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Shak_McGee

Matchmaker, Win Rate and RNG

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Could someone please explain to me why the matchmaker always and without fail puts me on the team with the lowest WR? I look at the matchmaker and there I am on the team with the 40% WR and the other team has 50% - 60% WR. I consistently finish in the top four XP earners and lose, lose, lose. This is statistically impossible. I am not a noob. I have been playing this game for just shy of 3 years (9700ish random battles). About 2 days/mo I get favorable RNG....in other words, when I hit something it takes damage. The rest of the month, I get 0 damage for broadsides but take citadels when properly angled. Between the MM always putting me on the losing team (no team should have a 60% win rate and go against a team with a 40% win rate. MM could go 50/50 if it can go 40/60. Why does it not?) and RNG which gives no damage (even on ships with no damaged areas on them) after a 6km broadside ( I can see the glowing holes on the waterline) and gives citadels on angled bows, I am about done with this game. Please someone give me a reasonable explanation of what appears to be a completely rigged system. I really enjoy playing the game and divisioning with my buds, but I am highly frustrated by getting the short end of the stick before the game even begins and then getting it again from RNGesus. When RNG is on my side I score huge damage and XP; however, statistically speaking, the things which have been occurring in this game reveal a serious problem in both the MM and RNG.

I did not write this to be told I suck (even if true, it is not germane), but if you feel the need to insult someone so you can feel better about yourself, I cannot stop you. Serious efforts at explaining the aforementioned issues in a reasoned manner will certainly be appreciated.

Thank you,

Shak

Edited by Shak_McGee
Didn't know how many random battles I was in. Found correct number and edited.
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Getting put on the better or worse team is just a matter of RNG. Even I can't help it. I just go play other games if i feel my luck with teams is bad. Don't burn yourself out by keeping on playing through the bad MM RNG.

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Noting to do with WR, it's all random.  Just remember there are more players sub 50% than players above 50%.  70/30, with 70% being under 50%.  Confused yet.  And I don't have any solid numbers but that could explain why this comes up all the time.

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Thanks Personator. I'll take your advice and find something else to do. There is no way to play this game without bad MMRNG apparently. This has been going on for a very long time, I simply chose to mention the problem this time.

Thank you for your time,

Shak

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I am a 40%  Iowa player, 90 games. So I am in that lousy group, and have lost 10 today, won 3. I have had many times an Iowa take 10K out of mine, and I'll return with 4 shell bounces, one pen, and 1K damage back. This at 15km, so I don't know what I am doing. That is the real story, hits but not much counting. I have C hull, 16 pt captain, but no matter.

The game can be depressing at times, as you already know at the start of a battle that you aren't going to help the team much, unless another player is drinking a beer and hits and island right in front of you, then you can pile on. But that is not real play either, is it ?

Edited by Ericson38

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Ahhh yes, Win Rate. As insulting as the grade on a test you thought you aced.  When you ditch that stat and tighten up the old game take heart this game is all about you and you alone. Next stay out of Casinos … LOL  (43% and climbing)

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It makes sense that there are more sub 50% WRs with how the MM works (or doesn't depending on your perspective). A 20% difference in WR in MM is a farce. While looking at the teams, I can see how they could be evened up by simply switching a player or two to the other side.

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Hmmm. I played Saturday, won 17 or something lost 2. Doing div drops all night, and some ranked. My first 1000 games kinda sucked but the infographics have me on a rise every single day. But I do get day with just as many losses. Sometime you just cant win. Like yesterday, played a guy with 70 % win rate over 9000 marches. He was dam good and deserved to win

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41 minutes ago, Shak_McGee said:

Could someone please explain to me why the matchmaker always and without fail puts me on the team with the lowest WR? I look at the matchmaker and there I am on the team with the 40% WR and the other team has 50% - 60% WR. I consistently finish in the top four XP earners and lose, lose, lose. This is statistically impossible. I am not a noob. I have been playing this game for just shy of 3 years (9700ish random battles). About 2 days/mo I get favorable RNG....in other words, when I hit something it takes damage. The rest of the month, I get 0 damage for broadsides but take citadels when properly angled. Between the MM always putting me on the losing team (no team should have a 60% win rate and go against a team with a 40% win rate. MM could go 50/50 if it can go 40/60. Why does it not?) and RNG which gives no damage (even on ships with no damaged areas on them) after a 6km broadside ( I can see the glowing holes on the waterline) and gives citadels on angled bows, I am about done with this game. Please someone give me a reasonable explanation of what appears to be a completely rigged system. I really enjoy playing the game and divisioning with my buds, but I am highly frustrated by getting the short end of the stick before the game even begins and then getting it again from RNGesus. When RNG is on my side I score huge damage and XP; however, statistically speaking, the things which have been occurring in this game reveal a serious problem in both the MM and RNG.

