Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
Addison_Wang

Saipan Shenanigans and Proposed CV Delay

15 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

17
[KSD]
Members
61 posts
13,500 battles

First off, been having some fun with the Saipan. Moved on from the Enterprise cause I hit 40 battles and got on the leaderboards. This bote tho...definitely the least forgiving but has the highest potential. 

8C84A240-97A7-4E88-B9B6-965CBF0385E2.thumb.jpeg.5fd74cb2a47ddbb3df8670bc38613a72.jpeg

Mfw it’s basically outperforming my Midway 

56ACBB26-3A25-426E-A80B-9CDF8A1C9614.thumb.jpeg.fe00734ef8ed6307736b5f27a5b64580.jpeg

D45D2E41-B2B7-443B-88BC-A319B5CCEE05.thumb.jpeg.e57753a99db130d9a7ba574cd9e354c7.jpeg

Okay now on to the proposed CV start delay. I understand what they’re trying to do - limit initial spotting and allow DDs more freedom in the beginning of the match and allow BBs and crusiers the chance to find each other and get their AA auras to overlap. In theory this seems like a beneficial change. From my experience, I just don’t believe it will have the desired effect. 

With the advent of this change, most DDs would be more emboldened to contest caps and play more or less like they do if there were no CV (this is ofc an opinion). When I play CVs I usually don’t go for DDs as my first target. I may drop a fighter over them to keep them spotted but that’s it really, at least initially. With this change however, since the BBs would’ve gotten the chance to hug their AA crusier waifus and DDs would’ve isolated themselves even more (and given their position away by contesting), I might be more inclined to “bonk the DD, win the video game” as a clan mate often puts it. After the initial wave, everything else plays out just like a normal battle.

Now I’m not saying that this isn’t a step in the right direction. The amount of spotting that a CV can do now is second only to the RTS version. There’s definitely still some work to be done and we need to take it upon ourselves to inform WeeGee on ways to improve the game (instead of the pointless whining that pollutes the forums today). Balancing while maintaining interest in the class is going to be tough - if anyone has any ideas on how to do so, feel free to comment. 

Some ideas of mine: 

1) WeeGee has made a bunch of those instructional videos about game mechanics. It wouldn’t hurt to make a video on ways to counter CV play. I’m talking about toggling AA on and off for DDs, overlapping AA auras, and abuse of island mechanics. 

2) Instead of a delay of the ship appearing for other teammates like the current radar mechanic, introduce a delay for the player that’s piloting the planes. What I mean by this is if a ship is within air spotting distance, their icon shows up on the mini map but you won’t have vision of the ship itself for say 2 or 3 seconds. This might aid in DD survivability so they have an opportunity to turn off their AA if they didn’t notice the planes before, and forces the CV to loop around instead of attacking right away. This is a rather drastic change, but one that I know as a CV player I can overcome. Any thoughts on this change? 

Again please feel free to voice your opinions on potential ways to balance the gameplay between CVs/surface ships while maintaining interest. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,121
[WOLF7]
Members
12,189 posts

So, one of the main reasons WG put out the rework was to balance out game play, yet you top players are still walking all over people? And the average damage numbers are down, which seems to say that the skill gap is even wider than before.....:Smile_amazed:

Working as intended? :Smile_sceptic:

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17
[KSD]
Members
61 posts
13,500 battles
3 minutes ago, awiggin said:

So, one of the main reasons WG put out the rework was to balance out game play, yet you top players are still walking all over people? And the average damage numbers are down, which seems to say that the skill gap is even wider than before.....:Smile_amazed:

Working as intended? :Smile_sceptic:

I do not deny that the skill gap in CV players is as wide as ever, if not wider than it was in RTS carriers. From the CV perspective, at least a better CV player can’t shut out a less skilled one. From the surface ship POV, it’s a different story. That’s the issue with introducing a high skill floor class (comparatively). Do you have any suggestions on ways to fix it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
387
[INR]
Members
1,224 posts
4,060 battles
48 minutes ago, Addison_Wang said:

Instead of a delay of the ship appearing for other teammates like the current radar mechanic, introduce a delay for the player that’s piloting the planes.

This would be problematic. There are plenty of CLs and CAs with AA ranges equal to their air detection radii. This would result in planes getting shot at and being unable to see the ship shooting at them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,977
[HYDRO]
Members
3,560 posts
5,062 battles

As someone playing constantly DDs after the rework I see little point in the delay. When you consider that for a DD to even approach a cap it can take close to a minute, even a 45 second delay in launching planes doesn't matter much. In fact I feel this will give DDs a false sense of security that they should cap immediately.

In the CV side you start the battle, put a waypoint for the autopilot and stare at the screen for 45secs if tier X. To me it just adds to the frustration of both sides.

Edited by warheart1992

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17
[KSD]
Members
61 posts
13,500 battles
8 minutes ago, warheart1992 said:

In fact I feel this will give DDs a false sense of security that they should cap immediately.

My point exactly, so it’s not just my opinion then 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17
[KSD]
Members
61 posts
13,500 battles
10 minutes ago, WuYixiang said:

This would be problematic. There are plenty of CLs and CAs with AA ranges equal to their air detection radii. This would result in planes getting shot at and being unable to see the ship shooting at them.

