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Herr_Reitz

Really hate how game outcomes depends on the carrier

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Worked my buns off to support a team that was very, very adept at losing. You know, the usual stuff. We were in the lead near the end and within one minute I hear "You are the last hope!"

What the heck?! One minute or less? Of course I'm facing a carrier, bb and cruiser. First Blood, Gearing (18K) and  DesMoines (15K) destroyed. A GK(32K) and Azuma(9K) damage on top of that so it's yea, weak but come on... I finished 2nd on the team by less than 200 points. 

One of those who died so quickly at the end then says in all chat, "I really hate how game outcomes depends on the carriers now." All I could respond was, "me too". Don't know if it was directed at me or the Midway. But seriously? 

Look folks - don't go round pointing fingers at carriers as THE factor in a win or loss. Go look in the mirror.

This anti-cv stuff has GOT to stop. It's not good for the game. It's a crutch, an excuse, a free-pass so some think.

Personally looking forward to the RUBB's arriving. All you anti-cv folks can pitch a beach about them next, eh? OP? Stalinium? UnFAIR? Or will it be, "I hate paper ships"? 

I'm also letting you know that I enjoy carriers. I play to win which may not always please you because it doesn't coincide with how great I should be or where I should be at any given moment. I have great days and I have okay days.

Teams - stop showing your broadsides. Anticipate torps. Do NOT make yourself a low-hanging fruit for the red team!  Especially their carrier. STOP OVEREXTENDING. And - know when enough is enough. When you are winning with only a couple minutes maximum remaining, stop shouting "here I am" with your main batteries! Regroup, stay stealthy and WIN. 

BTW - The opposing Midway took out five ships.I was in the Audacious, only managed two. Good job Rio____. Now - tier X battles can be ridiculously boring or extremely fast moving. This match was both.

Finally... You have to keep eyes on the mini-map. You must. In all tiers, train yourself to drive by the mini-map. Do it. Be happy. :cap_horn::cap_like::cap_haloween:

 

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QFT!

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Yeah, almost like nothing has changed after the rework, in several respects.

Seriously; to say I STILL hate this rework is to understate my feelings.

At the same time I’m beginning to feel as you do @Herr_Reitz, carriers are a crutch, and an excuse, for not doing what can be done to negate their effect, or for poor gameplay, or for both.

Everyone driving a carrier isn’t Gaishu; yet the way those who kvetch so much do so; you would think all a carrier driver has to do is fling planes at a target to blow it out of the water.

Three months is a long time for all the crying; longer even than the OWSF and smoke firing nerfs; it’s starting to get old; even for someone like me who thinks the entire rework was a wasted effort.

(In the end, nothing has really changed except the means by which carrier games are starting to reach the same end.)

Edited by Estimated_Prophet
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People always blame the ship they dont play.

If is not have carriers, they going blame the dds...

If is the dds die, they going blame the cls.

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Just now, Herr_Reitz said:

This anti-cv stuff has GOT to stop. It's not good for the game. It's a crutch, an excuse, a free-pass so some think.

.....

BTW - The opposing Midway took out five ships.I was in the Audacious, only managed two. Good job Rio____. Now - tier X battles can be ridiculously boring or extremely fast moving. This match was both.

Says CV not affecting match outcome very strongly. Puts up match in which one CV gets a Kraken and carries match.

Hokay. 

The anti-CV stuff will never stop, because CVs suck for game play. It's CVs, not objections to them, that are bad for the game. 

What do the weekly stats show since the ReBork dropped, Herr_Reitz?

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12 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

People always blame the ship they dont play.

If is not have carriers, they going blame the dds...

If is the dds die, they going blame the cls.

Before the Rework when CVs were rarer, it was wholly reliant on the team's DDs.  The CV Rework merely changed who needs to do more.

 

Do you remember when people blamed the loss on their DDs?

TuKf61l.jpg

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24 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Do you remember when people blamed the loss on their DDs?

TuKf61l.jpg

Yes.

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Funny because because one in a CV cannot carry a team potato of they just keep dying without killing anything , so stop blaming CV player ,

 

I had a game last night were.my team barely did nothing in a 8vs 8 other than die I did what I could but one can only compensate to a certain point for bad BB and cruiser player

 

shot-19.04.23_04.04.43-0065.jpg

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CVs still have more influence on a battle that other classes due to their unrivaled ability to secure kills, spot enemies, and block caps. However, it's now closer to say, twice the influence, rather than, say, 5-10x the influence of other classes on the team's victory than before the rework.  It's hard to tell now, since battles without them are so incredibly rare now. 

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Listen, we CV players can carry *to an extent* but our team has to get us to that point first. Can I finish off 2-3 low HP ships to win a match? Sure. Can I carry a team that has lost miserably, and is down 5 ships and 300 points? NO! of course I can't. Sure CVs have tactical advantages and flexibility, but they have to rely on the team like everyone else. 

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1 hour ago, Herr_Reitz said:

Worked my buns off to support a team that was very, very adept at losing. You know, the usual stuff. We were in the lead near the end and within one minute I hear "You are the last hope!"