I did not write this to be told I suck (even if true, it is not germane), but if you feel the need to insult someone so you can feel better about yourself, I cannot stop you. Serious efforts at explaining the aforementioned issues in a reasoned manner will certainly be appreciated.

Thank you,

Shak

First because the MM isn't placing you on the worse team all the time and second because the MM does not look at WR aka skill based MM. You appear to be having a bit of a bad streak now so look outside of that while trying to improve your play.

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40 minutes ago, Personator said:

Getting put on the better or worse team is just a matter of RNG. Even I can't help it. I just go play other games if i feel my luck with teams is bad. Don't burn yourself out by keeping on playing through the bad MM RNG.

And there lies the problem with this game. That happens so often, players have taken the "IDGAF" attitude & just play whatever way they want. Doesn't matter if it's a suicide rush or hug the borders away from the fight and it kills the game for anyone else involved.

Had a sprint match last night where a Pensacola stayed at the back for the entire match til it was too late to bother coming up to fight. Same match, had a dd taking pot shots at other BBs beside our BBs.

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47 minutes ago, Shak_McGee said:

This is statistically impossible.

How?  Youre statistics are determined after the battle.  Seems like it was possible

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everyone goes through slumps and bad runs of teams (as shown in my recent winrate graph) but at the end of the day it's all up to RNG. And honestly, unless theyve got a couple hundred battles in the ship MM Monitor doesn't give you much information at all. Using something like statsmaster lets you at least see their overalls in addition to the ship they are in. For example, my 70 gneisenau games at 46% winrate is not representative of me as a player, but MM monitor would lead someone to believe I am a garbage player if I were in my Gneisenau.

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29 minutes ago, Ericson38 said:

I am a 40%  Iowa player, 90 games. So I am in that lousy group, and have lost 10 today, won 3. I have had many times an Iowa take 10K out of mine, and I'll return with 4 shell bounces, one pen, and 1K damage back. This at 15km, so I don't know what I am doing. That is the real story, hits but not much counting. I have C hull, 16 pt captain, but no matter.

The game can be depressing at times, as you already know at the start of a battle that you aren't going to help the team much, unless another player is drinking a beer and hits and island right in front of you, then you can pile on. But that is not real play either, is it ?

Don't aim for angled armor.  Aim for the superstructure or the guns, and you'll do some damage until you get a better angle.  

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This is not just about now. This has been going on far too long. The fact that I chose to mention it now doesn't make it new or 'a bit of a bad streak'. I can count the number of games I was not on the low WR side on one hand over the past month. This is not about improving my play (the point being...that is out of my hands, I am not RNGesus) it is about improving the game for everyone. I know I am not alone in this frustration. Instead of making excuses we need to make improvements. If only I could love the game so much as I love the idea of the game....what a happy day that would be.

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I loved and played the game more back during the earlier stages during the closed beta weekends & then closed beta.

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18 minutes ago, Rickjoshi1765 said:

How?  Youre statistics are determined after the battle.  Seems like it was possible

You are confusing my stats with the RNG. I am not talking about my stats being statistically impossible (That is just silly). I am speaking of the outcomes I am seeing from the MMRNG being statistically impossible.

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10 minutes ago, Shak_McGee said:

This is not just about now. This has been going on far too long. The fact that I chose to mention it now doesn't make it new or 'a bit of a bad streak'. I can count the number of games I was not on the low WR side on one hand over the past month. This is not about improving my play (the point being...that is out of my hands, I am not RNGesus) it is about improving the game for everyone. I know I am not alone in this frustration. Instead of making excuses we need to make improvements. If only I could love the game so much as I love the idea of the game....what a happy day that would be.

After thousands of games, we all have the same MM luck. The rest is up to you. If you want to win more, you need to improve your play, it's really that simple. Expecting to get a 60% WR without learning more about the game is foolish. As is expecting to climb out of a 45% WR hole without "improving your play". WG doesn't have a vendetta against any particular player such that you're going to have an artificially low WR. 

If you care about your WR, do things to improve it. 

If you don't care about your WR, more power to you. It's just a game. WR isn't the end-all-be-all.

