe that WG will bring out submarines first and balance them later. 

Sad but most likely true.

Subs will most likely be the final straw that drives me off. They can not fit in this game.

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15 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

Can anyone point me to where WG says everything they do is historical and realistic?  Not to be a WG nut hugger, but that is one seriously big straw man people are attacking.

They don't.

But they often use "historical" as an excuse, and they're oddly fixated on "historical" for certain elements of the game.

 

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Just now, Landing_Skipper said:

I sincerely hope that you are correct but have my doubts. I doubt that WG thinks “They’re still trying to make CVs work.”  The CV rework debacle leads me to believe that WG will bring out submarines first and balance them later. 

Or, WG might intend subs to not be balanced just like CVs.

1 minute ago, KilljoyCutter said:

Shame that the botched CV rework doesn't appear to have taught WG any actual lessons...

I'm guessing they did learn something and they will likely do some things differently.  I don't have any faith that they learned anything about balance.  What they learned is to be more careful about how they release new content.  I won't be surprised if subs are first released in their own "test" game mode (separate from random battles).  

Let's hope they think about meaningful counterplay before release.  I'm not holding my breath on that one.

5 minutes ago, alexf24 said:

No subs please.

They don't belong. This is not a sub game.

They make no sense, not to mention they stressed NO SUBS for years.

Shame on you WG if you do.

If you got to see, and play what WG has planned for subs, then you'd be in a position to make such a claim.  As of now you are only voicing your bias.  I hated CVs pre-rework, but I was willing to give it a chance.  Turns out the reworked CVs were no better, but I didn't come to that conclusions until after I got see, and play the rework.  If you want to say you have concerns, well, that's reasonable.  I think we all have concerns.

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1 hour ago, Wye_So_Serious said:

aren't going to be announced for 2019 Q4 at Gamescom in August you aren't paying attention.

Reasoned speculation here:

No Subs --> Well, maybe subs --> Halloween subs (Q3 2018) --> ASW DDs announced --> 3 recent sub videos

I don't think they have enough time to get the Italian cruisers tested, balanced and the whole arc thing for Q4 so I think it will be subs.

I would gladly accept being incorrect. We'll know in a few weeks.

I'm not sure I can agree with you. French destroyers are going to be at least a two-patch arc: July-August and August-September, and maybe even September-October if the arc is three patches long the way the British DD arc was. By that time we're ready for Halloween again, at least one patch and maybe two if they repeat the shrinking-battlefield event or put in yet another new Halloween PvE scenario.

That's somewhere between three and five patches to get the Italian cruisers in some sort of decent shape.

That being said, I would not at all be surprised if the Halloween PvE scenario is a trial run of ASW sensors and weapons. They will need to show that surface ships have a viable ASW suite before putting the subs in anything but special scenarios.

Otherwise we are left with what we have now: a combination of RPF, hydro and waiting until their oxygen runs out so they're forced to the surface and can be shot, torpedoed or rammed. That is not acceptable.

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22 minutes ago, Landing_Skipper said:

The CV rework debacle leads me to believe that WG will bring out submarines first and balance them later. rake in lots of money and then nerf them into oblivion after they've feasted off the money from premium sub sales. You know; like they did with CVs last month!

Fixed that for ya!

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I'm not that imaginative but I can't see how WG could possibly make submarines both fun to play, and fun to play against. They haven't managed that feat with carriers in 4 years and a rework after all.

 

As it is, I am still not concerned about an imminent submarine release. WG has done plenty of naval legends before that have never made it into the game:

Monitor M33 - not in the game

Destroyer Cavalier - not in the game (coming on 2 years ago)

Destroyer Maillé-Brézé - not in game (15 months)

Frigate Diamantina - not in game (over 2 years)

Corvette Casltemaine - not in game

 

There are more, but if Naval Legends videos suggested the ships in them were coming well... not on quite the long timescale. Doing Cod and K-21 doesn't seem to mean very much.

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Thought I heard Crysantos or some one on the WG twitch say they would be introduced in the Ranked Battles after the next one.

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