Anyone See Notser Video on Avoiding Flak?

[SJ_Sailer]

Has anyone seen Notser's video on PTS2 and how to avoid Flak and damage when playing Carrier by turning and speeding up and slowing down?

Has anyone been able to replicate his results?  I did not have time to try myself.

He made it seem like with some practice you could avoid any damage easily. 

Also seems Destroyers have no defense at all against CV's.  The only defense they may have is that BB's offer more HP to farm at the same no risk so given the choice of an easy DD target or an easy BB target the CV will go after the DD last.

Thoughts?

[HazeGrayUnderway]

A new one eh?  Last I saw was his "Phase 2 PTS 0.8.0 AA Testing" and early on a Midway's fighters just weaved through his FULL AA SPEC Worcester's gunfire like nothing happened and rocketed him.  I was not impressed by that AA.

 

Will check the new video.

[MaliceA4Thought]

turning and speeding up and slowing down has always been a method of reducing flack damage, not eliminating it since early testing and even before PTS1, it's not new and most PTS players already use those tactics.  It's not a total solution but it does help however.  It turns AA from destroying whole squadron, to make it harder to get more than one strike.  You also have to do it whilst flying away from the target as well as towards it to save planes.  It also depends on the type of plane as to how effective this is..  rocket fighters are faster and its easier to do, but frankly rocket damage against a big ship is pathetic anyway so not really worth it unless you have nothing else left because it is on cooldown.

DD's properly specced do have defenses against CV's  see some of the videos from other players where dd's are getting good results.

[SJ_Sailer]

2 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

turning and speeding up and slowing down has always been a method of reducing flack damage, not eliminating it since early testing and even before PTS1, it's not new.  It's not a total solution but it does help however.  It turns AA from destroying whole squadron, to make it harder to get more than one strike.  You also have to do it whilst flying away from the target as well as towards it to save planes.

DD's properly specced do have defenses against CV's  see some of the videos from other players where dd's are getting good results.

Looking at his latest video where he played CV he had no issue at all flying through flak and taking no losses at all.  When flying against a DD  he took no damage at all none.

Have you seen his latest video?

[demeflac]

I Saw his vídeo and dont agree that DD are helpless. I tried Kitakaze, Grozovoi and Khaba. Khaba with AA mod1, BFT, AFT and AA flag. I was killing lots of planes from a Hakuryu, plus It couldnt hit me with torps due to the long distance arming, i managed to Hunt him up to 2km away and sink It, even with all his secondaries firing on me, Rockets, bombs,etc. DD with good AA and heal Will be a big threat to CV In my opinion.

[MaliceA4Thought]

5 minutes ago, SJ_Sailer said:

Looking at his latest video where he played CV he had no issue at all flying through flak and taking no losses at all.  When flying against a DD  he took no damage at all none.

Have you seen his latest video?

yes I have, I have also seen his woosta video where he shot down zip and seen bot woostas shoot down upto 74 planes in a match.  I also watched Notsers Woosta video and frankly his approach to playing in that match was as if he was still playing against the old carriers not the new ones.  Playstyle has to change with new carriers on both sides..  I have also seen a player grov in a match shoot down 30+ aircraft.  I have also been in matches where I have shot down enough a/c in a daring to make the carrier player go play somewhere else and been in a carrier where with a bot dd, I can harras it to death.   No different from any other ship or type really based on the player attacking and defending.

More to the point, have YOU played the PTS or are you just watching videos?

[HazeGrayUnderway]

RIP Destroyers.

[SJ_Sailer]

6 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

yes I have, I have also seen his woosta video where he shot down zip and seen bot woostas shoot down upto 74 planes in a match.  I also watched Notsers Woosta video and frankly his approach to playing in that match was as if he was still playing against the old carriers not the new ones.  Playstyle has to change with new carriers on both sides..  I have also seen a player grov in a match shoot down 30+ aircraft.  I have also been in matches where I have shot down enough a/c in a daring to make the carrier player go play somewhere else and been in a carrier where with a bot dd, I can harras it to death.   No different from any other ship or type really based on the player attacking and defending.

