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Sumseaman

How to kill DDs with CVs using RPF....Should it be removed?

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I responded to a thread not so long ago regarding the topic of whether RPF should still be removed from CVs. I did suggest it could be too powerful not only as a tracking but also a preliminary aiming tool (similar to DDs with torps). I was flamed for suggesting with claims that it should be altered in line with the general player base, not unicums. At over a little over 2k battles I am a very average player though I thought I would jump in a CV (match dated today) and compile some quick footage of what I meant.

Two clips are featured, the first of the initial attack aircraft run using RPF on what I suspected (and proven right) to be DDs approaching a cap with AA switched off. The second is using RPF to finish off the DD who was hiding in smoke with TBs. You'll note that even before the DD is spotted you can begin an attack run (especially so with attack aircraft who now have a buffer from initiating to firing) then by the time spotting is achieved you are ready to fire. With the TBs adjustments on the drop can also be made last minute (as you can see in the second clip where I widen the spread to gain a hit). I destroyed I believe 3 of 4 of the DDs.

Do I think RPF should still be removed? It is very useful for carriers in this regard though I'll throw that one out there. I posted match results too where it was a tier X game, in the Enterprise under heavy AA most of the time. It wasn't the best effort (and a loss) though perhaps it illustrates how RPF can best be utilised and, if it stays, how other CV players can easily do it. 

 

45.jpg

46.jpg

Edited by Sumseaman
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RPF is too powerful for CV planes.

They should make it based on direction from the ship not the planes.

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I think that RPF is a useful gadget for carriers and nothing should be done about it until carriers have been effectively balanced.

Note the skill is level 4, doesn't break the game, and can be spoofed.

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Just now, cavscout1739 said:

Note the skill is level 4

Sorry what's skill level 4?

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Just now, Sumseaman said:

Sorry what's skill level 4?

Or

it takes 4 points to get it, assuming you did 1, 2, and 3 skill levels first.

Substitute 'tier' for level

Or substite 'tiera' for Tier. I like Tierras.

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4 minutes ago, cavscout1739 said:

and can be spoofed.

How can you spoof direction finding if the planes fly direct down the bearing?  Engine boost doesn't get you up to 150+ knots

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well its a 4 points skills... also "woa you did 1.8k dmg with rockets in the first video, very op, more 10hours you can kill the dd its not amazing?!"

Its a waste of 4 points for carriers... a basic know about look the minimap you can deal easy with dds.

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3 minutes ago, cavscout1739 said:

Or

it takes 4 points to get it, assuming you did 1, 2, and 3 skill levels first.

Substitute 'tier' for level

Or substite 'tiera' for Tier. I like Tierras.

Oh yes. Very true. It's one of only two you would choose for carriers for 4 pts I'd say.

Edited by Sumseaman

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1 minute ago, Camo68 said:

How can you spoof direction finding if the planes fly direct down the bearing?  Engine boost doesn't get you up to 150+ knots

For the last destroyer on the map, or the lone wolf harassing your flank, not much they can do. But baiting your flight into an AA cruiser, that's just a variation on a theme.

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1 minute ago, HyenaHiena said:

well its a 4 points skills... also "woa you did 1.8k dmg with rockets in the first video, very op, more 10hours you can kill the dd its not amazing?!"

Its a waste of 4 points for carriers... a basic know about look the minimap you can deal easy with dds.

I might not choose RDF for myself, but in certain instances it will be a force multiplier for your ship (or planes).

the damage values for plane ordinance and the sighting mechanic are still being fiddled with. That being the case, getting back on heading after overflying the destroyer and losing sight because they switched their AA off, or the concealment buff that destroyers got for themselves and their fish, against aircraft means that RDF is just leveling the playing field.

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11 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

well its a 4 points skills... also "woa you did 1.8k dmg with rockets in the first video, very op, more 10hours you can kill the dd its not amazing?!"

Its a waste of 4 points for carriers... a basic know about look the minimap you can deal easy with dds.

I only showed the clips to demonstrate the aiming method with RPF to show I never had the DD in sight when I began the attack runs as it was my sole point of reference. I didn't want to bore everyone with the whole clip. I think despite the loss the results speak for themselves. The bulk of the damage I did was to the DDs. What does 'more 10hours you kill the dd its not amazing?!' mean? Gibberish.

Also if it's such a waste why is there a proposal for it to be removed?

