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Spiderlife77

Stalingrad or Bourgogne

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Hello commanders! I need a piece of advice - which ship is better to get for steel: Stalingrad or Bourgogne and why! 

First of all for Clan Battles, then for Ranked battles, Random - is on the third place.

Edited by Spiderlife77

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1 minute ago, Spiderlife77 said:

Hello commanders! I need a piece of advice - which ship is better to get for steel: Stalingrad or Burgundy and why!

Give me your steel, I’ll test one out and report back to you, promise.

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bourgogne looks like a JB on steroids. and JB is to me the best tier9 premium currently in game,extremely versatile.bourgogne have great AA,great secondaries,fastest BB in game and the accuracy is not alsace tier.

stalingrad is a oversized kronshtadt.it too excels on mistakes done by the enemy.

Edited by Cruxdei

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I wouldn't know first hand but I've heard Stalingrad is better for Clan Battles, ranked I'm not sure but for randoms, Bourgonge is probably better if you know how to handle her. although Stalingrad seems to do well in randoms as well.

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6 minutes ago, USMC8sux said:

Give me your steel, I’ll test one out and report back to you, promise. 

I can release some amount of Derivatives for you with the redemption period of 10 years.  :Smile_coin:

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1 minute ago, Battleship_Elisabeth said:

Stalingrad. I have never see a Bourgogne do anything even mildly impressive. 

Thank u. Do you have both of them or only one?

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I'd suggest the Stalingrad for the same reason I got mine. It's the oldest of the tier X steel Ships so it'll likely be the first to be removed if they decide to replace or rotate them. Fortunately, in large part thanks to last years Snowflake Event, I'm not too far from adding Bourgogne now. Of course I'd be willing to bet at least one, maybe two of the in-development ships will be priced for Steel. Here's hoping for a nice blizzard around Christmas.

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Bourgogne is an Alsace with reload booster. Fun to play, but based on your stated intention, the 380's are pretty light for a Tier X  BB in Clan battles. Stalin is sort of made for Clan Battles. It is a tough ship and punishes other CA's. (So can Bourgogne,) But in Clan Battles where you are limited to ONE BB, there are many better BB's to use. Mainly because of the small caliber guns! (Stalin is strong enough really be an advantage in Clan battles based on the one BB rule)

So Stalin is my pick based on your criteria.

For ranked I think there are plenty of better choices than either one.

I have Alsace (tier 9) and chose to spend steel on Stalingrad, so you can take that into consideration of my opinion...

Edited by fbrrhd
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4 minutes ago, JediMasterDraco said:

I'd suggest the Stalingrad for the same reason I got mine. It's the oldest of the tier X steel Ships so it'll likely be the first to be removed if they decide to replace or rotate them

That's a very interesting and important moment. I didn't think about it in such a perspective.

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You're reading my minds. The matter is I saw a few times Bourgogne in the latest Clan Battles videos. She was a pick of very, very skilled clans. For example -TWA- (it's Europe). They're #1 on EU server... 

Edited by Spiderlife77

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14 minutes ago, fbrrhd said:

Bourgogne is an Alsace with reload booster. Fun to play, but based on your stated intention, the 380's are pretty light for a Tier X  BB in Clan battles. Stalin is sort of made for Clan Battles. It is a tough ship and punishes other CA's. (So can Bourgogne,) But in Clan Battles where you are limited to ONE BB, there are many better BB's to use. Mainly because of the small caliber guns!

So Stalin is my pick based on your criteria.

For ranked I think there are plenty of better choices than either one.

I have Alsace (tier 9) and chose to spend steel on Stalingrad, so you can take that into consideration of my opinion...

You're reading my minds. The matter is I saw a few times Bourgogne in the latest Clan Battles videos. She was a pick of very, very skilled clans. For example -TWA- (it's Europe). They're #1 on EU server...

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1 hour ago, Spiderlife77 said:

Hello commanders! I need a piece of advice - which ship is better to get for steel: Stalingrad or Bourgogne and why! 

First of all for Clan Battles, then for Ranked battles, Random - is on the third place.

Staly is as close to a BB you can get as a cruiser, and Bourgogne is (one of the) closest BBs to a cruiser. In fact, had some laughs when doing CBs because I realized  Bourg is faster, stealthier, and healthier than a Stalingrad. 