Edited by Kombat_W0MBAT
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5 minutes ago, Shak_McGee said:

This is not just about now. This has been going on far too long. The fact that I chose to mention it now doesn't make it new or 'a bit of a bad streak'. I can count the number of games I was not on the low WR side on one hand over the past month. This is not about improving my play (the point being...that is out of my hands, I am not RNGesus) it is about improving the game for everyone. I know I am not alone in this frustration. Instead of making excuses we need to make improvements. If only I could love the game so much as I love the idea of the game....what a happy day that would be.

Sadly, this gets brought up a lot, and they refuse to change anything.  Right now, the only thing taken into account is the tier of ships available in queue, and the type.  Once it matches up the types and the tiers it needs, it tosses them into a game.  Beyond that, all it sorts out is the divs - trying to balance the divs between the teams (it doesn't care if you are a 2 man div or 3..a div is a div and it tries to split them).

They seem to believe any complexity added to the system will increase the amount of time between games, and they deem that unacceptable.

There are many subtle changes they could make that would have zero impact on game times, but make a dramatic difference.  Have 6 Tier 10 BBs in queue, 2 Conqs, 2 Montanas, 2 Yamatos - split them between the 2 teams evenly.  Win.  Instead, it will put like 2 Yamatos and a Montana on one team, and 2 conqs and the Montana on the other.  Or all the radar ships go to one side instead of split between the teams.

Anyways, they don't seem to be wanting to make changes beyond the little, un-noticeable changes they make...so.

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8 minutes ago, SkinnyK said:

I agree with Shak_McGee.

 

Thank you Skinny. I am not trying to be controversial. I just wanted a reasonable answer to a reasonable question. But all I ever hear is RNG. We have identified the problem. Now what are we going to do about it?

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1 minute ago, Shak_McGee said:

Thank you Skinny. I am not trying to be controversial. I just wanted a reasonable answer to a reasonable question. But all I ever hear is RNG. We have identified the problem. Now what are we going to do about it?

 

RNG is the solution, not the problem. 

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50 minutes ago, Shak_McGee said:

It makes sense that there are more sub 50% WRs with how the MM works (or doesn't depending on your perspective). A 20% difference in WR in MM is a farce. While looking at the teams, I can see how they could be evened up by simply switching a player or two to the other side.

I doubt if this would change anything. In sports we see what on paper appears to be a good match of equal teams & the game is a blowout. We see top teams fall to teams they, on paper, should sweep aside with no effort. The main difference is there are several thousand Warships matches each day, far more than sporting events.

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5 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

After thousands of games, we all have the same MM luck. The rest is up to you. If you want to win more, you need to improve your play, it's really that simple. Expecting to get a 60% WR without learning more about the game is foolish. As is expecting to climb out of a 45% WR hole without "improving your play". WG doesn't have a vendetta against any particular player such that you're going to have an artificially low WR. 

If you care about your WR, do things to improve it. 

If you don't care about your WR, more power to you. It's just a game. WR isn't the end-all-be-all.

Personally, WR is not that important to me. I simply want a cogent answer. When I generally finish top 4 in losses, my game play is not the problem with my win rate. The problem with my win rate is consistently being put on teams where teammates hide behind islands or in corners, provide no support and for the most part make me wonder why they even bother logging on. All I hear is RNG, RNG, RNG....yet I am supposed to play better? Which is it going to be? RNG or me?

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1 minute ago, Shak_McGee said:

Personally, WR is not that important to me. I simply want a cogent answer. When I generally finish top 4 in losses, my game play is not the problem with my win rate. The problem with my win rate is consistently being put on teams where teammates hide behind islands or in corners, provide no support and for the most part make me wonder why they even bother logging on. All I hear is RNG, RNG, RNG....yet I am supposed to play better? Which is it going to be? RNG or me?

We all have the same RNG, so you decide. 

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6 minutes ago, kgh52 said:

I doubt if this would change anything. In sports we see what on paper appears to be a good match of equal teams & the game is a blowout. We see top teams fall to teams they, on paper, should sweep aside with no effort. The main difference is there are several thousand Warships matches each day, far more than sporting events.

While what you say is true, you are describing the exceptions. Most of the time the 'better' team wins. I am simply pointing out the fact that the MM in WoWs is creating lopsided teams. This promotes higher WR for those who get on the higher WR team regardless of their WR or ability and lower WR for those who get put on lower WR team regardless of other factors. Now, all this is fine. IF the MM were to spread the advantages and disadvantages evenly. It simply does not operate that way. 

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