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HazeGrayUnderway

Tier VIII Premium Battleship Lenin

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This ship popped out of nowhere in the Premium Shop today.  I had not followed any of its development news and I figured others know next to nothing about her like I do.  The only review on her released state is from Notser at this time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYv1lml7FpM

Found one in German if you can understand.  It's pretty lengthy at 27 minutes compared to the 7 minutes of Notser's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3hsmCF2hsA

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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Didn't WG do the same thing with Exeter? WIP, WIP, then one day it was suddenly available - even the CCs apparently didn't have very much notice.

You'd think they would take the time to build up some hype before just dropping it in the shop out of the blue.

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32 minutes ago, Cuesta_Rey said:

Is this thing a Nelson with a red star on it?

 

In layout that's what it basically is.  The gunnery is RU BB style which favors AP unlike the HE of Nelson and most every other RN BB.  Notser makes no mention about Repair Party so that's probably normal.  A brief dive into WoWS Wiki on Repair Party seems to show it's normal but it may or may not be up to date.

You also got the 30 second turret traverse on Lenin while Nelson has 45.

Also, as a Tier VIII, you got Tier VIII armor while Nelson like every other Tier VII and lower BB gets Overmatched by 380mm+ AP.

 

Edit:  Was watching the German review.  Didn't understand but WoWS UI is still information anyone can use.  Some armor values (video link is timestamped to the armor):

 

A short take on the exterior armor he went over.

wSG6NQ5.jpg

 

Here's some first impression information I gathered on the Tech Tree RU BB for this tier, Vladivostok if you want to compare.

 

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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41 minutes ago, Nevermore135 said:

Didn't WG do the same thing with Exeter? WIP, WIP, then one day it was suddenly available - even the CCs apparently didn't have very much notice.

You'd think they would take the time to build up some hype before just dropping it in the shop out of the blue.

It was announced a week or so ago that lenin would be released on VE day.

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5 minutes ago, Kingpin61 said:

It was announced a week or so ago that lenin would be released on VE day.

Ah. Must have missed that announcement. I was under the impression it was going to be released around the time of the next patch.

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Preliminary impressions in co-op:

Bow tanks quite well and seems able to protect her above-water citadel while angling enough to use all 3 main gun batteries.  Main guns are quite accurate and effective at closer ranges. Painfully slow reload time and low top speed.

Overall, a tough ship when pointed toward enemies, but can easily be out-flanked or cross-fired upon if not careful.  The front turret armor has only a little angling, so I took Preventive Maintenance after a couple of main gun battery incapacitations.

You only get 3 damage control party consumables (4 with superintendent, of course) and her overall health pool is on the low side.  However, neither of these were much of an issue in my limited co-op experience, because most of the damage you receive is from fire and can largely be healed back.

Co-op battles seem to have two contrasting outcomes: (i) they end while you're getting "warmed up" due to the slow travel and reload speed; or (ii) you're the last one standing, fighting two or more red bots (and surviving with a thousand or less hp) because Lenin can be really tough with proper positioning (but glacially slow). 

Lenin is a slow and deliberate battleship. Kind of a Russian Bear version of Nelson, without the super heal, but with better armor, and favoring AP over HE.

Overall, I like her much more than the Vladivostok and hope the coming tier 9 and 10 Russian BBs are as viable and distinctive too.

Edited by KatiyaKomova
Added info on health pool and DCP. Corrected number of DCPs

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Something is up with the guns on this ship and I would recommend the tech tree version (0.8.4) over this premium.  This ship is NOT following the design that was sold to the player base about the Soviet BBs being great at mid and closer ranges; the dispersion is not working that way in my matches so far. In fact I had another Lenin in 7.0km broadside to me and I fired all three turrets, nine shells - No, I repeat NO shells hit the other ship. I have my sights dead to rights on the Lenin and nothing hit. 

In other matches the shells are not going there they should, it does not have improved dispersion at close ranges (7-12 km). Buyer beware.

