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Canadian_Reaper

How do you deal with CVs in a BB without AA

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Hey All

Not a rant- there's more than enough of those, but last week came back to the game after a break since December, and been running into the new CV meta and let's be honest, I enjoy the game, but I don't understand a lot of the players who get so upset, -WG's games are fun, but they can be considered RNG machines, I can hit a broadside Nelson for 4 Citadels and the same shot at teh same angel can get 4 overpens, it's a RNG fest.  

I am not a CV player, i tried out the old school CVs, and I was terrible in them, left them alone.

That being said..

 I've been sailing the Sinop recently, and it seems if a T8 CV decides to focus me, I get wrecked.  Again not a complaint vs the CV's, -my American BB's tend to do ok, but I want to know how players mitigate damage with the "low AA" BBs

Against something like a DD, if I know it's out there, I can adjust heading and speed constantly, but the ship doesn't seem to adjust fast enough to throw planes off. 

Just had a game where I took 3 strikes from a Graf Zepplin, doing 13k, 10K and 9k - let me be clear, I have NO idea if this guy had RNG of the gods and I'm going to see my demise on youtube, or if this was an an average hit. But essentially I took 32,000 damage from a strike that I have no idea how I could have avoided. I was spending time shadowing a Helena, but it got deleted by a red BB. Started to move towards the next friendlies when the CV decided to drop me.

So really just wondering, is there a way to mitigate CV strikes in BBs without good AA values?

 

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I leave CVs alone, they should leave me alone!

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Your options

  • Pray the enemy CV is potato and doesn't notice you there
  • Don't play BBs with poor AA
  • Division with ships that have good AA
  • Stick around other ships that have good AA
  • Adapt and accept getting boinked by your CV overlords.
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Request fighter cover from your own CVs, stay close to ships with strong AA and let them know that you’re in need of AA protection, and do not let yourself become isolated. 

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My question to the OP is: How long does it take them to wreck you?  Keep in mind all the time they spend on you, the rest of your team is not being bothered by those CVs.

The pre-rework carriers would have just sunk you in one or two shots, and you'd be gone in 60 seconds or less, AND they were still spotting in other areas of the map, too!

 

 

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Maybe others have a different experience, but in the battles I am playing, the friendly CV will rarely drop his fighters to protect an allied ship.  He will almost always drop them on an enemy DD he is trying to strike, to keep the DD spotted for when he can turn his strike planes around for another attack.

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4 minutes ago, SkaerKrow said:

Request fighter cover from your own CVs, stay close to ships with strong AA and let them know that you’re in need of AA protection, and do not let yourself become isolated. 

Hah, good luck with that one.

No CV player trying to win will actively do that, unless said BB is already along the way to their intended target.

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Adjusting to new CV play coming from the old style takes a minute.  If you're not an AA cruiser, you must use AA where you can.  Fighters, cap'n skills, appropriate consumables, and flags.  With the new CV patch, your captain skills should have been reset.  If you have fighters, use the +1 fighter cap'n skill.  Every time your fighters engage, that's an extra plane dropped -- fighters kill on a 1:1 basis.   Use AA sector reinforcement.  if you're being focused, set it to the side the CV comes from.  Once he comes in, give him your reinforced broad side.  Time your reinforcement to zero out BEFORE planes arrive so that you get a few seconds of extra whacks on the aircraft.  Once over head they may or may not be able to tell if the sector is reinforced.  If you pull it off a few times, especially if you've got heavy reinforcement, after 2 runs on you he may decide you're not worth it.  Graf has the fastest planes. extending AA range is beneficial. 

CVs themselves are AA beasts so don't assume you've got to rely on cruisers, if your CV is near, go to it.  My midway reinforces AA at 140/60 and I position it to catch CVs when they overshoot on a run.  I boost AA on it and it absolutely destroys every aircraft that gets near it.  In CV I will go out of my way to counter enemy CV despite previous comments.  The idea is to WIN THE MATCH.  That occurs by keeping the team alive.  I'm able to deal 120 - 200k damage a game regularly.

Edited by NoSoMo

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9 minutes ago, NoSoMo said:

Adjusting to new CV play coming from the old style takes a minute.  If you're not an AA cruiser, you must use AA where you can.  Fighters, cap'n skills, appropriate consumables, and flags.  With the new CV patch, your captain skills should have been reset.  If you have fighters, use the +1 fighter cap'n skill.  Every time your fighters engage, that's an extra plane dropped -- fighters kill on a 1:1 basis.   Use AA sector reinforcement.  if you're being focused, set it to the side the CV comes from.  Once he comes in, give him your reinforced broad side.  Time your reinforcement to zero out BEFORE planes arrive so that you get a few seconds of extra whacks on the aircraft.  Once over head they may or may not be able to tell if the sector is reinforced.  If you pull it off a few times, especially if you've got heavy reinforcement, after 2 runs on you he may decide you're not worth it.  Graf has the fastest planes. extending AA range is beneficial. 