More to the point, have YOU played the PTS or are you just watching videos?

I played the first day they went live on PTS 2 but unfortunately I've been very busy since.

[LowSpeed_US]

18 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

DD's properly specced do have defenses against CV's  see some of the videos from other players where dd's are getting good results

So, besides the 4 point AFT skill. What else does it require to be "properly specced"?

[MaliceA4Thought]

1 minute ago, LowSpeed_US said:

So, besides the 4 point AFT skill. What else does it require to be "properly specced"?

this post pretty much covers it...

 

[LowSpeed_US]

12 minutes ago, demeflac said:

I Saw his vídeo and dont agree that DD are helpless. I tried Kitakaze, Grozovoi and Khaba. Khaba with AA mod1, BFT, AFT and AA flag. I was killing lots of planes from a Hakuryu, plus It couldnt hit me with torps due to the long distance arming, i managed to Hunt him up to 2km away and sink It, even with all his secondaries firing on me, Rockets, bombs,etc. DD with good AA and heal Will be a big threat to CV In my opinion.

I think the use of a heavy (expensive) 4 points on AFT for a DD just for the need to have AA is a totally wasted point. I do not believe that Destroyers are meant to be great at AA (if they are, they are limited). That 4 point could be better utilised elsewhere for a better use, rather than for AA only.

I find whatever comes, that the crucial captain skill points are being yet again diluted (& forced) to be re-specc'd for the purpose of "just having an AA chance".

 

[LowSpeed_US]

2 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

this post pretty much covers it.

Thanks, i'll check it out.

edit: Upon having read it. As a non CV player, this change from my limited knowledge of 'news'. Will wean CV mains to quit or DD mains to rage. 

 

[alexf24]

I do not find it funny.

Will wait and see the effect on my DDs after people become proficient, then I might have to scream.

Why WG, why the sky cancer?

[Captain_Slattery]

17 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

yes I have, I have also seen his woosta video where he shot down zip and seen bot woostas shoot down upto 74 planes in a match.  I also watched Notsers Woosta video and frankly his approach to playing in that match was as if he was still playing against the old carriers not the new ones.  Playstyle has to change with new carriers on both sides..  I have also seen a player grov in a match shoot down 30+ aircraft.  I have also been in matches where I have shot down enough a/c in a daring to make the carrier player go play somewhere else and been in a carrier where with a bot dd, I can harras it to death.   No different from any other ship or type really based on the player attacking and defending.

More to the point, have YOU played the PTS or are you just watching videos?

I have not played carriers EVER.  I have been watching just about every video on the rework.  It is quite negative usually.  I have been very concerned about the balance.

I appreciate you posting your gameplay experience with the new rework.  I'm still concerned but am also hopeful that there can and will be an optimal balance struck.

Once again, thanks for sharing.  +1

[_RC1138]

3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

 

3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

RIP Destroyers.

A) Waah waah, poor DD's, oh wait, wgaf.

B) Waah waah, I cannot be a master of all domains.

[_WaveRider_]

27 minutes ago, demeflac said:

I Saw his vídeo and dont agree that DD are helpless. I tried Kitakaze, Grozovoi and Khaba. Khaba with AA mod1, BFT, AFT and AA flag. I was killing lots of planes from a Hakuryu, plus It couldnt hit me with torps due to the long distance arming, i managed to Hunt him up to 2km away and sink It, even with all his secondaries firing on me, Rockets, bombs,etc. DD with good AA and heal Will be a big threat to CV In my opinion.

I do understand what you are saying, it makes sense until you realise most DD don't have good AA.

I guess I'll enjoy the challenge of both learning the new CV playstyle and adapting again in the DDs. 

[CriMiNaL__]

I am a DD main and I couldn't care less about the new cv rework, it is still going to have great players and bad ones all the same so some games you will get targeted and die early other games you wont, let it get into the main stream first before we cry about the sky is falling, I am sure WG will tweak what needs to be tweaked.

[HazeGrayUnderway]

9 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

 

A) Waah waah, poor DD's, oh wait, wgaf.

B) Waah waah, I cannot be a master of all domains.