What the heck?! One minute or less? Of course I'm facing a carrier, bb and cruiser. First Blood, Gearing (18K) and  DesMoines (15K) destroyed. A GK(32K) and Azuma(9K) damage on top of that so it's yea, weak but come on... I finished 2nd on the team by less than 200 points. 

One of those who died so quickly at the end then says in all chat, "I really hate how game outcomes depends on the carriers now." All I could respond was, "me too". Don't know if it was directed at me or the Midway. But seriously? 

Look folks - don't go round pointing fingers at carriers as THE factor in a win or loss. Go look in the mirror.

This anti-cv stuff has GOT to stop. It's not good for the game. It's a crutch, an excuse, a free-pass so some think.

Personally looking forward to the RUBB's arriving. All you anti-cv folks can pitch a beach about them next, eh? OP? Stalinium? UnFAIR? Or will it be, "I hate paper ships"? 

I'm also letting you know that I enjoy carriers. I play to win which may not always please you because it doesn't coincide with how great I should be or where I should be at any given moment. I have great days and I have okay days.

Teams - stop showing your broadsides. Anticipate torps. Do NOT make yourself a low-hanging fruit for the red team!  Especially their carrier. STOP OVEREXTENDING. And - know when enough is enough. When you are winning with only a couple minutes maximum remaining, stop shouting "here I am" with your main batteries! Regroup, stay stealthy and WIN. 

BTW - The opposing Midway took out five ships.I was in the Audacious, only managed two. Good job Rio____. Now - tier X battles can be ridiculously boring or extremely fast moving. This match was both.

Finally... You have to keep eyes on the mini-map. You must. In all tiers, train yourself to drive by the mini-map. Do it. Be happy. :cap_horn::cap_like::cap_haloween:

 

Im not Anti CV.

As a DD only player i dislike how CVs can affect a game to the level it does. 

It eliminates the usefulness my class has. 

 

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3 hours ago, Herr_Reitz said:

Teams - stop showing your broadsides. Anticipate torps. Do NOT make yourself a low-hanging fruit for the red team!  Especially their carrier. STOP OVEREXTENDING. And - know when enough is enough. When you are winning with only a couple minutes maximum remaining, stop shouting "here I am" with your main batteries! Regroup, stay stealthy and WIN. 

........

Finally... You have to keep eyes on the mini-map. You must.

This^....if one tenth of my random teammates would know this.........

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3 hours ago, Sir_Orrin said:

Listen, we CV players can carry *to an extent* but our team has to get us to that point first. Can I finish off 2-3 low HP ships to win a match? Sure. Can I carry a team that has lost miserably, and is down 5 ships and 300 points? NO! of course I can't. Sure CVs have tactical advantages and flexibility, but they have to rely on the team like everyone else. 

Exactly.

Most CV whiners are still under the impression that CVs can single-handedly turn the tide of the match. They still think that CVs can easily stop a group of enemy ships that has destroyed most (if not all) the allied ships in one flank and prevent them from advancing further.

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Everybody wanted this new meta right?

Blob up, oh great that sure to stagnate 

 Hey don't take that cap unless the cruisers move up to support you, lol in randoms yeh right

 Don't go alone grab a buddy, oh wait this is random still i forgot  I should expect good teamwork from random players that im not talking to,  Dang a person I was hoping to protect me under his AA bubble just turn around and ran ugh

 Maybe I should just say  Bye Felicia to everybody that keeps quitting this game Because we know we're gonna have experienced quality players replace them

GG :CV:

 

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2 minutes ago, silverdahc said:

Everybody wanted this new meta right?

Blob up, oh great that sure to stagnate 

 Hey don't take that cap unless the cruisers move up to support you, lol in randoms yeh right

 Don't go alone grab a buddy, oh wait this is random still i forgot  I should expect good teamwork from random players that im not talking to,  Dang a person I was hoping to protect me under his AA bubble just turn around and ran ugh

 Maybe I should just say  Bye Felicia to everybody that keeps quitting this game Because we know we're gonna have experienced quality players replace them

GG :CV:

 

I thought you already quit

Why are you still here spewing out the same vitirol

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15 hours ago, RyuuohD_NA said:

I thought you already quit

Why are you still here spewing out the same vitirol

 I never said I quit

I'm overcoming and adapting I play cruisers now that aren't really affected by carriers in the game but I do so enjoy watching my fellow teammates getting mauled out there constantly while i sit in my nice protected cruiser raining HE for everybody's enjoyment

 And why do I keep raining on your parade because you keep telling me it's fine out there  But in my opinion it's not you want to voice your opinion so do I

Edited by silverdahc
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So true OP.

After months some players still like to point their finger after a personally poor performance or from the bulk of the team squarely at the carriers.

Very easy to pick on the new kid.

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CV's can only carry a game if the red team is either:

  • Ignorant (to the CV as a whole and refuse to adapt);
  • Stupid (running off solo and thinking the CV won't notice);
  • Not doing what they are supposed to be doing (CA/L's not positioning sensibly where their AA is going to act as discouragement).

