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Charlie_The_Cat

AA shell speed is too fast

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The reason CV players are hating AA is not that AA itself is broken (it is but not for the same reason) is because the velocity of the shell speed is more then 5000m/sec.  That's why full squadron of planes get ripped in a matter of seconds from almost any ships now and that doesn't 'enhanced' game play.  As soon as you enter any AA space, you can see AA shells fly out and reach the planes under 1s when the planes are at 5-6km range from the guns.  Hello? Who decided this at WG?  Your shell physic is ok for main guns and secondaries, why is it so broken for AA ?  Apply the same formula and the game will be way better.  

That's why the No 1 counter from Torp/AP/HE bombers in WW2 were fighter planes and not AA.  AA wasn't a major factor vs fast and small planes and it shouldn't be as effective as it is on all ships but a few.

Also, while here, rockets in WW2 were attached on planes AFTER the war has ended and after German's functional rocket designs were discovered - no before.  There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.  They carpet HE bomb yes, but those aren't rockets.

Edited by Charlie_The_Cat
Typo in title
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Don't know what you're talking about, post rework made AA pretty much useless for most ships. Flak is what does most of the AA damage and competent CV captains know how to dodge most of the flak. 

In random games, you can't rely on the friendly CV to send fighters where they are needed throughout the whole game, the very nature of random battles makes that unlikely in most games.

And I don't know about the rocket thing, always just kind of assumed it was around during the war. 

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10 minutes ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

The reason CV players are hating AA is not that AA itself is broken (it is but not for the same reason) is because the velocity of the shell speed is more then 5000m/sec.  That's why full squadron of planes get ripped in a matter of seconds from almost any ships now and that doesn't 'enhanced' game play.  As soon as you enter any AA space, you can see AA shells fly out and reach the planes under 1s when the planes are at 5-6km range from the guns.  Hello? Who decided this at WG?  Your shell physic is ok for main guns and secondaries, why is it so broken for AA ?  Apply the same formula and the game will be way better.  

That's why the No 1 counter from Torp/AP/HE bombers in WW2 were fighter planes and not AA.  AA wasn't a major factor vs fast and small planes and it shouldn't be as effective as it is on all ships but a few.

Also, while here, rockets in WW2 were attached on planes AFTER the war has ended and after German's functional rocket designs were discovered - no before.  There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.  They carpet HE bomb yes, but those aren't rockets.

That's incorrect, rockets were used often from at least 1943 onward in anti-shipping attacks and particularly by RAF Coastal Command  and the FAA against surfaced U-Boats.

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Just now, Aaron_S_Merrill said:

That's incorrect, rockets were used often from at least 1943 onward in anti-shipping attacks and particularly by RAF Coastal Command  and the FAA against surfaced U-Boats.

Those were unguided surface-to-surface rockets - and thus way too big for planes.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

The reason CV players are hating AA is not that AA itself is broken (it is but not for the same reason) is because the velocity of the shell speed is more then 5000m/sec.

I'm sure someone will do the math to remind you that you're not accounting for the time and distance compression that's present in all aspects of this game.

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7 minutes ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Those were unguided surface-to-surface rockets - and thus way too big for planes.

 

 

 

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33 minutes ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Also, while here, rockets in WW2 were attached on planes AFTER the war has ended and after German's functional rocket designs were discovered - no before.  There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.  They carpet HE bomb yes, but those aren't rockets. 

Never say never.

August 24th 1944, Z-24 and T-24 come under air attack and both get hit by rockets fired from British aircraft. Neither of the two survives.

image.thumb.png.7416eac0549062fafa670fb2fdcf3bf7.png

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British Swordfish biplanes used rocket spears (they had no warheads) to punch holes in surfaced U-Boats to prevent them from submerging early on.

American planes have long mounted air to surtace rockets.  Before the war ended a B-25 sank a Japanese ship with a guided missile.  Rockets have been used for anti-shipping all during the war.

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The shell speed of AA doesn't matter at all. There's flak and continuous. If you have your hand on your keyboard and your monitor turned on, there is no excuse not to dodge most flak bubbles as they pop up a reasonable distance away in most cases. The other part of AA, continuous DPS, is unavoidable regardless of the speed the AA appears to travel. Those are visual effects, not actual projectiles or bullets. Dodge the big black clouds and avoid staying in AA range longer than needed, and you won't be taking tons of damage from AA.

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1 hour ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Those were unguided surface-to-surface rockets - and thus way too big for planes.

 

 

You really need to do some research. This was your claim:

There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.

This is a patently false claim. I'm not doing the research for you, but there were plenty of instances where surface ships and surfaced/partially submerged submarines were attacked by aircraft using unguided air-to-surface rockets.  I'll give you a little help, research the British RP-3 rocket.