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25 minutes ago, MalgusKerensky said:

Something is up with the guns on this ship and I would recommend the tech tree version (0.8.4) over this premium.  This ship is NOT following the design that was sold to the player base about the Soviet BBs being great at mid and closer ranges; the dispersion is not working that way in my matches so far. In fact I had another Lenin in 7.0km broadside to me and I fired all three turrets, nine shells - No, I repeat NO shells hit the other ship. I have my sights dead to rights on the Lenin and nothing hit. 

In other matches the shells are not going there they should, it does not have improved dispersion at close ranges (7-12 km). Buyer beware.

I went and got it, have been testing in co-op, getting high hit% salvos in the typical ranges RU BBs are supposed to be good for.  Like a bot Queen Elizabeth at 7-8km, 9 gun salvo, 8 hits.

RNG is going to RNG at times for sure, but for most parts it's holding up.  If it goes bad, that's on me usually.

20190508_164723_PRSB518-Lenin_16_OC_bees_to_honey.wowsreplay

Some pictures from a simple game I just had firing in the ranges you're complaining about.

6 gun salvo at 6.4km, 3 hits for 3 Pens +1 Citadel.

dn1xeAm.jpg

3 gun salvo at 6.9km, 2 hits for 2 Overpens.

RFvBW4A.jpg

6 gun salvo at 8.2km, 6 hits for 5 Overpens, 1 Pen,  1 Citadel.

PVBzFoj.jpg

 

Not saying I'm doing amazing, but the gunnery is behaving like I expect as with all my other RU BBs.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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My low estimate is that Lenin will eventually average around 56.8k damage/battle, above Gascogne and below Vanguard. This is by interpolating based on assumed 1,500 xp/battle.

My high estimate is that Lenin will be the single most OP battleship in Tier 8, surpassing everything else.

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2 hours ago, _Marines said:

My low estimate is that Lenin will eventually average around 56.8k damage/battle, above Gascogne and below Vanguard. This is by interpolating based on assumed 1,500 xp/battle.

My high estimate is that Lenin will be the single most OP battleship in Tier 8, surpassing everything else.

Hey

I picked up Lenin but have not tried her out yet.  I do very well with the Gascogne and love the boat; the Vanguard is utter garbage for me, the guns are terrible, inaccurate at any range, don't hit hard at all even on many broadside or near so ships.  It handles well as a ship but damage is very low.  The Gascogne, if you get around the gun layout for me does very well and Is one of my better 100K+ damage dealing BB's, it's speedy, fairly agile, decent armor, good AA.  Will see how the Lenin does soon.

 

Pete

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Bought it a couple hours ago. Ship is pretty fun. It’s nothing like Nicholai, my only other rusky BB, except it’s tough and guns have nice ballistics. 

Pros:

dam cont/repair party is different in a good way. You will be surprised to see how quickly available it is. It won’t save the day under prolonged HE but it will buy you more time if you are able to dictate engagements. 

Turrets turn fast. And the third turret is good for 360 so all 9 guns are always ready to go. Groupings are really nice. There are a few wonky cast offs here and there but the bulk hit as expected.

Looks really cool. 

Cons:

secondaries lack range. Seriously. Lack. Range. Forget all about them.

AA seems meh. It’s not awful. It’s def not great. Gonna want to group up with better AA boats. Definitely do NOT want to get isolated.

It will burn for days.

Not sure if it was an outlier or not but my last game of the night I had all 3 turrets knocked out. One was Damaged and repaired. A second was damage and repaired. Both were then destroyed. Then my third was knocked out. Crazy. Never happened to any ship in all my years playing this before.

Hard to explain but it seems like this boat turns alright at speed but, more than any other BB, this thing won’t turn at all going slow.

Bottom line: I couldn’t buy a win. Long line of losses but I placed in top 5 every time. IT IS NOT OVERPOWERED.

 

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3 hours ago, thebigblue said:

Bought it a couple hours ago. Ship is pretty fun. It’s nothing like Nicholai, my only other rusky BB, except it’s tough and guns have nice ballistics. 

Pros:

dam cont/repair party is different in a good way. You will be surprised to see how quickly available it is. It won’t save the day under prolonged HE but it will buy you more time if you are able to dictate engagements. 

Turrets turn fast. And the third turret is good for 360 so all 9 guns are always ready to go. Groupings are really nice. There are a few wonky cast offs here and there but the bulk hit as expected.