I don't know what DD's thought it was like before but any CV player worth their salt would kill a DD as soon as their aircraft were in the air. If they didn't kill it than it was heavily crippled. Wargaming is proposing adding a prep timer for the first launch and I think that's fine. Originally it took CV's 2 minutes to have everything in the sky so what's a 45 second delay really? Gives you time to move the ship somewhere so autopilot can't screw it up. The big problem is that DD players will rejoice and continue to be silly which ultimately ends up with a 45 second delay not only to the CV's launch times but to a DD's imminent demise. Nothing will change.

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4 hours ago, Sir_Orrin said:

Listen, we CV players can carry *to an extent* but our team has to get us to that point first. Can I finish off 2-3 low HP ships to win a match? Sure. Can I carry a team that has lost miserably, and is down 5 ships and 300 points? NO! of course I can't. Sure CVs have tactical advantages and flexibility, but they have to rely on the team like everyone else. 

This.

Did I say THIS???

Be nice if more understood it.

Carrier can carry until its back breaks, but if everyone else dies like dogs and acomplishes nothing, all that effort is pointless.

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Not surprising considering the vision control CV's add to the game.  Kill securing is also very important.

In non-CV games, the outcome is almost entirely on the performance of your DD's.  This, also, due to vision control.  You can almost predict with 70-80% certainty which team will lose the game by who loses the first DD.

No class can carry entirely.  I had a 7 kill game once in a division where my teammate had 4 kills.  We still lost.  When potatoes be potating you just get boiled along with 'em no matter how hard you try.

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7 hours ago, Herr_Reitz said:

Worked my buns off to support a team that was very, very adept at losing. You know, the usual stuff. We were in the lead near the end and within one minute I hear "You are the last hope!"

What the heck?! One minute or less? Of course I'm facing a carrier, bb and cruiser. First Blood, Gearing (18K) and  DesMoines (15K) destroyed. A GK(32K) and Azuma(9K) damage on top of that so it's yea, weak but come on... I finished 2nd on the team by less than 200 points. 

One of those who died so quickly at the end then says in all chat, "I really hate how game outcomes depends on the carriers now." All I could respond was, "me too". Don't know if it was directed at me or the Midway. But seriously? 

Look folks - don't go round pointing fingers at carriers as THE factor in a win or loss. Go look in the mirror.

This anti-cv stuff has GOT to stop. It's not good for the game. It's a crutch, an excuse, a free-pass so some think.

Personally looking forward to the RUBB's arriving. All you anti-cv folks can pitch a beach about them next, eh? OP? Stalinium? UnFAIR? Or will it be, "I hate paper ships"? 

I'm also letting you know that I enjoy carriers. I play to win which may not always please you because it doesn't coincide with how great I should be or where I should be at any given moment. I have great days and I have okay days.

Teams - stop showing your broadsides. Anticipate torps. Do NOT make yourself a low-hanging fruit for the red team!  Especially their carrier. STOP OVEREXTENDING. And - know when enough is enough. When you are winning with only a couple minutes maximum remaining, stop shouting "here I am" with your main batteries! Regroup, stay stealthy and WIN. 

BTW - The opposing Midway took out five ships.I was in the Audacious, only managed two. Good job Rio____. Now - tier X battles can be ridiculously boring or extremely fast moving. This match was both.

Finally... You have to keep eyes on the mini-map. You must. In all tiers, train yourself to drive by the mini-map. Do it. Be happy. :cap_horn::cap_like::cap_haloween:

 

Some of my better games are where I am in the middle of the leader board for the game, it means I spent more time doing the little things.  Cleaning up low health ships so they don't come back to haunt the team.  Seen too much of that.

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Basically, the game is becoming less fun every day. Something new happen that caused it. I wonder what it could be.

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6 hours ago, Toxic_Masculinity said:

Im not Anti CV.

As a DD only player i dislike how CVs can affect a game to the level it does. 

It eliminates the usefulness my class has. 

 

You are playing a class that CV's in general are a soft counter towards, some CV's are better at it than others, of course it will lessen the impact you have on the match. I would argue that radar is harder on DD's than CV's simply because its everywhere at high tiers. If there were no CV's, DD's would become (return to being?) the dominant class of ship in a match, not by damage or by capping ability but a well played DD will decide the outcome of a game.

Many players know this and its one of many reasons why DD's are target #1 for CV's.

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8 hours ago, Herr_Reitz said:

You must. In all tiers, train yourself to drive by the mini-map. Do it. Be happy.

this one tip alone will double your skill at the helm.

 

3 hours ago, silverdahc said:

because you keep telling me it's fine out there 

I understand your frustration but you just keep ignoring (that tiny little fraction of the player base) those who are having fun.......big fun!

I think there are many more people having fun out there than you think. They are just staying silent because they hate being bashed all day by the CV haters. They just put on the earphones, put on a smile,  double click 3 and enjoy the scenery.

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