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RowRowRowYoBoat

Hakuryu vs Midway

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I've only recently played any type of CV within the last few months. I unlocked the Hakuryu just as its nerfs went live.  I was wondering if the Hakuryu was balanced and the Midway was overpowered, or if Midway was balanced and the Hakuryu was not even comparable as a CV?  I don't own a Midway so I can't speak for it, but I do know that I face a Midway about 95% of the fights I play as the Hakuryu.  Should the Hakuryu receive some buffs? Again, never played the Midway, but I feel as if the Hakuryu planes get shredded pretty much instantly against any tier X (and sometimes lower).  I know the torp bombers are what make the Hakuryu strong, but if that's all it has going for it I'm not sure what the point in playing her is. 

Also, I use the two torp squad instead of the four torp as to minimize arming distance, but is there any beneficial way to use the four torp squad? 

Let me know what you guys think 

Edited by RowRowRowYoBoat

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Speaking as the owner of both, but not being a CV main, I find the Hak to have far more in match utility due to its AP bombs, and it not having shotgun spread torps.

I prefer the 2 torp, but you can use the 4 torp as a sort of zone denial, or to try and turn a ship into your surface fleet.

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Midway is currently by and far the worst CV of the three T10s. HE Bomb changes (IE the only thing useful about the USN Line) destroyed the utility of the line. Hak may seem weaker, but she has far better potential and ability. You only see more Midways beacuse A: more people grinded up the line given that it was on top for a while as it began its decline, and B: MURICA mentality and the dislike for "weeb" ships.

Though, if you want a stupidly OP (in comparison with other CVs) look at the RN CVs. Aud has the same hangar capacity as other CVs and its planes are unkillable beyond DFAA/Fighter/Utter Stupidity. Its rockets are on-par with other nations and torps are best in class. Carpets were weak compared to the USN HE Bombs, but since they're awful/borderline unusable now they get the job done better. Really, the only weakness of RN CVs is speed which is mitigated with intelligent positioning. Only reason why DD mains no one has complained about them yet is that there aren't that many of them out there.

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2 hours ago, BlizzardHero said:

Though, if you want a stupidly OP (in comparison with other CVs) look at the RN CVs. Aud has the same hangar capacity as other CVs and its planes are unkillable beyond DFAA/Fighter/Utter Stupidity. Its rockets are on-par with other nations and torps are best in class. Carpets were weak compared to the USN HE Bombs, but since they're awful/borderline unusable now they get the job done better. Really, the only weakness of RN CVs is speed which is mitigated with intelligent positioning. Only reason why DD mains no one has complained about them yet is that there aren't that many of them out there.

Strange you say that... I was playing RN line almost exclusively. I have all three lines through to tier X.

The last little update this past Wednesday had me back looking at the IJN carriers and guess what - I can do better now with them than I can my RN carriers. Weird, eh? But those flying tanks are getting the krap shot out of them. My losses are far greater than they were just prior to the patch. 

The drop time delay on RN carriers pretty much make them unusable imo... it's like six seconds from drop to pop. You have any idea how much a ship can manuever in six seconds? At least the IJN carriers stick around the four second mark. 

For the record, the only game play these days in a carrier is T6 cause uptier to T8 is survivable. Forget T8 as 3 out of 4 you'll be fighting T10 AA(A) and that's a mess. 

Honestly... unless you popped for the permacamo and are playing premium time, T10 carriers are simply not worth it, at least for me. I play freemium time and standard camos. I'm a cheap b****** to be sure. 

At 8.0 my money would have been on the Midway for the better carrier. Since then, I'd say take the Hak if you must play t10. However, the Audacious rocket and torpedo planes can wrack up a lot of hurt on the reds. You'd be surprised how much you can pull down with just the rocket planes. 

GL HF

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The CVs are all viable, though the Hakuryu is preferred in ranked/high-skill play because you can make bigger plays through sheer skill than with the other choices.  General rundown to follow:

Hakuryu: Sniper Rocket Planes, Sniper Torps (2 torp version), and Sniper AP Bombers.  If you're not setting up proper attack runs, you will miss.  If you miss, you're not contributing.  That being said, if you hit... it hurts.  Haku recently delivered a 250k+ damage game, even with the 8.5 AA changes.  It's an excellent CV in skilled hands.

Midway: This is a Middle-Ground CV.  Rocket Planes can be snipers... but can still turn mid attack run for a large dispersion penalty.  Torps are VERY slow to aim, and are rather shotgun-esque, so they're not to be counted on.  HE Bombers are wildly versatile, but reticle changes make them roughly 3k damage to DDs (6k outlier), 9-12k damage on CAs (with a GREAT attack run), and possible 6 bomb hits on all BBs with very high fire chance.  Also, their attack planes are the fastest of Tier 10, so they make versatile scouts and Cruiser damage.