 

I only have Bourgogne, and I love it. Its like an Alsace hooked up with a Jean Bart and got boosted to tier 10. There are few things that can match the sheer joy of triple tapping a GK for 20k HP each time by using the MBRB. Or rocketing around at 38.5 knots for 4.5 minutes. Its all fun. She is a slippery snake that will brutally punish anything that makes a mistake in randoms. For clan battles? Not so much. Only a top 5 team with perfect co-ordination and teamwork can make Bourg work anywhere. Otherwise, she is stuck basically to everything under storm. That's where your fighting newer clans who have much less of a clue. Several times I would just rush in and 1 vs 4 a bunch of cruisers. Easy. Play it super aggressively and fast track it up.  (Like so -> 20190523_215521_PFSB510-Bourgogne_25_sea_hope.wowsreplay). Once you get to Storm though, people get smart. They wont let you punish them with MBRB, and you will just get focused and killed.

 

Again, the opposite holds true for Stalingrad. I don't own it, but I feel like it just gets gunned down in randoms because of its reputation. You cant tank precisely because you have people on all sides. But there is no denying that Stalingrad practically defined (arguably still does) the CB meta. Its a cruiser that almost is a battleship. It completely changes the game.

 

I would say the best bet is to go with your gut. If you want my answer, it would depend on what you want it for. CBVs? Stalingrad. Clubbing innocent seals? Bourg will treat you well. Low level CB trolls? Both, but Bourg is just flat entertaining. 

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Stalingrad. In both ranked and clan battles, it has almost the impact of a battleship while at the same time being matched against a cruiser, plus it has an intimidation factor like nothing else in the game outside of a flight of midway AP dive bombers.

If you play smart, you can do terrible, terrible things to an enemy team.

If you play stupid, well... let's just say you should avoid playing stupid if at all possible, okay?

 

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21 minutes ago, _1204_ said:

Staly is as close to a BB you can get as a cruiser, and Bourgogne is (one of the) closest BBs to a cruiser. In fact, had some laughs when doing CBs because I realized  Bourg is faster, stealthier, and healthier than a Stalingrad. 

 

I only have Bourgogne, and I love it. Its like an Alsace hooked up with a Jean Bart and got boosted to tier 10. There are few things that can match the sheer joy of triple tapping a GK for 20k HP each time by using the MBRB. Or rocketing around at 38.5 knots for 4.5 minutes. Its all fun. She is a slippery snake that will brutally punish anything that makes a mistake in randoms. For clan battles? Not so much. Only a top 5 team with perfect co-ordination and teamwork can make Bourg work anywhere. Otherwise, she is stuck basically to everything under storm. That's where your fighting newer clans who have much less of a clue. Several times I would just rush in and 1 vs 4 a bunch of cruisers. Easy. Play it super aggressively and fast track it up.  (Like so -> 20190523_215521_PFSB510-Bourgogne_25_sea_hope.wowsreplay). Once you get to Storm though, people get smart. They wont let you punish them with MBRB, and you will just get focused and killed.

 

Again, the opposite holds true for Stalingrad. I don't own it, but I feel like it just gets gunned down in randoms because of its reputation. You cant tank precisely because you have people on all sides. But there is no denying that Stalingrad practically defined (arguably still does) the CB meta. Its a cruiser that almost is a battleship. It completely changes the game.

 

I would say the best bet is to go with your gut. If you want my answer, it would depend on what you want it for. CBVs? Stalingrad. Clubbing innocent seals? Bourg will treat you well. Low level CB trolls? Both, but Bourg is just flat entertaining

Thank you very much for such a complete and detailed answer. Making a decision got a way more difficult now  :fish_book: :fish_nerv:but you definitely gave me food for thought.

Once again - thank you!

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20 minutes ago, LT_Rusty_SWO said:
 
7 minutes ago, LT_Rusty_SWO said:

Stalingrad. In both ranked and clan battles, it has almost the impact of a battleship while at the same time being matched against a cruiser, plus it has an intimidation factor like nothing else in the game outside of a flight of midway AP dive bombers.

If you play smart, you can do terrible, terrible things to an enemy team.

If you play stupid, well... let's just say you should avoid playing stupid if at all possible, okay?