I don't even really play Destroyers 

 

I **DO*** play a lot of AA Cruisers and with the CV Revamp, I will be lacking in range to even protect my teammates.  Not to mention all the nerfs that have hit AA in the Revamp, i.e. no overlapping AA, no panic effect from Defensive Fire, etc. on top of the loss of AA range.

 

So really.  This whole Revamp is a Sh*tshow that's about to land and splatter across the game in 8 days.  Of course, the CVs are going to love WG putting surface ships on a silver platter for them.

[demeflac]

23 minutes ago, LowSpeed_US said:

I think the use of a heavy (expensive) 4 points on AFT for a DD just for the need to have AA is a totally wasted point. I do not believe that Destroyers are meant to be great at AA (if they are, they are limited). That 4 point could be better utilised elsewhere for a better use, rather than for AA only.

I find whatever comes, that the crucial captain skill points are being yet again diluted (& forced) to be re-specc'd for the purpose of "just having an AA chance".

 

If u play Khaba u would know It needs AFT, not for AA, but for being a long range gunboat, actually the only DD LINE that i recommmend using AFT is the russian gunboat from tier 7 to 10. Minsk to Khaba.

[Battlecruiser_Repulse]

3 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

Not on me. I'm not playing (or paying, Wargaming) until carriers are reined it. It's going to be a dull spring, but I'm not budging.

[LowSpeed_US]

4 minutes ago, demeflac said:

If u play Khaba u would know It needs AFT, not for AA, but for being a long range gunboat, It actually is the only DD that i recommmend using AFT.

Oh, I do not doubt that at all. I have yet to grind to that ship. However, using a 4 point captain skill just for the sake of having a somewhat effective AA for a DD is a wasted 4 expensive points. That is what I was leaning towards.

 

[_RC1138]

5 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

I don't even really play Destroyers 

 

I **DO*** play a lot of AA Cruisers and with the CV Revamp, I will be lacking in range to even protect my teammates.  Not to mention all the nerfs that have hit AA in the Revamp, i.e. no overlapping AA, no panic effect from Defensive Fire, etc. on top of the loss of AA range. 

 

So really.  This whole Revamp is a Sh*tshow that's about to land and splatter across the game in 8 days.  Of course, the CVs are going to love WG putting surface ships on a silver platter for them.

The only part I agree with is the AA range: that's why in my thread I called for AFT to remain a +20% range boost (or HEAVILY reducing it's tier cost, as other than secondary spec BB's and DD like Khab, it's pretty much useless). Otherwise, I think AA is in a good place, likely needing individual tweaks on a per ship basis on the rate at which flak clouds are created/size of clouds and range/dps of the medium/small guns.

[HazeGrayUnderway]

1 minute ago, _RC1138 said:

The only part I agree with is the AA range: that's why in my thread I called for AFT to remain a +20% range boost (or HEAVILY reducing it's tier cost, as other than secondary spec BB's and DD like Khab, it's pretty much useless). Otherwise, I think AA is in a good place, likely needing individual tweaks on a per ship basis on the rate at which flak clouds are created/size of clouds and range/dps of the medium/small guns.

The long range flak is meaningless.  The CVs are just weaving around like they're strolling around in the park.

[_RC1138]

1 minute ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

The long range flak is meaningless.  The CVs are just weaving around like they're strolling around in the park.

Only in the low tier (where the squad is laterally small). At T8+ you literally cannot avoid losing at least the edge planes on a full squad as the edge planes, while dodging the center, will slam face first into bursts. And too much weaving hurts the accuracy of a drop meaning sure, you lost no planes, but you also didn't hit anything.

[MaliceA4Thought]

2 minutes ago, LowSpeed_US said:

Oh, I do not doubt that at all. I have yet to grind to that ship. However, using a 4 point captain skill just for the sake of having a somewhat effective AA for a DD is a wasted 4 expensive points. That is what I was leaning towards.

 

I don't disagree, but it now means that you have to choose your DD skills wisely for how you want to play it..  like other ships..  do I build for secondary, raw damage or fire prevention..  now I have to make similar choices in my DD's whereas before it was pretty much cookie cutter.