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Ensign_Cthulhu

Random Thoughts from Deep R'lyeh: the French Connection.

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Theorycrafting on the French Directives for 0.8.6
In this post I will be presenting the first four directives as given to us in the PTS and trying to draw conclusions as to what the live version might be like.
Unless specifically stated, all missions can be completed in all game modes, with ships of T5 or higher. Task magnitudes are given in (brackets), with it being understood that the number on Live Server (LS) will almost certainly be significantly higher.
DIRECTIVE 1: any five of the following.
1) Tank 1 million potential damage (could be higher in live server) - rewards a container. 
2) Score (20) secondary battery hits; rewards 5 x Mike Yankee Soxisix flags. My guess for the LS magnitude is somewhere between 200 and 250, based on similar past directives.
3) Earn (10,000) commander XP - rewards 5K Elite Cmdr XP. My guess for the real number is between 25K CXP and 40K CXP. 
4) Earn (6000) ship XP - rewards 2000 free XP. LS figure could be as high as 40,000.
5) Get (5) spotted ribbons. Requires T7 ships and up. Those with T8 carriers should get this done quickly. Remember that this is not the same as "first to spot"; a ship unspotted for > 30 seconds will earn you a spotting ribbon when seen again.

DIRECTIVE 2: any SEVEN of the following.
1 to 4) Earn ship XP = (3000) in destroyers, cruisers, battleships and carriers. Each gives a container. I cannot begin to guess what the actual limits would be, but based on previous 40K XP tasks overall I would not be surprised to see 10K for each.
5) Get (20,000) HP of spotting damage in ships of T7 or above.
6) Get (10) ribbons of fire, flood, torpedo damage or citadels in ships of T7 or above.
7) In (2) battles, be in the top 5 of XP received, in ships of T7 or above.
8) Score 1 cap-related ribbon (capture, share or defend).

DIRECTIVE 3: Any SIX of:
1 to 7) Earn (100,000) credits in ships of France, UK, Germany, Japan, USSR, US or Pan-Asia. In the PTS, the reward for this was given as 300,000K; on the basis that this is usually 1/10 of the total task, I would anticipate the true task being 3 million each. Now here comes the tricky bit:
8) Do the above in the Alsace
9) Do the above in the Midway
10) Do the above in the Harugumo
11) Do the above in the Kremlin.
This is surely not going to carry over into the live version. They cannot expect people to have these ships as routine. My suspicion is that they are stand-ins for various premiums (as has occurred in other events of this type), chosen because it is not difficult to get a T10 ship in the PTS. Note that in the PTS, using any of the four also completed its national requirement.

As with the PEF grind, this is going to be an absolute PITA, and the ease or otherwise of its completion hinges on what the stand-in ships are and what the true amount really is. Given that these four directives appear to extend over the entire patch, we're going to have some time to work on it - especially since Directive 4 below is replete with kill and damage tasks that are probably designed to be finished in a hurry.

DIRECTIVE 4: Any (number not given, possibly six to eight) of:
1) Damage (4) modules (scenarios not valid)
2) Spot (5) torpedoes (scenarios not valid)
3 to 6) Base XP missions (not willing to guess) for all four ship types, all of which reward containers.
7) Do (10,000) damage in ships T7 or above. I would not be surprised to see a figure of at least 100,000 but it fits in very well with task 8 below.
8) Get (3) fire, torpedo, flood or citadel hit ribbons in T7 or above. The final figure will not be less than 10 and may be significantly higher.
9) Shoot down (3) aircraft in T7 ships or above - note that bot CV will be in the game and co-op is valid. I would expect a final figure closer to 30.
10) Get 1 kill in Normandie (in the PTS, this ship was issued at start).
11) Get one kill in the Conqueror (this ship was easy to obtain in the PTS).

All of the containers have a potential for early-bird DD unlocks, which was a change from the Russian event where we had to spend tokens vital to other things in order to obtain unlock chances.