Audacious: This is more a beginner CV.  It can do great things, but it's designed to be basic and forgiving.  Attack Planes are shotgun-like and are easy to turn mid-attack run.  Torp Planes are quick to aim and easy to turn mid attack run (though the torps can be slow).  Bombers are literally a carpet-bomb shotgun style damage with high fire chances (I've triple fired a BB on a single bomb run on several occasions).  The plane health is exceptionally high, though the speed is noticeably slow.  Note: The Rocket Planes are wonderful at hunting DDs due to the sheer spam meaning DDs will easily take multiple hits and potentially start a fire.

8.5 Note:  Even with the AA changes, these are all fully functional CVs.  You should always ask yourself if trying for a second attack run is a wise move if there's more then one ship around.  Turning while in AA is remarkably painful now, so single attack runs are a totally fine way to play the early/mid game.

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1 hour ago, Herr_Reitz said:

 

For the record, the only game play these days in a carrier is T6 cause uptier to T8 is survivable. Forget T8 as 3 out of 4 you'll be fighting T10 AA(A) and that's a mess. 

 

Well....its hard to play now but tier 8s are playable. Only have Midway on tier Xs, still learning, the small rockets its the way to go for me. And do more dmg with my Saipan than my Midway. Hope this help to the OP. o7

 

shot-19.06.28_23.01.03-0769.jpg

shot-19.06.28_23.02.57-0526.jpg

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5 hours ago, RowRowRowYoBoat said:

I've only recently played any type of CV within the last few months. I unlocked the Hakuryu just as its nerfs went live.  I was wondering if the Hakuryu was balanced and the Midway was overpowered, or if Midway was balanced and the Hakuryu was not even comparable as a CV?  I don't own a Midway so I can't speak for it, but I do know that I face a Midway about 95% of the fights I play as the Hakuryu.  Should the Hakuryu receive some buffs? Again, never played the Midway, but I feel as if the Hakuryu planes get shredded pretty much instantly against any tier X (and sometimes lower).  I know the torp bombers are what make the Hakuryu strong, but if that's all it has going for it I'm not sure what the point in playing her is. 

Also, I use the two torp squad instead of the four torp as to minimize arming distance, but is there any beneficial way to use the four torp squad? 

Let me know what you guys think 

Midway is actually trash, has been since they heavily nerfed the Dive Bombers.    Hak is superior in every way.

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Hakuryu players this ranked season left behind Midway and Audacious by a significant degree.  It's not even close.

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/194856-bots-and-rocks/

This season's ranked stats were of interest to me because of all the stats available to us players, this was the most "current."  I really wanted to see how the 3 Tier X CVs shaped up in the rigors of Ranked.  Only Hakuryu looked good, Midway and Audacious were awful.

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7 hours ago, RowRowRowYoBoat said:

I've only recently played any type of CV within the last few months. I unlocked the Hakuryu just as its nerfs went live.  I was wondering if the Hakuryu was balanced and the Midway was overpowered, or if Midway was balanced and the Hakuryu was not even comparable as a CV?  I don't own a Midway so I can't speak for it, but I do know that I face a Midway about 95% of the fights I play as the Hakuryu.  Should the Hakuryu receive some buffs? Again, never played the Midway, but I feel as if the Hakuryu planes get shredded pretty much instantly against any tier X (and sometimes lower).  I know the torp bombers are what make the Hakuryu strong, but if that's all it has going for it I'm not sure what the point in playing her is. 

Also, I use the two torp squad instead of the four torp as to minimize arming distance, but is there any beneficial way to use the four torp squad? 

Let me know what you guys think 

Hakuryus 4 Torp bomber squad has the most potential and takes the most skill. When you max concealment on yourplanes, then your torp bombers reach 6.1km concealment. The 4 torp squads have torps that travel a total of 8km. If you know how to aim those torps from a long distance while remaining unspotted, then I give you the title "God of CVs"

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Its not about one be more "strong" compared to another, its different playstyles... and with a bit luck in MM.

Midway is like a hammer, you can hit everthing, but the dmg is "okay"

The hak is like a needle, when you know use, you can do great things with and do a lot DMG, but if you dont know you probably going stick your finger

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16 hours ago, BlizzardHero said:

Midway is currently by and far the worst CV of the three T10s. HE Bomb changes (IE the only thing useful about the USN Line) destroyed the utility of the line. Hak may seem weaker, but she has far better potential and ability. You only see more Midways beacuse A: more people grinded up the line given that it was on top for a while as it began its decline, and B: MURICA mentality and the dislike for "weeb" ships.