Well, I wouldn’t be going after these ships unless I had to. Besides the mini map itself is enough for me to aim plus enough warning for me to turn away. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
98
[RQL]
Members
322 posts
8,361 battles

This will be another "Look we did something" without actually doing anything meaningful. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,751
[EGIRL]
Beta Testers
4,340 posts
13,110 battles
1 hour ago, awiggin said:

So, one of the main reasons WG put out the rework was to balance out game play, yet you top players are still walking all over people? And the average damage numbers are down, which seems to say that the skill gap is even wider than before.....:Smile_amazed:

Working as intended? :Smile_sceptic:

In old system the best cv can literaly stop the red cv from do anything and overcontrol the match.

In this new system the "skill gap" between 2 cvs is how farm more dmg faster.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
487
[O7]
[O7]
Beta Testers
1,566 posts
9,367 battles
56 minutes ago, Addison_Wang said:

2) Instead of a delay of the ship appearing for other teammates like the current radar mechanic, introduce a delay for the player that’s piloting the planes. What I mean by this is if a ship is within air spotting distance, their icon shows up on the mini map but you won’t have vision of the ship itself for say 2 or 3 seconds. This might aid in DD survivability so they have an opportunity to turn off their AA if they didn’t notice the planes before, and forces the CV to loop around instead of attacking right away. This is a rather drastic change, but one that I know as a CV player I can overcome. Any thoughts on this change? 

Again please feel free to voice your opinions on potential ways to balance the gameplay between CVs/surface ships while maintaining interest. 

I have knocked this idea around on a couple threads already and it has merit. One of the biggest problems dds have right now in a heavy CV meta is that they just take way too much damage early on in the game. I can't say how many games I've seen where the DD has been knocked down 10k+ health within the first 2 minutes of the game by the CV.

shot-19_04.20_01_12.19-0819.thumb.jpg.db803dd9e4c1300cf7bd0fe66c031435.jpg

 

Look at that poor Gearing, hasn't even left spawn yet and he's down by that much, he didn't even get to spawn near an AA cruiser. Didn't help that the entire enemy team was shooting him following that, think he got knocked down to half health before the game even really began. That's not fun but it's fairly commonplace nowadays. Even with spotting nerfs, even with targeting nerfs CVs can still get huge damage numbers on DDs consistently that just were not possible under the RTS style. (Unless you knew how to cross drop, but even DFAA could mess that up sometimes). I see it all the time and I do it myself too when I'm in CV, it's not hard if you know what you are doing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
487
[O7]
[O7]
Beta Testers
1,566 posts
9,367 battles
4 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

In old system the best cv can literaly stop the red cv from do anything and overcontrol the match.

In this new system the "skill gap" between 2 cvs is how farm more dmg faster.

Yep, pretty much. I used to always check the stats of the opposing CV player before a game started. If he was good I was going to have a hard time, if he was a potato, well happy days were to be had. Or I just played Air Superior Ranger when that was a thing and just stomp on everyone regardless. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
109 posts
4,719 battles

I'm with you on the delay in terms of thinking it won't have the desired effect.

I think it'll actually make me a BETTER CV. I won't be rushing to spot the first DD, etc., but can instead wait (with no alternative) to see where my team goes and where the enemy starts popping up. Then, when I DO take off, the enemy is even closer for me to spot. The extra time to plan my game without the pressure to insta-spot the enemy team will, for my playstyle/temperament, only mean I do better.

Honestly, I think about the only big change I think we NEED would be to remove constant spotting ability from fighters. Makes it too easy for me to drop one on top of a DD for my team to kill or for me to lazily spin around and line up a solid attack. Maybe slap the same delay on "true" spotting for the whole team so I'm somewhat less effective as a spot damage farmer (but also make spotting damage worth more XP-wise).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,977
[HYDRO]
Members
3,560 posts
5,062 battles
23 minutes ago, Addison_Wang said:

My point exactly, so it’s not just my opinion then 

You are the CV mastermind, you tell me :Smile_teethhappy:. On a large map, how long does it take for your attack planes with normal speed to reach a cap? By my experience in a DD, after about a minute you are just approaching the borders of a cap. So by the 45 second delay it will still be long until a DD manages to secure a cap. And if they want to smoke up then they  are just asking for  torps and radar.

Edited by warheart1992

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17
[KSD]
Members
61 posts
13,500 battles
Just now, warheart1992 said:

You are the CV mastermind, you tell me :Smile_teethhappy:. On a large map, how long does it take for your attack planes with normal speed to reach a cap? By my experience in a DD, after about a minute you are just approaching the borders of a cap. So by the 45 second delay it will still be long until a DD manages to secure a cap. And if they want to smoke up then they ask for torps and radar.

With the speed of high tier rocket planes, if I’m actively trying to find a DD (which I usually don’t), I spot them about halfway from their spawn to the cap. A 45sec delay will probably get them about 20-30 secs of cap contest before I reset them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,977
[HYDRO]
Members
3,560 posts
5,062 battles
2 minutes ago, Addison_Wang said:

With the speed of high tier rocket planes, if I’m actively trying to find a DD (which I usually don’t), I spot them about halfway from their spawn to the cap. A 45sec delay will probably get them about 20-30 secs of cap contest before I reset them.

Yup, and all this provided the red DD completely disregards the cap. The more and more I think about it, the more it sounds like more of a placebo change. Dunno really by that point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×