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Ducky_shot

The dangerous road of bait and switch.

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Since the removal of OWSF which screwed a many a DD I purchased I have received Alabama and Asashio from SCs and Huanghe from the event container. Those are just the ones I remember and excluding mission related ships.

Stop buying them is the point. Or accept that they are murky in the sale and adjustment of ships.

Edited by _Caliph_
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19 minutes ago, Ducky_shot said:

So WG is talking about moving the OP Guilio Cesare from t5 to t6 as is. I think this is an extremely dangerous road for them to go down. They say compensation will be provided in the firm of doubloons, not the real money many people spent on this ship in the year and a half its been in the game. 

While I want to see OP ships be able to stay in the game, it's not like they pulled it from sale after many people pointed it out shortly after release. 

1. They did a poor job of balancing it and in fact IIRC, they buffed it once or twice after release. That's fine, it happens... 

2. Even though it was apparent to many people that it was OP (I have a thread with detailed analysis from November of 2017) they continued to bait people into buying it by leaving it in the game as the overpowered monster it was. 

3. Now, once they've made the majority of their money on it they want to do their job and finally balance it properly. But there is no recourse for the player, they don't get their money back even though WG is complicit in leaving it for sale in an OP state. 

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to see OP ships that have to be pulled from the game, but this was apparent to anyone with any analytic sense a good 15 months ago. If it's OP, pull it from sale, don't blatantly bait and switch. 

The problem is, is that this now gives WG free reign to do a sloppy job on releasing premium ships. "We'll just get all of our money first and then balance it in line" and honestly, this would not be an issue if they offered cash back to players. I like that they endeavor to keep premium ships competitive and buff them when needed and I like seeing OP ships get a second chance at staying in the game. But don't do it after blatantly sucking up players money for an OP ship for 16 months. Make the admission early and own up to it. 

You still keep the ship what is your concern?  Its now t6 where it more fits.

CLEARLY its OP when your targets can be t3 Tenryu and t3 South Carolina or T3 Kawachi.   But at t6 you can fight t5 Texas or t7 Nagato. Which the Giulio would fit between nicely.  How does the regular player feel seeing a t5 Giulio going " dang i should not have tried out my T4 Phoenix."

Its not unwarranted nor never happen before they took my OP t6 cleveland put her in t8 where she is decent.  She was super OP with Defensive AA against T456 carriers lol.

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Not to mention T6 already has pretty solid Warspite and Arizona, I would not spend the money on GC if it was T6.  I would not spend money on Saipan and Kaga if they were T8 either, constantly ending up as bottom tier in T10 games is highly detrimental to the value of the ship.  The only two reasons I did not return those yet is that I don’t need the doubloons, and it’s nice to have higher tier CV for occasional mission.  But I would not have spend the money on T8 CV.

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Just now, Swift_Scythe said:

You still keep the ship what is your concern?  Its now t6 where it more fits.

CLEARLY its OP when your targets can be t3 Tenryu and t3 South Carolina or T3 Kawachi.   But at t6 you can fight t5 Texas or t7 Nagato. Which the Giulio would fit between nicely.  How does the regular player feel seeing a t5 Giulio going " dang i should not have tried out my T4 Phoenix."

Its not unwarranted nor never happen before they took my OP t6 cleveland put her in t8 where she is decent.  She was super OP with Defensive AA against T456 carriers lol.

The lowest it can see it T4 (minus fail division).

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Just now, Swift_Scythe said:

You still keep the ship what is your concern?  Its now t6 where it more fits.

CLEARLY its OP when your targets can be t3 Tenryu and t3 South Carolina or T3 Kawachi.   But at t6 you can fight t5 Texas or t7 Nagato. Which the Giulio would fit between nicely.  How does the regular player feel seeing a t5 Giulio going " dang i should not have tried out my T4 Phoenix."

Its not unwarranted nor never happen before they took my OP t6 cleveland put her in t8 where she is decent.  She was super OP with Defensive AA against T456 carriers lol.

T5 does not see t3, so right away I want to discount anything else you say. 

But tech tree ships are not premium ships and WG treats them differently. I don't have a problem with them rebalancing it, I think it's good for the game. My problem is them marketing this well known OP ship for the last 16 months and soaking up every last bit of money they could and then decide to balance it. 

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I think nerfing premiums in exceptional cases like the GC is fine. I do think they should be refunding cash if you bought it with cash though.

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Just now, pikohan said:

I think nerfing premiums in exceptional cases like the GC is fine. I do think they should be refunding cash if you bought it with cash though.

Yeah, I want to see a world where Belfast, gremy, kamikaze, etc can live again. But at least in gremy, Nikolai and kamis cases, they were not for sale for long after it was realized how OP it was. 

Belfast was in game longer than it should have been, but GC has been around forever.... 

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Doing anything to PURCHASED ships is a dangerous slop, You purchased it because of its performance now the manufacture wants to detract from it.

Be like buying a Truck that gets great gas mileage and has low cost of repairs, the manufacture sees this and recalls it to make it eat more gas and have some flaws that a repairman would need to repair. This would be lawsuit in any-country as you described as a Bait n Switch.  If WGing doeesnt like it to bad maybe they should have tested things more for balance... OH [edited] if anything the cv rework proves they dont.

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Speaking of OP ships - will WG do the same for the Imperator Nickolai? Bump it to T5? Does this mean they will bring Belfast back at T8? And the Kami sisters at T6? This is a very slippery slope and the fact that they give doubloons is very wrong - unless it was bought with doubloons or won in an event.