Looks really cool. 

Cons:

secondaries lack range. Seriously. Lack. Range. Forget all about them.

AA seems meh. It’s not awful. It’s def not great. Gonna want to group up with better AA boats. Definitely do NOT want to get isolated.

It will burn for days.

Not sure if it was an outlier or not but my last game of the night I had all 3 turrets knocked out. One was Damaged and repaired. A second was damage and repaired. Both were then destroyed. Then my third was knocked out. Crazy. Never happened to any ship in all my years playing this before.

Hard to explain but it seems like this boat turns alright at speed but, more than any other BB, this thing won’t turn at all going slow.

Bottom line: I couldn’t buy a win. Long line of losses but I placed in top 5 every time. IT IS NOT OVERPOWERED.

 

The tech tree RU BBs have good rudder shift time, better even than USN ones that tend to be on the nice side.  That's probably what you're seeing.  But the turning circle radius is wide.  The Tier VIII RU BBs:

Have a wide turning circle Radius like IJN BBs, i.e. that's not good.  Still, Lenin has a 840m radius while Vladivostok is at a whopping 950m radius.  NC has 760m, Amagi has 870m.

Lenin has 13.5 second rudder shift time and Vladivostok is 13.7.  NC has 15.2 seconds and Amagi has 17.3 seconds.

 

Secondaries aren't good.  The range is similar to USN & RN, i.e. "Sucks."  The ROF also is rather slow.  On top of those two issues, I don't like the Secondaries gun layout on Lenin.  So many of the guns block each other.  You have to show a rather exposed side to get a decent number able to fire.  Also, there's a number of low pen 100mm guns with a mediocre 6% fire chance.  The 152mm guns have fair pen and fire chance, but fire too slowly.  Altogether it's not a good Secondary Suite, IMO.

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Denis:  Aleksei, why are you in Gulag?
Aleksei: I bought Lenin and was reported because overpowered ship.

Denis: Boris? What about you?
Boris: I bought Lenin and complained in forum it is too weak.

Aleksei: And Denis, why are you here in Gulag?
Denis: I did not buy Lenin.

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It's everything Nelson wants to be and isnt.

16 hours ago, _Marines said:

My high estimate is that Lenin will be the single most OP battleship in Tier 8, surpassing everything else.

It may average higher than any of the others, but it's too unsubtle and punishing of mistakes to really be overpowered. Show your side and you're gonna get rekt to a larger degree than most other tier 8 battleships. However, it's very strong and very good at what it does. I like it, and if it's an indicator of how the Sovetsky Soyuz and the Kreml are going to play, I'll like them, too.

--Helms

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Hey

I took mine out in "One" battle and purposely went to brawling; was up against a Tirpitz, a NC, a Atlanta and a DD, and the carrier on their side.  Managed 58.2K damage and tanked just over 1.9 million potential, with a basic 10pt. captain (PT, EM, SI, CE).  I found she is weak in AA and the carrier kept starting fires, as did the Atlanta naturally.  I did ok damage to the Tirpitz until he went behind an island, he did get a citadel on me though (not enough angling I guess), next was the NC and I citadel'd him and did decent damage but didn't find the pens (I had an equal number of overpens and pens and a few ricochet's.  best salvo was about 12K.  The ship does seem to catch fire quite easily and I will probably drop CE for FP.  I only shot down like 4 or 6 aircraft.  I had a cruiser helping me and a DD not to far away.  The secondaries were ineffective at doing much of anything.  There was nothing amazing about the guns even within brawling range in this 1st game but more time is needed to get used to it.  If I was to build one; I would recommend a survival build and seriously watch that broadside in the same manner as the Nelson.  I played this rather reckless just to see how it did, it's decent, it's ok but it's not amazing right out of the box.  Time will tell much more, just my thoughts after "Just" 1 game.

 

Game #2 was just over 42K damage, bottom tier, was top BB at 5th place.  I didn't not see any improvement to accuracy on anything 15km and under, in fact waterline shots were amazingly lack luster; I would have preferred to been playing my Bismarck or Tirpitz, or my Gascogne, Richelieu, Bama, Mass.  Game 2 was still disappointing overall.  Going to switch from steering gears 2 to Damage Control 2.  