In the Public Test Server, the ultimate prize for all this was the Normandie. This has to be a stand-in for a premium ship they are going to give away, because the Normandie was one of the standard-issue ships for this phase of the PTS. My guess is the Sirocco (T5 premium French DD). ETA 18 July. CONFIRMED. I got that one right.


I noted with interest that the prizes for tokens in this phase included permacamos for the Tier 5 through Tier 8 destroyers; it would be interesting if this carried through, because it would be only the third time a permacamo was offered for a T5 tech-tree ship (the others are New York and - for a limited time - Emerald). ETA: This one is also confirmed: T5 tech tree ship permacamo. Special offer, or foretaste of things to come?

Gird your loins, ladies and gentlemen.

 

UPDATE: Here is the updated task list for all four directives. 

 

Edited by Ensign_Cthulhu
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Personally I don't think it will have much success. No smoke DDs could be deal breakers for many and stats wise only tier VIII+ looks worthwhile.

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17 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

All of the containers have a potential for early-bird DD unlocks, which was a change from the Russian event where we had to spend tokens vital to other things in order to obtain unlock chances.

Except none of the containers I drew had any, (I think I may have actually had one, but it ended/disappeared before I could complete it,) not that I tried really hard to get them.

Only RU BB I have right now is the T3, purchased normally from where it starts the BB branch.

Entirely likely I'll not try very hard to get the MN destroyers either.

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I have adopted a strict no grinding rule on these events.

I have come to the conclusion that instead of early unlocks that they should be a rental ship and when they go away all ship experience goes into free experience when they are removed and the captain put in reserve with a one time free retraining.

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46 minutes ago, warheart1992 said:

Personally I don't think it will have much success. No smoke DDs could be deal breakers for many and stats wise only tier VIII+ looks worthwhile.

Only WG would offer a way for DDs to die … faster :)

Wrong ship 

Wrong meta 

Wrong idea

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14 hours ago, BrushWolf said:

I have adopted a strict no grinding rule on these events.

I have come to the conclusion that instead of early unlocks that they should be a rental ship and when they go away all ship experience goes into free experience when they are removed and the captain put in reserve with a one time free retraining.

I agree, if WG thinks people not playing low to mid tier often enough is a problem and/or there’s too much fxp being hoarded, they may want to revisit their policy of handing out T8s for upcoming lines.  Let people keep the accumulated xp they got with the rentals, otherwise everyone starts at the bottom most tier and either spends fxp or grinds it out the old fashioned way.

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The entire line has no smoke? In a meta filled with aircraft carriers?

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7 minutes ago, FrodoFraggin said:

they may want to revisit their policy of handing out T8s for upcoming lines.

I thought the British carriers pre-release was a refreshing change in this regard. They practically guaranteed the T4 and T6, and put the T8 behind a paywall whose size depended on how hard you ground for it. Likewise the recent Russian arc made you choose between various prizes OR potential unlock crates. I sort of don't blame them for going back to the original recipe for a bit.

A possible middle ground might be to let you have the early unlocks, but at the end of the pre-release period they get locked up again until you've ground to them. So if you get them all, for example, you would still have to grind out the T2-4 ships but then you get the fully-decked-out T5 and only have to grind the difference between the B hull and the T6, and so on. That would ensure play at all tiers, although there are a lot of people who would still FXP their way through the low tiers to avoid that.

The obscene amounts of money some people spend on crates, trying to get a T8 unlock so they have a shorter free-XP jump to T10 on the day of release, are IMO a firm indicator that it's a proportion of the player base with an attitude problem that is the issue; not the pre-releases themselves.

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5 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

The entire line has no smoke? In a meta filled with aircraft carriers?

Just dodge :fish_aqua:

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6 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

The entire line has no smoke? In a meta filled with aircraft carriers?

I know people who run Japanese destroyers with TRB in the current meta, and they don't have smoke either. 

For sure it's not everyone's cup of tea, but I think it's going to be a very interesting and challenging line to play and I'm actually looking forward to it.

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2 hours ago, Taichunger said:

The entire line has no smoke? In a meta filled with aircraft carriers?

CVs aren't what they used to be and tge AA changes gave made them uncomfortable, even unpopular.