Were they as effective as they are in the game?  No, but to claim they weren't used in WW2 is factually incorrect.

Edited by Aaron_S_Merrill

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2 hours ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Also, while here, rockets in WW2 were attached on planes AFTER the war has ended and after German's functional rocket designs were discovered - no before.  There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.  They carpet HE bomb yes, but those aren't rockets.

That's incorrect. 5" forward firing rockets were produced starting in 1943. They were used operationally until they were replaced by HVARs (High Velocity Aircraft Rocket). Those were finished by D-day and used over Normandy by P-47s. They were also used on Naval F4U Corsair, F6F Hellcats, TBM Avengers and SB2C Helldivers. Also look up 3.5" Forward Firing Aircraft Rockets. That was a Naval project launched in 1943 that was designed to be used against submarines. Tiny Tims were also used on the same Naval aircraft in 1944 by both the USN and USMC at Okinawa.

As for them not being used against ships, remember in the Pacific there wasn't much navy to go after. They were used against transports and fixed locations. Remember in WWII, you sent a strike package out with very general coordinates. Planes often went out for max range, not max armament, but fi they knew there was an anchored or expected transports at a known position, yes rockets were used in the Pacific. 

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On 6/24/2019 at 2:06 PM, Kebobstuzov said:

The shell speed of AA doesn't matter at all. There's flak and continuous. If you have your hand on your keyboard and your monitor turned on, there is no excuse not to dodge most flak bubbles as they pop up a reasonable distance away in most cases. The other part of AA, continuous DPS, is unavoidable regardless of the speed the AA appears to travel. Those are visual effects, not actual projectiles or bullets. Dodge the big black clouds and avoid staying in AA range longer than needed, and you won't be taking tons of damage from AA.

Yes it does.  When a shell from a ship at 5km reach your plane only 1 sec after, there is a problem as you can't dodged that.

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13 minutes ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Yes it does.  When a shell from a ship at 5km reach your plane only 1 sec after, there is a problem as you can't dodged that.

It's not a shell.  It's a damage-over-time effect with a cosmetic visual effect.  You're not supposed to dodge it, that's game design.  Just one unrealistic item out of a thousand, all deliberately put into play for the sake of game balance.

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4 hours ago, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Yes it does.  When a shell from a ship at 5km reach your plane only 1 sec after, there is a problem as you can't dodged that.

You dodge the black flak clouds. the little shells that fly at you are not actually there. They are a visualization of continuous, unavoidable DPS

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On 6/24/2019 at 2:06 PM, Kebobstuzov said:

The shell speed of AA doesn't matter at all. There's flak and continuous. If you have your hand on your keyboard and your monitor turned on, there is no excuse not to dodge most flak bubbles as they pop up a reasonable distance away in most cases. The other part of AA, continuous DPS, is unavoidable regardless of the speed the AA appears to travel. Those are visual effects, not actual projectiles or bullets. Dodge the big black clouds and avoid staying in AA range longer than needed, and you won't be taking tons of damage from AA.

Total bull crap since the last patch.  

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4 hours ago, Brhinosaurus said:

It's not a shell.  It's a damage-over-time effect with a cosmetic visual effect.  You're not supposed to dodge it, that's game design.  Just one unrealistic item out of a thousand, all deliberately put into play for the sake of game balance.

It missed the balance part, about the only thing AAA misses since the patch.  

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On 6/24/2019 at 7:25 AM, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Those were unguided surface-to-surface rockets - and thus way too big for planes.

 

 

you need to educate yourself before you spout factually incorrect nonsense and then try to correct someone that was pointing  out an error  in your previous statement.

Try googling TBM/TBF Avenger, F6F Hellcat, and F4U Corsair, and P47 Thunderbolt for starters, chucklehead. You will see they all carried unguided air to surface rockets for ground attack and anti-shipping missions.

TLDR: Know what you are talking about before you vomit nonsense from your pie hole

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On Monday, June 24, 2019 at 1:27 PM, Edgecase said:

I'm sure someone will do the math to remind you that you're not accounting for the time and distance compression that's present in all aspects of this game.

Not to mention the fact that the AA tracers are just eye candy. Flak puffs appear at a given spot, and the rest is auras.

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On 6/24/2019 at 10:01 AM, Charlie_The_Cat said:

Also, while here, rockets in WW2 were attached on planes AFTER the war has ended and after German's functional rocket designs were discovered - no before.  There is no instance of any navy planes 'rocketing' ships in any sea battles of WW2 so I don't know who again decided this.  They carpet HE bomb yes, but those aren't rockets.

Russia had functional rockets on planes in the 30s. I suspect we have so many rockets because they were a staple on Soviet planes since before the war. The USN used rockets late in the war on planes. Germans had a lot of rockets and anti ship guided missiles 

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