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SerynFate

CVs, why Stability and Functionality take Precedent over Balance

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A lot of changes happen in rapid succession over CVs, and a lot of them are about the planes, not the hulls, not fixing technical errors, or pathfinding of the CV, so let's take this one at a time.

Hull issues: A balance hellscape.

When a player cannot control their avatar, they are in their most vulnerable state, generally games compensate by automatically controlling the avatar in the most sensible means possible, but with the current system it's even worse than if the game controlled the Player Avatar (Carrier) so a bunch of survivability changes are on them, such as being only able to: Burn for 5 Seconds, Flood for 5 Seconds, conventional immunity to Detonations, and most carriers are at least somewhat armored. This is because of the godawful Control systems, which I'll go over In a bit, but most importantly, people feel like they just can't kill the carrier, as if they have a Lead-Up (VERY IMPORTANT) they can easily run away and break contact or force a stern chase, even with the broken autopilot.

Stand-Out technical errors: 404 Stability not found.

The AA is pretty, I won't deny that, but people on weaker rigs basically can't play because AA is such a graphical sledgehammer now, there isn't even a low res version of the tracers either, and because all the tracers are white, can't really tell the difference. I don't have a problem with performance graphically and frame wise, but other people are. Another thing is the crashes, freezing, and the, what I'll just call; "Dont look away" glitch. Where if you have your mouse DPI set somewhat high, and you look up and to the side just when you spot someone AND initiate a DB attack, the game freaks out and locks your screen with the graphic of the view of the planes from below, albeit it seems I can only replicate it in operations, I'm pretty sure I got reported for AFK or ragequit enough to turn pink as it's been happening a lot recently. And before anyone asks, no, it isn't computer performance/file integrity/having to reinstall, computer shows green lights across the board, files are all correct and I reinstalled the game twice.

Finally: the biggest issue, the autopilot.

As much as there is *somewhat* of a balance issue regarding carriers, i still feel this takes precedent, as no other ship has to rely on a means of movement that is a dice roll if it will kill you, work as intended, or just pull a Notser on seemingly nothing.

The current state of Autopilot enforces a really passive, campy, back of the map CV style, Ive tried on more battles than I can count, random, co-op, operation, training, all trying to see in any of these modes if a close support carrier can work, and it can, on One, Co-op, where victory is almost a guarantee, I haven't tried Ranked because 1. Toxic ranked community would torpedo TK the bejeezus out of me, and two, no T10 CV for me yet. But im grinding it out.

Back on to the autopilot problems and how it enforces this style of play, it's well and truly terrible, it can't read waypoints, has terrible route selection, and it's rudder/engine authority is worse than a player with 6 games in a tier 4 DD trying to torpedobeat 6 Shimas, in other words, it crashes into Islands, players, and can only stop when it hits something, it's just bad enough you NEED to adapt, and i sort of have, but it's inconsistent enough you CANT adapt, for instance, telling it to reverse the ship and go slightly left, it will ALWAYS go FLANK FORWARD AND LEFT.

 

Sooooooo, what do you all thing about this?

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26 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

Sooooooo, what do you all thing about this?

I think this is what comes out of the southern end of a north bound bull.

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Just now, Umikami said:

I think this is what comes out of the southern end of a north bound bull.

Mind explaining what you mean by that past a silly riddle?

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49 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

Finally: the biggest issue, the autopilot. 

How many times has your cv reversed instead of turning?  Or trying to move through a group of islands. 

I might the biggest issue because they seem to be in a good stat right now.

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1 minute ago, jags_domain said:

How many times has your cv reversed instead of turning?  Or trying to move through a group of islands. 

I might the biggest issue because they seem to be in a good stat right now.

I mentioned one of the examples, full speed ahead and a turn instead of reversing.

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21 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

I mentioned one of the examples, full speed ahead and a turn instead of reversing.

I've had pretty good luck lately if I'm careful not to turn past about 100 degrees on a turn.  

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38 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

I've had pretty good luck lately if I'm careful not to turn past about 100 degrees on a turn.  

I don't have a big prob with it until end game.  When you need to through an island gap but you have to manual stear but you cant because you have to hit stuff 2.  Also not being able to go half speed would be nice to.

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1 hour ago, SerynFate said:

Mind explaining what you mean by that past a silly riddle?

well the bull's head is pointed north, therefore the butt is on the south side.  What comes out of there?

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2 hours ago, SerynFate said:

Mind explaining what you mean by that past a silly riddle?