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Patch 8.6 is literally "feed the carriers". French DDs are so hard countered by planes it makes other DDs look like minotaurs. 

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And here I was hoping to see some pics of Hackman (loved the hat) and Scheider in their prime.....:Smile_trollface:

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1 hour ago, PG908 said:

Patch 8.6 is literally "feed the carriers". French DDs are so hard countered by planes it makes other DDs look like minotaurs. 

Those of us who get early unlocks in that patch will get to see what T5-8 are like. Given that I know how terribly weak British DD AA is, I'm reserving comment on that until I've played the entire Fr DD line at least to Tier Six. 

 

S**t will only get real in 8.7, when everyone has full access to them.

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3 hours ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

I know people who run Japanese destroyers with TRB in the current meta, and they don't have smoke either. 

For sure it's not everyone's cup of tea, but I think it's going to be a very interesting and challenging line to play and I'm actually looking forward to it.

I am actually interested in them myself and I am not much of a DD player because even the current "gunboats" rely heavily on stealth. With the French it is pew, pew, pew, dodge, dodge, dodge, pew, pew, pew, rinse and repeat which sounds like a blast

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38 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

With the French it is pew, pew, pew, dodge, dodge, dodge, pew, pew, pew, rinse and repeat which sounds like a blast

It bears a certain resemblance to the Savage Battles lifestyle, which makes me think WG really did have a cunning plan (an actual one, not a Baldrick one) when they gave us this Rogue Wave event as the lead-in to the French destroyer arc. :Smile_teethhappy:

The life of a French DD captain may be short, but it will never be boring. I am going to treat them all as very lightly armed scout cruisers, which is what Le Terrible at Tier 8 ended up being classified as IRL before the war was over.

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4 hours ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

Those of us who get early unlocks in that patch will get to see what T5-8 are like. Given that I know how terribly weak British DD AA is, I'm reserving comment on that until I've played the entire Fr DD line at least to Tier Six. 

 

S**t will only get real in 8.7, when everyone has full access to them.

Their one thing is open water dd play, and that's what CVs counter super hard. The whole line appears to suffer the same problems based on the current numbers: abysmal AA (usually only mid range, and fairly vulnerable to being knocked out as well) and air detection range (which is 4.8km on the kleber, down to about 4km with a full concealment build) with no smoke or heal to fall back on. And CVs do not care that you go fast: my experience in the le terrible (which is pretty much functionally identical to the main line, aside from somewhat worse AA) is that you get up to three dodges before the carrier adjusts their lead and then you die.

If they already know to lead about 1.5x as much, you don't even get that. It doesn't matter how slippery you are: planes outmaneuver you and you can't kill them.

They might be more bearable with defensive fire, but I honestly don't think defensive fire's triple damage on DDs would do enough, and they can just come back once it wears off anyway, like they do already.

 

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Will go for the Unique Commander. Could care less about getting the ships early so.... Hopefully that will limit the grind. The Savage grind has not been fun.

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On 7/16/2019 at 7:11 AM, Taichunger said:

The entire line has no smoke? In a meta filled with aircraft carriers?

In EVE I remember some frigates were good "speed tanks" only because they could quickly lock onto a target and hold a tight orbit … 

These speed tanks were effective in the hands of skilled pilots and could be a lot of fun with the right crew

 

In Wows, I doubt there is any practical application for this concept beyond the occasional Hail Mary or suicide run behind enemy lines and limited support … 

I predict much salt and many tears :)

Edited by Commander_367

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I disagree with this,

11 hours ago, Commander_367 said:

In Wows, I doubt there is any practical application for this concept beyond the occasional Hail Mary or suicide run behind enemy lines and limited support … 

mostly because of the existence of Khabarovsk, although I concede it's going to take a very canny and experienced player to do well in them. 

 

I am, however, completely in agreement with you on this:

11 hours ago, Commander_367 said:

I predict much salt and many tears :)

especially if people throw buckets of money at this event in an attempt to crate-jump to T8 or pay out the guaranteed T9 early unlock and then wind up disappointed.