 

 

"it has almost the impact of a battleship while at the same time being matched against a cruiser" - that's probably the most important moment. Having a CA which is almost a BB... 

Thank you, for now, it's one of the most decisive argument that I see. 

The cons are that Stalingrad has pretty monotonous gameplay - tanking by the bow in most situations in Clan Battles

Edited by Spiderlife77

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1 minute ago, Spiderlife77 said:

"it has almost the impact of a battleship while at the same time being matched against a cruiser" - that's probably the most important moment. Having a CA which is almost a BB... 

Thank you, for now, it's one of the most decisive argument that I see. 

The cons are that Stalingrad has pretty monotonous gameplay - tanking by the bow in most situations in Clan Battles

 

It's only as monotonous as you let it be. I don't have the highest stats in the world in it, but I have a lot of fun using it. 

Ranked, it's actually a lot of fun. 4 battles so far today, average of ~122k damage. Lost 2, but haven't lost a star yet. (Those last 2 battles we had lots and lots of rentals who were "just here to have some fun," because "who cares if we win, we 're having fun." )

 

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11 hours ago, Spiderlife77 said:

Hello commanders! I need a piece of advice - which ship is better to get for steel: Stalingrad or Bourgogne and why! 

First of all for Clan Battles, then for Ranked battles, Random - is on the third place.

I’ll give you a different perspective:

Clan Battles: How is your clan organized? Do you expect to be placed on a map according to a clan leader making the calls, or will you have autonomy of initial positioning?

 In my case, we have a team leader making the calls, snd when I bring my Stalingrad the positioning and low rate of fire alost invariably leaves me in a pinned down, inflexible position. I ended up opting to bring Moskva instead, as the higher rate of fire gave me more tactical options. But the Stalingrad draws lots of enemy attention, and if the spot you’re sent to has good defensive value, the enemy team will often expend a lot of time trying to keep you pinned, and the rest of your team can achieve a lot.

If you bring the Bourgogne or another BB into clan battles, you'll get a different leader callout for your initial position. You’ll have a different type of battle.

Also, if Clan Battles is your #1 consideration, what is your clan’s biggest need? Consider in this that Clan Battles are currently limited to one BB per side - if your clan already has a top-rate BB man, it’ll be hard to get the Bourgogne off the bench.

And what other ships does your clan bring into the mix? The current CB meta favors having at least 2-3 radar ships on the field - can your clan bring that?

And the teams are small - if you pop your Stalingrad radar with your low rate of fire, is your team normally positioned well enough (and informed well enough in advance, that’s your job) to capitalize on short-duration Russian radar?

For Ranked, the presence of a Stalingrad seems to cause a lot of freaking out on the part of the Reds when they see it. You’ll get lots of focus. If you pick a good position, that focus will be wasted. With the random collection of individuals in Ranked, the reds often will be slow to realize this. Of course the random collection of individuals on the green side might be slow take advantage of it, as well.

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Stalingrad is a objectively better ship for CB and ranked, but it isn't "fun" to play.  

Bourgogne doesn't fit competitive play well, but is far more fun to play in randoms.  

If you're getting the ship for competitive alone, get the Stalin.  If you want a ship that's fun to play, get the Bourgogne. 

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1 hour ago, XpliCT_ said:

Stalingrad is a objectively better ship for CB and ranked, but it isn't "fun" to play.  

Bourgogne doesn't fit competitive play well, but is far more fun to play in randoms.  

If you're getting the ship for competitive alone, get the Stalin.  If you want a ship that's fun to play, get the Bourgogne. 

Owning both myself, this is exactly my take as well.  

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I'd say this:

Stalingrad looks more like a big Moskva. So if you have Moskva and like her playstyle, Stalingrad is viable and might work

Bourgogne is an Alsace at T10. if you like Alsace, Bourgogne will be great for you

you can also read  @LittleWhiteMouse's premium reviews of these two ships as well

 

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others have said it and i agree . i have the stalingrad , regret the purchase .  Good ship for clan battles and ranked . (trying to avoid playing it in ranked myself )  But stalin in randoms is not very fun for me even though i think  I do pretty well with it 

Edited by EyE_dYe_QuIck

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It seems like the general consensus is that Stalingrad is better in competitive and Bourgogne  is better in "random"

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