 

Pete

Edited by sasquatch_research

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On 5/8/2019 at 7:37 PM, _Marines said:

My low estimate is that Lenin will eventually average around 56.8k damage/battle, above Gascogne and below Vanguard. This is by interpolating based on assumed 1,500 xp/battle.

My high estimate is that Lenin will be the single most OP battleship in Tier 8, surpassing everything else.

No chance on high estimate. It lacks the range, has weak secondaries and doesn’t have the survivability of many of its peers.

Edited by thebigblue

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Nelsonovich is pretty damn good.  Did you expect anything less from a ship literally draped in Soviet banners and adorned with red stars?  Russian bias, of course, does not exist: But laser-like dispersion at close range (enough to get 5 cits on an angled NC with "underwater citadel"), cruiser-level turret traverse on 406mm guns with superior penetration, as well as 100mm lower bow plating sufficient to scoff off capitalist shells do make one want to hum "The Internationale" while deleting free-market fascists in this, the #UniversalSocialistBlissYacht.

(Sarcasm off: I knew the Nikolai was a winner the minute I saw it in the shop. Same reasoning with the Lenin: As someone familiar with WG since 2011, if something is unabashedly Russian, just buy it.  You won't be disappointed).

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On 5/10/2019 at 8:18 AM, thebigblue said:

No chance on high estimate. It lacks the range, has weak secondaries and doesn’t have the survivability of many of its peers.

Currently in the NA server, player Locked_n_Loaded_ has played 52 PvP matches in Lenin and here is how is stats look like (open to anyone's interpretation):

Untitled.thumb.png.58b0580fa1c391da4be231bc296d80e5.png

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15 hours ago, _Marines said:

Currently in the NA server, player Locked_n_Loaded_ has played 52 PvP matches in Lenin and here is how is stats look like (open to anyone's interpretation):

 

Average frags is down compared to the Massachusetts, probably the long reload of the Lenin vice the secondary kill securing power of Mamie. Same for the PR, it seems the long reload and the lack of truly monstrous secondaries keeps it from being too good at murdering everything around it. Proof that Soviet battleships are really tough adversaries in the right hands, which Locked_ clearly has. 

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Hey

I think Wargaming would have done better had they made her into more of a Russian secondary build ship like Mass. or one of the Germans.  I have not found her guns all that exciting even at close ranges which I thought was their signature thing.  Secondary guns were lack luster and the AA was nothing interesting even for a BB; admittedly though, I only have a 10 pt in mine.  It looks cool though.

 

Pete

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I started off unhappy regarding the Lenin until I started playing her bow in...and she can tank some shots.  I've faced every tier 10 BB and throttling/rudder to keep her bow in, I haven't had any issues.  When given a broadside opportunity, I hit a Montana for over 54K in one salvo, and multiple citadels.  The Gun pen and get penned but If I take out the enemy turrets on a bow to bow encounter, she's bound to turn sideways.  I'm impressed with her just DON'T give away your sides, a tier 6 BB almost took me out from full health.

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On 5/8/2019 at 8:07 PM, HazeGrayUnderway said:

I went and got it, have been testing in co-op, getting high hit% salvos in the typical ranges RU BBs are supposed to be good for.  Like a bot Queen Elizabeth at 7-8km, 9 gun salvo, 8 hits.

RNG is going to RNG at times for sure, but for most parts it's holding up.  If it goes bad, that's on me usually.

20190508_164723_PRSB518-Lenin_16_OC_bees_to_honey.wowsreplay

Some pictures from a simple game I just had firing in the ranges you're complaining about.

6 gun salvo at 6.4km, 3 hits for 3 Pens +1 Citadel.

dn1xeAm.jpg

3 gun salvo at 6.9km, 2 hits for 2 Overpens.

RFvBW4A.jpg

6 gun salvo at 8.2km, 6 hits for 5 Overpens, 1 Pen,  1 Citadel.

PVBzFoj.jpg

 

Not saying I'm doing amazing, but the gunnery is behaving like I expect as with all my other RU BBs.

the lennin is good BB?¡

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