What will be most stupid is the people who pay more to get a T8 early unlock crate than it costs to unlock all the T9 stages and get the Mogador early. That's going to be expensive, and the ship - when they get her - will still technically be in test and subject to nerfs. She will cost more to get early than the Benham would be for me right now, and yet she is a TECH TREE SHIP.

Get your popcorn, folks; 0.8.6 is going to be hilarious.

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On ‎7‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 1:20 PM, BrushWolf said:

I am actually interested in them myself and I am not much of a DD player because even the current "gunboats" rely heavily on stealth. With the French it is pew, pew, pew, dodge, dodge, dodge, pew, pew, pew, rinse and repeat which sounds like a blast

The reworked Le Terrible is a lot of fun once you get the hang of it. The other French DDs are basically the same thing as far as I can tell just not quite as absurdly fast. I've never been great at DDs, but the French really resonate for me. They require a lot of planning though. I agree with a lot of the others that most people will have a lot of trouble with them because they play nothing like other DDs. My favorite thing is chasing other DDs into their own smoke and mugging them there. If they stop in their own smoke and you have the reload booster ready it is pretty much over for them. Detection ranges are universally awful, but the higher tier ones close so fast that they'll be on you before your brain really had time to process than you spotted him and swing the guns around to engage. 

One interesting thing is you really don't have to care much about radar. At almost 55 knots (for Le Terrible) you aren't in range long enough to worry about it. 

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On ‎7‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 5:49 PM, PG908 said:

Their one thing is open water dd play, and that's what CVs counter super hard. The whole line appears to suffer the same problems based on the current numbers: abysmal AA (usually only mid range, and fairly vulnerable to being knocked out as well) and air detection range (which is 4.8km on the kleber, down to about 4km with a full concealment build) with no smoke or heal to fall back on. And CVs do not care that you go fast: my experience in the le terrible (which is pretty much functionally identical to the main line, aside from somewhat worse AA) is that you get up to three dodges before the carrier adjusts their lead and then you die.

If they already know to lead about 1.5x as much, you don't even get that. It doesn't matter how slippery you are: planes outmaneuver you and you can't kill them.

They might be more bearable with defensive fire, but I honestly don't think defensive fire's triple damage on DDs would do enough, and they can just come back once it wears off anyway, like they do already.

 

DFAA wouldn't help for them. Their AA values are, shall we say -  Le Terrible. :Smile_teethhappy:

Seriously though, Le Terrible has an AA value of 8 or something ridiculous like that. You have to use your speed and maneuver. The T8s and up are very fast and even the CVs have to lead the target noticeably. You can juke your speed and turn sharply to force misses for quite a while. You can't make the CV go away, but you can tie him up doing nothing but chase you around. If he is competent he will get you eventually but you can force him to waste a lot of time doing it. It isn't fun, but it means he's wasting his time on you rather than sniping at the rest of your team. Most CVs I've played against in Le Terrible (and I've been playing her a lot to practice for the French DDs) give up after a bit. What I also found works is if there is a CV in the match wait for him to complete his scouting run in the beginning. This is something every DD should be doing in my opinion, but the high tier French DDs are so fast they don't need to (and shouldn't) charge into the cap immediately. Turn the AA off, move in close to your own allies, and let him complete his scouting run. Most CVs will find a juicy target to attack, then you can go do your thing. 

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1 minute ago, Tzarevitch said:

What I also found works is if there is a CV in the match wait for him to complete his scouting run in the beginning.

If you're spawned near a good AA ship, you can sometimes bait an over-eager CV driver into chasing you into the AA ship's aura. That exhausts his rocket fighters for one replenishment cycle, and he's more likely to go off and bother someone else for a bit. It's nice if you can supply the AA ship with smoke as a quid pro quo, but French destroyers are obviously lacking in that regard.

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On 7/16/2019 at 6:54 AM, Commander_367 said:

Only WG would offer a way for DDs to die … faster :)

Wrong ship 

Wrong meta 

Wrong idea

...and we have a winner! 

 

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