Though, if you want a stupidly OP (in comparison with other CVs) look at the RN CVs. Aud has the same hangar capacity as other CVs and its planes are unkillable beyond DFAA/Fighter/Utter Stupidity. Its rockets are on-par with other nations and torps are best in class. Carpets were weak compared to the USN HE Bombs, but since they're awful/borderline unusable now they get the job done better. Really, the only weakness of RN CVs is speed which is mitigated with intelligent positioning. Only reason why DD mains no one has complained about them yet is that there aren't that many of them out there.

Absolutely spot on.

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28 minutes ago, RowRowRowYoBoat said:

Good to know about the Midway and Aud. I had no idea Hak had that much higher skillcap than the other two. 

It definitely does. Midway is the solid all-rounder. The planes are slower but tougher as a group. The rockets are very effective. The DBs are effective against all classes and are easy to aim. The only real downside is it is HE + Fire so it is very fixable for anything with a heal. They are particularly devastating against DDs, even after the nerf. (I've made plenty of over 10k hits on DDs post-nerf.) The TBs are the most difficult to use being slow traveling, slow to aim, low flooding, and low-damage on a per-torpedo basis, but she throws down a lot of them and they attack over a large front so it is hard to avoid them all. You'll get something even if the damage is less than a shell hit from a BB. Honestly their biggest effect is they really cause people to panic more than is justified by their actual damage. Midway is really the only one of the three that really is very effective even against DDs and smaller CLs. 

Hak's planes are rather fragile but faster. The rocket planes are pretty much OK. Nothing more than that. Damage is rather low and they travel a bit slowly so you have to lead the target a bit more than you think. TBs (2 torp setup) is nice and easy to use. The DBs are where the high skill cap and a lot of luck comes in. They can citadel even Yamato but the drop has to be just right and you have to be fortunate to avoid ricochets, and overpens. Also the dispersion on the bombs can be ugly even if you line it up just right. The good news is BBs can't really fix much citadel damage so it really sticks on them rather than Midway's HE damage which is almost completely repairable. Most Random and Ranked matches are really BB heavy so Hak ends up being the best option. The bad news is if you have a DD and CL heavy match Hak isn't great. The AP bombs overpen them routinely, assuming you can hit them at all. 

Audacious is rather meh to me. The TBs are very nice and are easy to aim. They are easily Audacious' best feature. The rockets are a bit better than Hak's as I recall but they still aren't that special. The level bombers took a major nerf a while back and it shows. The drop time on them is ugly slow. It is very hard to hit DDs or any of the smaller CLs if they are moving and even if you do actually hit them you won't get many hits because they are too small to fill the bomb ellipse. You can get multiple hits on BBs but the little bombs have little penetration so you get a lot of shatters. You are really dependent on fires against BBs. Honestly I don't think the level bombers are in a great state. 

That's pretty much why Midway is considered to be the best overall. She can do well against all types of opposition and it is very easy to use all of her systems (with the slight exception of her TBs) whereas the others have at least one of their attack systems that is unreliable or less than effective against certain types of opposition. Hak has a high upside if you can get her unreliable system (DBs) to work well on their optimal target. Audacious doesn't really have that. It isn't a horrible ship but it is inferior to the other two. 

 

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I have had Midway for a couple months now and just got Hakuryu. In the early comparison I will take Midway. The planes are much more survivable. Doesn't matter the damage potential if the planes all die before you can drop. Midway planes live longer for me plane and simple.

Torp edge to Hak for damage and ease of use  but DB and Rockets to Midway. I prefer Midways' HE DB's. I get massive damage from them (10-15K is normal and have had 17K+ drops) and they set lots of fires. Hak's DB's being AP need the perfect drop to get those citadels or you just get average pen damage. THe rocket planes are not even debatable. The Tiny TIms are devastating.

So Hak has the potential to do more damage per strike but you need a lot more skill to make that happen and  you need to be a master at dodging flak because the planes melt like butter on a hot skillet.

I did not like Midway at all when I first got it. Took me a while to adjust to it and "git gud". I am sure with more time I will improve in Hakuryu as well. Again though, the weaker planes is a big issue IMO.

Haven't got to Audacious yet (only at T8). Haven't liked the BRN CV's so far. Don't like the carpet bombing gimmick. They feel weakest of the 3 lines by far to me.

 

Edited by AdmiralThunder

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midway HE bombers are still a very good weapon,people make a ruckus because the HE dive bombing reticle made strike against DDs very hard.

if you know how to use her rocket planes against DDs,you can still score good damages.

her torp bombers require lots of training,but if you can find a chance to use her and hit all torps,the dmg is impressive.

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