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Kizarvexis

Is WoWs approaching balance?

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Seems like every class is kvetching about some other class. Is WoWs approaching balance among all the classes?

 

Ding, ding... ready?.... fight!  :Smile_teethhappy:

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You know Kiz, I was about to laugh at you. But, whilst certain ships are still strong, it is possible that types as a whole are in a stronger ‘balance of terror’ situation than has been the case in a while.

I still think DD torps need either a bit more speed or a bit less detection, possibly a touch more range at high tiers with radar, but for the most part these are minor quibbles. 

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Not even bloody close just played My FDG hit Bismarck midships 3.3 km he was stationary and got 1650 HP WG keeps saying theyll adjust if needed all the German BBs are bottom of the Stats tables and it a bloody joke! 

 

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10 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

You know Kiz, I was about to laugh at you. But, whilst certain ships are still strong, it is possible that types as a whole are in a stronger ‘balance of terror’ situation than has been the case in a while.

I still think DD torps need either a bit more speed or a bit less detection, possibly a touch more range at high tiers with radar, but for the most part these are minor quibbles. 

Well, the post was kinda funny, but a little bit serious as well. 

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Lol. Cruiser mains dont seem to be complaining enough....

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5 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

Lol. Cruiser mains dont seem to be complaining enough....

I dunno. I see a lot of Wooster mains complaining that CVs can still scratch their paint.

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1 hour ago, Kizarvexis said:

Seems like every class is kvetching about some other class. Is WoWs approaching balance among all the classes?

Not sure about that, but I reckon some forumites in all types are rapidly approaching the critical mass for Total Brain Detonation. Get the mop and bucket, Kiz; it's gonna be messy.

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2 hours ago, Kizarvexis said:

Seems like every class is kvetching about some other class. Is WoWs approaching balance among all the classes?

 

Ding, ding... ready?.... fight!  :Smile_teethhappy:

How would we know if it's balanced or not? I've been working under the assumption that CV play will slow down to 1 per game or maybe 1 per game ever two or three games. As it stands now, we have 4 per game in everything but T10. If CV use isn't going to drop, then no, I don't see how this can be considered balanced. But it's a moving dart board if CV use is expected to fall back to something like "normal".

 

 

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I suppose it depends on which balance you're after.

I know my games played per day/week/month are way down as well as my spending.  That could be life and financial balance.

I don't pay nearly as much attention to events and just quietly grind away at the tech trees.  That could be balance.

The ship classes all seem to have faults and shortcomings and Captains that seem to think Wargaming has it out for them.  That could be the balance you're looking for.

Most people don't seem to want balance even as they shout about it though.  Balance is another word for average and average means you lose as much as you win and that you have to work and to try.  It seems that many that argue for balance really just want an easy button.  At least that is the way it seems to me.

Keep your powder dry Captains!

:cap_book:

 

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27 minutes ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

Not sure about that, but I reckon some forumites in all types are rapidly approaching the critical mass for Total Brain Detonation. Get the mop and bucket, Kiz; it's gonna be messy.

:Smile_teethhappy:

 

7 minutes ago, Grflrgl said:

How would we know if it's balanced or not? I've been working under the assumption that CV play will slow down to 1 per game or maybe 1 per game ever two or three games. As it stands now, we have 4 per game in everything but T10. If CV use isn't going to drop, then no, I don't see how this can be considered balanced. But it's a moving dart board if CV use is expected to fall back to something like "normal".

Well since the RTS could have two CVs on at a time, I don't see WG going for only 1 CV per battle. Especially with the upcoming planned flight delay at the start of battle (8.4-ish so May 22nd-ish).

T4 CVs - 0 second delay

T6 CVs - 15 second delay

T8 CVs - 30 second delay

T10 CVs - 45 second delay

 

 

6 minutes ago, Gunga_Dinner said:

I suppose it depends on which balance you're after.

I know my games played per day/week/month are way down as well as my spending.  That could be life and financial balance.

I don't pay nearly as much attention to events and just quietly grind away at the tech trees.  That could be balance.

The ship classes all seem to have faults and shortcomings and Captains that seem to think Wargaming has it out for them.  That could be the balance you're looking for.

Most people don't seem to want balance even as they shout about it though.  Balance is another word for average and average means you lose as much as you win and that you have to work and to try.  It seems that many that argue for balance really just want an easy button.  At least that is the way it seems to me.

Keep your powder dry Captains!

:cap_book:

 

Happy TimeTM is over for everyone. Time to buckle down for the fight. :Smile_izmena:

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1 minute ago, Kizarvexis said:

:Smile_teethhappy:

 

Well since the RTS could have two CVs on at a time, I don't see WG going for only 1 CV per battle. Especially with the upcoming planned flight delay at the start of battle (8.4-ish so May 22nd-ish).

T4 CVs - 0 second delay

T6 CVs - 15 second delay

T8 CVs - 30 second delay

T10 CVs - 45 second delay

 

 

Happy TimeTM is over for everyone. Time to buckle down for the fight. :Smile_izmena:

That wasn't actually what I was getting at. True, the 2 CVs per side has been around a long time. But by some accounts there were only 2.5% of the playerbase using CVs in the RTS days, and now we have 7+% (yes, it depends on which numbers you look at, I know, but work with me here...). 