CVs themselves are AA beasts so don't assume you've got to rely on cruisers, if your CV is near, go to it.  My midway reinforces AA at 140/60 and I position it to catch CVs when they overshoot on a run.  I boost AA on it and it absolutely destroys every aircraft that gets near it.  In CV I will go out of my way to counter enemy CV despite previous comments.  The idea is to WIN THE MATCH.  That occurs by keeping the team alive.  I'm able to deal 120 - 200k damage a game regularly.

Have you even played Sinop?

It's shooting range is about par with Midway's concealment.

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Division with support ships. 

 

Ask at start of battle for a support ship if you are without a division.

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19 minutes ago, NoSoMo said:

Adjusting to new CV play coming from the old style takes a minute.  If you're not an AA cruiser, you must use AA where you can.  Fighters, cap'n skills, appropriate consumables, and flags.  With the new CV patch, your captain skills should have been reset.  If you have fighters, use the +1 fighter cap'n skill.  Every time your fighters engage, that's an extra plane dropped -- fighters kill on a 1:1 basis.   Use AA sector reinforcement.  if you're being focused, set it to the side the CV comes from.  Once he comes in, give him your reinforced broad side.  Time your reinforcement to zero out BEFORE planes arrive so that you get a few seconds of extra whacks on the aircraft.  Once over head they may or may not be able to tell if the sector is reinforced.  If you pull it off a few times, especially if you've got heavy reinforcement, after 2 runs on you he may decide you're not worth it.  Graf has the fastest planes. extending AA range is beneficial. 

Only thing I would say your right on is the +1 fighter skill.

Otherwise if you are in a ship with very low AA then don't bother buffing it. Focus on the skills that will help you either mitigate damage and fires/flooding in a tanking BB or maximize your damage. Then simply forget about the enemy Aircraft (or pay less attention to them if your in a ship that can dodge) and focus down the enemy that you can see while staying close to your team mates that do have good AA.

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You ask an AA cruiser to be your buddy.

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9 minutes ago, X__QC__X said:

Only thing I would say your right on is the +1 fighter skill.

Otherwise if you are in a ship with very low AA then don't bother buffing it. Focus on the skills that will help you either mitigate damage and fires/flooding in a tanking BB or maximize your damage. Then simply forget about the enemy Aircraft (or pay less attention to them if your in a ship that can dodge) and focus down the enemy that you can see while staying close to your team mates that do have good AA.

You may be right on what's the better spec in that ship -- especially if it comes down to the margins.  I'm a CV player that focuses heavy AA ships out of the gate trying to get my team to finish them off as fast as possible. Some believe that they can AA spec ships to the max and not make themselves an easy target.  I get confederate almost every game so that should tell you what I'm attacking --- everything.    If it comes down to a few ships left in the match, I'd rather take on BBs than AA cruisers when fleets are down to 3 or 4 ships.   If the last 2 ships are AA beasts and they're together, the CV will be without aircraft in short order.  Torps are pretty much useless against the AA cruisers since they're a cake walk to dodge, BDs will get murdered immediately and rocket aircraft take losses from nearly every ship in the game.

Edited by NoSoMo

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You cant be safe from a CV, all you can do is hope he decides to kick someone else bucket first. @NoSoMo has nicely pointed out that some cv players even focus down the ships with good AA so its not like having good AA will protect you. Face it, you cant stop a CV from attacking you if you hit the battle button.

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1 hour ago, Canadian_Reaper said:

Hey All

Not a rant- there's more than enough of those, but last week came back to the game after a break since December, and been running into the new CV meta and let's be honest, I enjoy the game, but I don't understand a lot of the players who get so upset, -WG's games are fun, but they can be considered RNG machines, I can hit a broadside Nelson for 4 Citadels and the same shot at teh same angel can get 4 overpens, it's a RNG fest.  

I am not a CV player, i tried out the old school CVs, and I was terrible in them, left them alone.

That being said..

 I've been sailing the Sinop recently, and it seems if a T8 CV decides to focus me, I get wrecked.  Again not a complaint vs the CV's, -my American BB's tend to do ok, but I want to know how players mitigate damage with the "low AA" BBs

Against something like a DD, if I know it's out there, I can adjust heading and speed constantly, but the ship doesn't seem to adjust fast enough to throw planes off. 

Just had a game where I took 3 strikes from a Graf Zepplin, doing 13k, 10K and 9k - let me be clear, I have NO idea if this guy had RNG of the gods and I'm going to see my demise on youtube, or if this was an an average hit. But essentially I took 32,000 damage from a strike that I have no idea how I could have avoided. I was spending time shadowing a Helena, but it got deleted by a red BB. Started to move towards the next friendlies when the CV decided to drop me.

So really just wondering, is there a way to mitigate CV strikes in BBs without good AA values?

