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SeaRaptor00

Scuttlebutt #29 (featuring Siegfried)

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This week's news and updates is brought to you courtesy of Tier IX Premium German super cruiser Siegfried.  I'm still trying to figure this ship out so don't expect amazing things.  =)

 

 

Edited by SeaRaptor00

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Well she just got nerfed so it's not a worse Yoshino, now it's there with Azuma to see which one is the worst T9 Large Cruiser even though Siegfried is actually a BattleCruiser but WG logic

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On 7/19/2019 at 1:11 PM, XurMP said:

Well she just got nerfed so it's not a worse Yoshino, now it's there with Azuma to see which one is the worst T9 Large Cruiser even though Siegfried is actually a BattleCruiser but WG logic

I mean, she's just as squishy as Azuma/Yoshino.  She has almost the same armor scheme, she simply has fewer guns that fire slower and are only really useful against people that don't angle to you.  She's a hard boat to love in her current configuration.

Edited by SeaRaptor00

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Uhh. I'm pretty sure there's no such thing as HE overpens.

On 7/19/2019 at 5:41 PM, SeaRaptor00 said:

I mean, she's just as squishy as Azuma/Yoshino.  She has almost the same armor scheme

Now I'm super confused, are we even talking about the same ship? Siegfried has 90mm upper belt, 30mm center deck, 27mm ends. You can bounce any shell in the game off its sides, and a ton of stuff off its mid-deck. It has an internal turtleback that makes its citadel very hard to hit through the sides. On the other hand, Azuma has 25mm over the whole ship that bounces nothing, and an exposed citadel that catches everything. They're practically the polar opposites of T9 cruiser armor.

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5 hours ago, Edgecase said:

Uhh. I'm pretty sure there's no such thing as HE overpens.

Now I'm super confused, are we even talking about the same ship? Siegfried has 90mm upper belt, 30mm center deck, 27mm ends. You can bounce any shell in the game off its sides, and a ton of stuff off its mid-deck. It has an internal turtleback that makes its citadel very hard to hit through the sides. On the other hand, Azuma has 25mm over the whole ship that bounces nothing, and an exposed citadel that catches everything. They're practically the polar opposites of T9 cruiser armor.

Then how am I landing 1 HE shell for 440 damage?  Is that just splash/explosion damage?  I genuinely have no idea what's going on with these HE shells other than the fact that they can't seem to damage anything reliably.  

Siegfried's main belt is analogous to Azuma/Yoshino (178mm vs. 190mm), and the center deck is analogous to Yoshino (both are 30mm).  The 90mm belt/casemate may be what is making her feel awful, because it's probably eating full AP pens, where the same hits against Azuma/Yoshino would be overpens.  The difference in the 25/27mm bow is pretty negligible; she'll still get wrecked through the bow either way.  The turtleback seemingly does nothing at the ranges it is intended to be useful; I had a Jean Bart wreck me for back-to-back 20k+ salvos at mid-range (~11km) in my first game in the ship.  I was not as angled as I should have been, but still... Hindenburg would have taken less damage than this thing, and has better DPM to boot.  Maybe it's a case of the ship's armor scheme being JUST good enough to eat full AP pens from battleships, so she feels super awkward that way, I dunno.  

A ship with DPM this drastically low - and it's the worst Tier IX cruiser in terms of potential damage by FAR - should be highly survivable.  So their first round of changes was to nerf her torps AND her survivability?  The hell?  I just have no idea what purpose the ship serves, honestly.  What she does best (killing cruisers) Alaska and Kronshtadt already do better, and those ships hold up better under sustained fire.  

Edited by SeaRaptor00

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18 minutes ago, SeaRaptor00 said:

Then how am I landing 1 HE shell for 440 damage?  Is that just splash/explosion damage?  I genuinely have no idea what's going on with these HE shells other than the fact that they can't seem to damage anything reliably.

An HE pen on a fully-saturated portion of the ship (most commonly the superstructure) will do 10% damage. Since Siegfried's base HE damage is 4400, that's almost certainly where your 440 damage came from. This is actually an increase -- prior to 0.8.5, it would have done literally no damage.

 

17 minutes ago, SeaRaptor00 said:

The 90mm belt/casemate may be what is making her feel awful, because it's probably eating full AP pens, where the same hits against Azuma/Yoshino would be overpens.  The difference in the 25/27mm bow is pretty negligible; she'll still get wrecked through the bow either way.

Angling is critical in Siegfried. You can autobounce any shell in the game with 33mm, much less 90. The 27mm bow, on the other hand, gets wrecked, so surviving in that ship is totally a matter of baiting shots into the belts without giving too much angle. 90mm of upper belt armor also defeats any HE in the game except Conqueror.

Azuma's 25mm upper belt and deck, on the other hand, gets overmatched by literally every battleship within her matchmaking range. Azuma gets wrecked not because of cits through the main belt, but because every shell 15" and larger literally ignores the entire ship except the turret faces and citadel. That absolutely does not happen with Siegfried. 15" overmatches nothing, 16" only beats the bow, 18" beats bow and deck. Nothing beats the 90mm belt.

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I'll see if I can sneak a few more games in her before we lose her and test out some of this.  Like I said: she's a hard ship to wrap my brain around.

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