 

What I'm getting it is this - should we expect the number of CV players/games played to remain at around the 7% range, or should we expect it to fall to <5% at some point? I think that's a critical question right now. If you have 2 CVs per team in 3% of the games it's one thing, if you have 1 CV per team in 15% of your games, it's something entirely different. And right now, from my recent experience, it's been 100% of games have 2 CVs. So how can we tell where balance exists if we don't know where the CV rates are expected to land?

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2 hours ago, Kizarvexis said:

Seems like every class is kvetching about some other class. Is WoWs approaching balance among all the classes?

 

Ding, ding... ready?.... fight!  :Smile_teethhappy:

Because we have CV's in the game the answer is NO!

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1 minute ago, Grflrgl said:

That wasn't actually what I was getting at. True, the 2 CVs per side has been around a long time. But by some accounts there were only 2.5% of the playerbase using CVs in the RTS days, and now we have 7+% (yes, it depends on which numbers you look at, I know, but work with me here...). 

 

What I'm getting it is this - should we expect the number of CV players/games played to remain at around the 7% range, or should we expect it to fall to <5% at some point? I think that's a critical question right now. If you have 2 CVs per team in 3% of the games it's one thing, if you have 1 CV per team in 15% of your games, it's something entirely different. And right now, from my recent experience, it's been 100% of games have 2 CVs. So how can we tell where balance exists if we don't know where the CV rates are expected to land?

Don't forget that the CV rework is new and people play the new stuff. Also premium CVs came back on sale for the first time in a year, so there was a lot of pent up demand. People are playing the new toy they just bought.

RU BBs will be early access starting Wednesday it looks like and the full line drops on May 22nd-ish if the schedule holds. Then it will be Stalinium-pocalypse time and the torches and pitch forks will be out for BBs. Some time in the fall, French DDs should drop and everyone will be out over DDs. It's the ebb and flow of the salt ocean, water not needed. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

3 minutes ago, kgh52 said:

Because we have CV's in the game the answer is NO!

Just seems like every class is pissed because their class is not on top for one reason or another. So things are probably fairly balanced. :Smile_teethhappy:

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So, do we even know what Balance is? We talk a lot about it, but what would a perfectly balanced WOWS look like? Seems like we have to know what we're aiming for before deciding if we're getting there.

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Just now, AJTP89 said:

So, do we even know what Balance is? We talk a lot about it, but what would a perfectly balanced WOWS look like? Seems like we have to know what we're aiming for before deciding if we're getting there.

Everyone complaining that they have been nerf'd into the ground? If so, WoWs is balanced. :Smile_teethhappy:

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No.

I don't believe the game is bad but 2 things need to be addressed for balance (IMO):

1. Balance for me is trying to make a good game, in any ship type, give an equal XP/credit pay out. That means you carry out your role in a DD or BB, then you get the same reward as a good game in a CA or CV (vice versa etc).

2. Having a game that allows you to survive into game as much as any other ship type. Any player that picks any ship should have an equal chance of 'fun and engaging' gameplay i.e. surviving into the game.

Only problem with the above is that, although fair, it does not take into account WGs need to appease the majority of the players who come to this game. One ship type draws more in, earns more, and therefore needs to be catered for. :Smile_honoring:

Edited by _WaveRider_

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3 hours ago, Taichunger said:

Lol. Cruiser mains dont seem to be complaining enough....

I’d complain but I just don’t know what ‘main’ I am. 

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6 minutes ago, ClassicLib said:

I’d complain but I just don’t know what ‘main’ I am. 

Looks like cruiser, but you are fairly balanced. I'm roughly the same in co-op,  but in PvP I'm pretty much balanced between cruisers and battleships.

ClassicLib main.JPG

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1 minute ago, Kizarvexis said:

Looks like cruiser, but you are fairly balanced. I'm roughly the same in co-op,  but in PvP I'm pretty much balanced between cruisers and battleships.

ClassicLib main.JPG

Noice...

What am I?

Balanced or unhinged?

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2 minutes ago, swifttex1 said:

Noice...

What am I?

Balanced or unhinged?

you are pretty balanced as well.

 

swifttex1 main.JPG

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3 minutes ago, swifttex1 said:

Thank you!

If you go to the main page, you can click players and see your stats. That is where I got the graphic from.

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1 hour ago, Grflrgl said:

How would we know if it's balanced or not? I've been working under the assumption that CV play will slow down to 1 per game or maybe 1 per game ever two or three games. As it stands now, we have 4 per game in everything but T10. If CV use isn't going to drop, then no, I don't see how this can be considered balanced. But it's a moving dart board if CV use is expected to fall back to something like "normal".

See how it is in 8.4, when they have new BB toys to play with.  Then I think CVs will fall back some.  I doubt they'll go as far back as they did in RTS days, unless they nerf CVs further into the ground.

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4 hours ago, swifttex1 said:

Noice...

What am I?

Balanced or unhinged?

Yes

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