I mean it's nonsense; as this is a game NOTHING should take precedence over the various types of ships being balanced and to advocate differently is to advocate for one type to be OP. Stability? Functionality? How about viability of playstyle and equality of abilities? Sorry, that is nonsense.

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5 hours ago, SerynFate said:

Mind explaining what you mean by that past a silly riddle?

It is for your best interests to ignore whatever Umikami says.

He is one of the frontliners of the Anti-CV forum brigade.

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7 hours ago, Umikami said:

I mean it's nonsense; as this is a game NOTHING should take precedence over the various types of ships being balanced and to advocate differently is to advocate for one type to be OP. Stability? Functionality? How about viability of playstyle and equality of abilities? Sorry, that is nonsense.

How the hell is balance supposed to happen is the class isn't working right in the first place. 

Stop looking for posts that actually try to fix things about CVs if you're just gonna crapon them with no actual points or arguments. 

You go "reeeeeeee" any time you see anything positive being said about CVs.

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7 hours ago, emmapulido said:

How the hell is balance supposed to happen is the class isn't working right in the first place. 

Stop looking for posts that actually try to fix things about CVs if you're just gonna crapon them with no actual points or arguments. 

You go "reeeeeeee" any time you see anything positive being said about CVs.

If the "class" isn't right in the first place, how are you saying anything positive about it? All you CV defenders ask for actual points and arguments, so try this; when losing a CV is equal to losing a cruiser or a BB then they will be balanced. If it isn't then they aren't. Right now CVs have way too much influence on every match and need to have their capabilities reduced to be balanced against all the other ships in the game. "REEEEEEEEEE" that!

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17 minutes ago, Umikami said:

If the "class" isn't right in the first place, how are you saying anything positive about it? All you CV defenders ask for actual points and arguments, so try this; when losing a CV is equal to losing a cruiser or a BB then they will be balanced. If it isn't then they aren't. Right now CVs have way too much influence on every match and need to have their capabilities reduced to be balanced against all the other ships in the game. "REEEEEEEEEE" that!

The simple fact that the rework intentionally removed the ability for CV to combat CV is a tacit acknowledgement of an OP state. The stated reason is that they wanted the less able CV players to be able to survive, but the elephant in the room was that the course of most games after one CV successfully sniped the other demonstrated that they have too many capabilities for one side to be without its CV. 

Edited by Pugilistic

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6 minutes ago, Pugilistic said:

The simple fact that the rework intentionally removed the ability for CV to combat CV is a tacit acknowledgement of an OP state.

AB-SO-FREAKIN-LUTELY!

6 minutes ago, Pugilistic said:

The stated reason is that they wanted the less able CV players to be able to survive, but the elephant in the room was that one CV successfully sniping the other demonstrated that they have too many capabilities for one side to be without its CV.

Which is a textbook case of being OP and unbalanced. You're preaching to the choir with me, but, yeah, no doubt.

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2 hours ago, Umikami said:

If the "class" isn't right in the first place, how are you saying anything positive about it? All you CV defenders ask for actual points and arguments, so try this; when losing a CV is equal to losing a cruiser or a BB then they will be balanced. If it isn't then they aren't. Right now CVs have way too much influence on every match and need to have their capabilities reduced to be balanced against all the other ships in the game. "REEEEEEEEEE" that!

Yes, usually when something needs to be done about a certain thing, reasonable people ask for facts and arguments. "OP, NERF" isn't either of those.

That's an asinine argument right there. Did you even think about it when you wrote it?

When your only radar ship (or any CA/L, really) dies, your team is at a pretty huge disadvantage if there's enemy DDs to deal with. 

When you lose your only DD, nobody can nuke anything. Unless you catch someone trying to sneak a broadside.

No ship type has the same impact as another when you lose it, this is even further reinforced if you go into specific ship clases. 

Try again.

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2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

Yes, usually when something needs to be done about a certain thing, reasonable people ask for facts and arguments. "OP, NERF" isn't either of those.

Actually, it is, or the game wouldn't still be nerfing CVs.

2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

That's an asinine argument right there. Did you even think about it when you wrote it?

And yet the Devs are still nerfing CVs every patch; did you consider that before you shot your mouth off?

2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

When your only radar ship (or any CA/L, really) dies, your team is at a pretty huge disadvantage if there's enemy DDs to deal with. 

Yet there are still ways to shoot at and damage the DDs.