Edited by Sumseaman

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25 minutes ago, cavscout1739 said:

For the last destroyer on the map, or the lone wolf harassing your flank, not much they can do. But baiting your flight into an AA cruiser, that's just a variation on a theme.

The problem with that strategy is that it leads to no scouting and no contesting of caps making games more stagnant.

The last thing that is needed in high tiers is DDs joining the BBs & CAs camping in spawn

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20 minutes ago, Sumseaman said:

I only showed the clips to demonstrate the aiming method with RPF to show I never had the DD in sight when I began the attack runs as it was my sole point of reference. I didn't want to bore everyone with the whole clip. I think despite the loss the results speak for themselves. The bulk of the damage I did was to the DDs. What does 'more 10hours you kill the dd its not amazing?!' mean? Gibberish.

Also if it's such a waste why is there a proposal for it to be removed?

For make the newbies cvs life a bit more dificult? I mean, its easy spot a dd if you have experience, the RPF just help newbies for that.

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12 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

For make the newbies cvs life a bit more dificult? I mean, its easy spot a dd if you have experience, the RPF just help newbies for that.

So you're saying that WG simply wants to remove it to make the life of new CV players more difficult? I'm just going on the dev blogs in regard to saying that it's basically going at this stage. Really that's the reason?

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It's quite literally an IJN CV's only hope of being able to damage DDs. Between the torpedo nerfs, the rocket nerfs, and the air detectable buffs how else are they supposed to fight them? 

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33 minutes ago, Gavroche_ said:

I use it in literally none of my CVs.

When I first saw Farazelleth using RPF I thought “what idiot thought this was a good idea?”  However, testing it proved not so useful. If rockets reliably damaged DDs it would be awful for DDs. 

The 4 skill points are better spent elsewhere. Just using the detected indicator lets you find DDs, especially when you get the hang of flying on oblique vectors. 

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It is being removed anyway, so your best off learning how to find a DD without it, otherwise you will be behind the 8 ball when it does go, and besides it should never have been on the planes to start with, and players shouldn't get a located icon either as they have invested nothing into the points

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14 minutes ago, CriMiNaL__ said:

It is being removed anyway, so your best off learning how to find a DD without it, otherwise you will be behind the 8 ball when it does go, and besides it should never have been on the planes to start with, and players shouldn't get a located icon either as they have invested nothing into the points

I suppose again what I was trying to point out is its usefulness as a preliminary aiming measure. I mean you basically already know where the DD is but don't have time to line up an attack once they are spotted. Oh well as you say it's going so best adopt other tactics. I know I have in anticipation of this.

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RPF never should have worked based on the position of squadrons, and should only track from the position of the carrier itself. Even as someone who has spent the majority of their time in CVs since the rework, I find the implementation of RPF on squadrons to be absurdly unfair to destroyers.

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24 minutes ago, SkaerKrow said:

RPF never should have worked based on the position of squadrons, and should only track from the position of the carrier itself. Even as someone who has spent the majority of their time in CVs since the rework, I find the implementation of RPF on squadrons to be absurdly unfair to destroyers.

To be honest yes after what I did to those DDs in that match I also support its removal. Late game it's devastating and as I tried to show it is still rather nasty earlier on.

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13 hours ago, Camo68 said:

The problem with that strategy is that it leads to no scouting and no contesting of caps making games more stagnant.

The last thing that is needed in high tiers is DDs joining the BBs & CAs camping in spawn

Dd survivability past 5 or 10 minutes should be a selfish priority for all destroyers. Throughout the match, controlling the sight environment reduces the ability of the enemy to reposition, or simply flank. Challenging cap is as easy as seeing the enemy ship and then plinking him with hundreds of rounds.

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11 hours ago, Sumseaman said:

To be honest yes after what I did to those DDs in that match I also support its removal. Late game it's devastating and as I tried to show it is still rather nasty earlier on.

Let's make it easier for a late game destroyer to hunt your carrier down because you didn't see any trace of it on the map and your planes didn't fly over its obscenely small concealment value. But whatever. If you feel that destroyers should be able to walk up to you, with their RDF, who am I to complain?

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You don't really need RPF on a CV, unlike other ships, because the airplanes fly at around 4x~6x the speed of the DD.

This means that you can simply comb the area where your aircraft are being spotted.

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Hasn't this already been mentioned as being removed in upcoming  patch?   

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