I know that WG is trying to keep these ships balanced because they were OP on release and I don't see an easy way to resolve their "OP-ness" without a re-balance which probably does require an up-tier. I guess they could implement special match-making for the GC as they have done with Yubari where she would only see T5-7.

I personally would prefer they leave them alone, stop selling them, and let attrition remove them from play.

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And WG wonders why players are more angry with them today than in 2016. I dunno, 2 years of constantly being baited and switched might have a bit to do with that.

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3 minutes ago, Khafni said:

Speaking of OP ships - will WG do the same for the Imperator Nickolai? Bump it to T5? Does this mean they will bring Belfast back at T8? And the Kami sisters at T6? This is a very slippery slope and the fact that they give doubloons is very wrong - unless it was bought with doubloons or won in an event.

I know that WG is trying to keep these ships balanced because they were OP on release and I don't see an easy way to resolve their "OP-ness" without a re-balance which probably does require an up-tier. I guess they could implement special match-making for the GC as they have done with Yubari where she would only see T5-7.

I personally would prefer they leave them alone, stop selling them, and let attrition remove them from play.

Once the precedence has been set, YES.

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When they did the global nerf to USN guns and the Sims' went from OP to sub par against its then rivals, I went ballistic.   I paid cash for the ship and felt cheated.   The Yubari was relative garbage and the Gremy was left alone.  

I understand the reasoning for it, but really don't care.   I do not want a game where every ship is equal and everything is hyper balanced.   The game needs asymmetrical forces to counter each other and being OP in one area or the other is going to be the price for entertainment and different play styles.   Don't get me wrong...the current and past CV scaling has been crap since they overpower everything except another stronger or better skilled CV.    

Everyone seems to worry about this becoming a pay to win game....well, it and the others always has been that.   The company would not exist if people were not paying to win...no one wants to pay for an inferior product they can get just by spending time pushing a button.

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13 minutes ago, Ducky_shot said:

 

Belfast was in game longer than it should have been.... 

And it was still available through Xmas Containers...

 

Mr-Burns-evil-grin.jpg

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24 minutes ago, Ducky_shot said:

Yeah, I want to see a world where Belfast, gremy, kamikaze, etc can live again. But at least in gremy, Nikolai and kamis cases, they were not for sale for long after it was realized how OP it was. 

Belfast was in game longer than it should have been, but GC has been around forever.... 

Why would they start with the Guilio Cesare. All the ships you listed have higher win rates.

Also they used all those ships as a lure to get people to buy Santa Crates.

 

 

 

Edited by CaptainTeddybear

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17 minutes ago, Mustangrde1 said:

Doing anything to PURCHASED ships is a dangerous slop, You purchased it because of its performance now the manufacture wants to detract from it.

Be like buying a Truck that gets great gas mileage and has low cost of repairs, the manufacture sees this and recalls it to make it eat more gas and have some flaws that a repairman would need to repair. This would be lawsuit in any-country as you described as a Bait n Switch.  If WGing doeesnt like it to bad maybe they should have tested things more for balance... OH [edited] if anything the cv rework proves they dont.

As I have said repeatedly and will keep saying until WG hears me, as a company they are completely willing to break faith with their customer/player base for short term financial gain. Stop buying there stuff and tell them WHY you stopped buying their stuff. 

They have got to do a better job of play testing and balance before release. PTS isn’t getting it done, supertesters aren’t getting it done. What ever we pay for, whether it’s with time or money, it needs to work right, right out of the box. 

Other game companies can do this. Do not reward ineptitude. 

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1 minute ago, CaptainTeddybear said:

Why would they start with the Guilio Cesare. All the ships you listed have higher win rates.

Sales must have dropped off. Time now to sacrifice it to the god of “balance”.

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Finally...the ship gets placed where it belongs.

To all those who purchased it as a pay2win tool...WG isn't a company with a lot of integrity. Dont buy from shady people...also, git gud.

To all those who want to sell it...dont. It will be fine at tier 6, and you will still have fun with it. Dont throw your perfectly working toys out of the pram in a tantrum.

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37 minutes ago, Swift_Scythe said:

You still keep the ship what is your concern?  Its now t6 where it more fits.

CLEARLY its OP when your targets can be t3 Tenryu and t3 South Carolina or T3 Kawachi.   But at t6 you can fight t5 Texas or t7 Nagato. Which the Giulio would fit between nicely.  How does the regular player feel seeing a t5 Giulio going " dang i should not have tried out my T4 Phoenix."

Its not unwarranted nor never happen before they took my OP t6 cleveland put her in t8 where she is decent.  She was super OP with Defensive AA against T456 carriers lol.

Um, the GC didn't see T3, and she already saw the Texas and Nagato.  Putting her at T6 means she'll see T8 BBs and CAs.

She is OP at T5, but facing T8, not sure about that one.

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18 minutes ago, Thornir said:

Sales must have dropped off. Time now to sacrifice it to the god of “balance”.

GC hasn't been put up for sale for over a year.  If they wanted short-term gain, they'd just put up all the OP ships up for sale, for high prices, and not in crates.

 

Edited by mavfin87

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Easy fix for this bait and switch...close your wallets

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I bought it, I don't seal club with it, I don't care.

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3 minutes ago, mavfin87 said:

GC hasn't been put up for sale for over a year.  If they wanted short-term gain, they'd just put up all the OP ships up for sale, for high prices, and not in crates.

 

It was sold last summer. I suggest you get informed 

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