2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

When you lose your only DD, nobody can nuke anything. Unless you catch someone trying to sneak a broadside.

And yet the loss of a DD is easily surmountable when compared to overcoming the loss of a CV.

2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

No ship type has the same impact as another when you lose it, this is even further reinforced if you go into specific ship clases.

Yet the IMPACT of each type of ship in the game should be the same, that is why it's called BALANCE!

2 hours ago, emmapulido said:

Try again.

Quit begging.

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I've set up waypoints just to have my CV sail right past them in a straight line head on to the enemy. I've also had it stop reversing, head forward, in to an island, and just sit there.

You're right, it's made me in to a much more sit behind the lines player, because I can't rely on the pilot to not get me killed, and you have to pay attention at all times, as the CV doesn't stop or turn very well and any mistake in steering may be your last.

 

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because they are stupid that's why lol, fair game is the most important aspect of any game

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6 hours ago, Umikami said:

Actually, it is, or the game wouldn't still be nerfing CVs.

And yet the Devs are still nerfing CVs every patch; did you consider that before you shot your mouth off?

Yet there are still ways to shoot at and damage the DDs.

And yet the loss of a DD is easily surmountable when compared to overcoming the loss of a CV.

Yet the IMPACT of each type of ship in the game should be the same, that is why it's called BALANCE!

Quit begging.

I can summarize every "point" you said in one point.

Every forum title or thread is about the BALANCE of Carriers, not the Technical (Not Gameplay, TECHNICAL) Broken feature with Carriers, if carriers and their counterplay work on a TECHNICAL standpoint, THEN we can go into balance, as we will have discovered things that are Technical issues that are having BALANCE EFFECTS.

It's why RTS games make sure their units path right, FPS games (oh hey, World of Warships is a Shooter) focus on hit detection to make sure that your shots are actually registering they hit whatever they actually hit, it wouldn't do to hit the bridge of a Kurfurst and that result in a full AP citadel from a Yamato, no? 

That's the argument being made.

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18 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

I can summarize every "point" you said in one point.

Possibly, but you didn't.

19 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

Every forum title or thread is about the BALANCE of Carriers, not the Technical (Not Gameplay, TECHNICAL) Broken feature with Carriers, if carriers and their counterplay work on a TECHNICAL standpoint, THEN we can go into balance, as we will have discovered things that are Technical issues that are having BALANCE EFFECTS.

Despite all this nonsensical mumbo-jumbo you threw down, the issue IS technical, because balance is a technical issue. All the rest of that happy free-for-all goomba horse hockey is nothing but window dressing designed to do only one thing, which is to take the readers mind of the all important balance issue.

23 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

It's why RTS games make sure their units path right, FPS games (oh hey, World of Warships is a Shooter) focus on hit detection to make sure that your shots are actually registering they hit whatever they actually hit, it wouldn't do to hit the bridge of a Kurfurst and that result in a full AP citadel from a Yamato, no? 

Regardless of what any of this means, it has NOTHING to do with the issue.

24 minutes ago, SerynFate said:

That's the argument being made.

There is no argument being made here, just some lame attempt to further cloud the issue, that being CVs are unbalanced and OP.

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8 minutes ago, Umikami said:

After reading that discontinuous rambling mess laughingly referred to as your argument, imagine my concern about your opinion of me. When I add to that the stellar level of company you keep, well, lets just say I'm not losing any sleep worrying about getting your Christmas card this year. You fit nicely into that category of posters who, having nothing with which to counter an argument, will instead attack the person posting it. You and your foaming at the mouth friend are the Forum equivalent of an 8 year screaming "YOU"RE A DOODY HEAD!" Good luck with that.

@emmapulido See, he just proved himself of what I said.

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9 minutes ago, Umikami said:

After reading that discontinuous rambling mess laughingly referred to as your argument, imagine my concern about your opinion of me. When I add to that the stellar level of company you keep, well, lets just say I'm not losing any sleep worrying about getting your Christmas card this year. You fit nicely into that category of posters who, having nothing with which to counter an argument, will instead attack the person posting it. You and your foaming at the mouth friend are the Forum equivalent of an 8 year screaming "YOU"RE A DOODY HEAD!" Good luck with that.

I must say, you're actually quite hilarious. Gave me a good laugh there.

Gl with your CV-hating tho.

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20 minutes ago, RyuuohD_NA said:

@emmapulido See, he just proved himself of what I said.

Yeah, it's amazing how accurate that was.

Edited by emmapulido

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