 

Hide  :Smile_hiding:

Honestly, there is only so much you can do once a CV decides to make you it's target of the day. 

One thing which most BB players are loath to do is swap out the spotting aircraft for catapult fighters.  Just make sure to launch them a little in advance of the strike so they can cause problems for your attackers before they attack you, not afterwards. 

If you are under attack by torp bombers and can't just avoid their attacks, try taking the torpedoes at an angle vs your torpedo bulge rather than your bow/stern or broadside.  That can help mitigate a lot of the damage they can otherwise cause. 

You can still maneuver.  Torp bombers want your broadside, dive bombers want your bow or stern.  If you are close enough to an island you can deny torp bombers an attack from that side and maybe shift your AA to the side they now have to attack to get to you. 

Try and not be the lone Ranger.  Yes being near AA cruisers can be great, but even a couple of battleships close together can create a dangerous place for aircraft to be. Don't ignore the benefits of working together even if neither of the ships have great individual AA. 

After that, prayer isn't a bad option when nothing else is working. 

....

Oh yes, did I mention hiding? :Smile_hiding:

 

Edited by BB3_Oregon_Steel

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Typically a ship has weak AA because it has strengths in other areas, so I guess, enjoy and focus on those other areas?

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11 minutes ago, Frenotx said:

Typically a ship has weak AA because it has strengths in other areas, so I guess, enjoy and focus on those other areas?

Other strengths like speed?  40 kts vs 176 kts is no contest.  Like maneuverability?  The planes WILL strike you even if you turn; it doesn’t matter.  Like firing range? The CV is 40km away behind a rock.

Exactly which strengths are you referring to? Health pool? 😏

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1 minute ago, n00bot said:

Other strengths like speed?  40 kts vs 176 kts is no contest.  Like maneuverability?  The planes WILL strike you even if you turn; it doesn’t matter.  Like firing range? The CV is 40km away behind a rock.

Exactly which strengths are you referring to? Health pool? 😏

He's saying that if you're not meant to deal with planes, maybe you should try dealing with the other ships that are destroying your friendlies.

 

Unless you're a Mino or DM/Worcester, since those ships have OP AA and guns.

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CVs can't really do that much damage so I don't worry about them. It takes what, 30+ torpedo hits for a t10 CV to sink an equal tier BB assuming it doesn't heal? If the CV is willing to spend what is basically the entire game trying to sink one ship I would consider that a win.

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1 hour ago, Canadian_Reaper said:

Hey All

Not a rant- there's more than enough of those, but last week came back to the game after a break since December, and been running into the new CV meta and let's be honest, I enjoy the game, but I don't understand a lot of the players who get so upset, -WG's games are fun, but they can be considered RNG machines, I can hit a broadside Nelson for 4 Citadels and the same shot at teh same angel can get 4 overpens, it's a RNG fest.  

I am not a CV player, i tried out the old school CVs, and I was terrible in them, left them alone.

That being said..

 I've been sailing the Sinop recently, and it seems if a T8 CV decides to focus me, I get wrecked.  Again not a complaint vs the CV's, -my American BB's tend to do ok, but I want to know how players mitigate damage with the "low AA" BBs

Against something like a DD, if I know it's out there, I can adjust heading and speed constantly, but the ship doesn't seem to adjust fast enough to throw planes off. 

Just had a game where I took 3 strikes from a Graf Zepplin, doing 13k, 10K and 9k - let me be clear, I have NO idea if this guy had RNG of the gods and I'm going to see my demise on youtube, or if this was an an average hit. But essentially I took 32,000 damage from a strike that I have no idea how I could have avoided. I was spending time shadowing a Helena, but it got deleted by a red BB. Started to move towards the next friendlies when the CV decided to drop me.

So really just wondering, is there a way to mitigate CV strikes in BBs without good AA values?

 

Easy. Play Co-op.  :Smile_teethhappy:

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1 hour ago, Mono_De_Mantequilla said:

Maybe others have a different experience, but in the battles I am playing, the friendly CV will rarely drop his fighters to protect an allied ship.  He will almost always drop them on an enemy DD he is trying to strike, to keep the DD spotted for when he can turn his strike planes around for another attack.

I do it all the time; but then I actively tried to help allies instead of just farming damage under RTS as well

I sometimes wonder if I spend too much time running around helping, but in a T10 game when you’re a T8 carrier, that’s often all you can do anyway...

1 hour ago, MrDeaf said:

Hah, good luck with that one.

No CV player trying to win will actively do that, unless said BB is already along the way to their intended target.

Guess I didn’t get that memo.

Edited by Estimated_Prophet

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there is no escape.

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Talking of ships with zero AA... How come several the low tier Cruisers T3/4 have none what so ever?

BB's and DD's have very little AA that provide some support against CV's yet Cruisers are total Free damage and XP for CV's.

Now im posting this as ive loved playing a T4 CV and its been so easy just to go round picking off cruisers at will with no chance of losing a plane

 

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