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Greetings WG.

So..   based on the changes between PTS1 and PTS2.

1)  Added torp bombers to t4..   good move..  not to deadly but something to try and get ready for higher tiers.

2)  Torp Bombers at t4 came with option T to launch fighters..  not sure if this was intentional or accidental...   I think accidental because rockets and bombs don't have them.

3)  If carrier is sunk in battle but you still have a T option to launch fighters..  it will still launch fighters and say launching fighters even though carrier is sunk.

4)  If you go back to carrier and are on it, at the exact point it is destroyed, you cannot move camera away or do anything, you are locked to the position it sank in.. only returning to port works.

5)  AA...  again played both nations all tiers...   whilst I think PTS1 was too low in AA effect, certainly at T4/6/8  it is now too strong.  Considering we are fighting bots, not players.   It is easy to see when a player does come in that it completely changes the dynamic.  My gut feel is that the AA should be based at a mid point between PTS1 and PTS2  but thats me..  you will have the data to determine that.

6)  Enjoying the gameplay..  being a carrier is no longer an I win button and really is a deterrant to BB's stopping and backing and anything hiding behind islands.

Regards

Malice

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Be sure to look at what AA ships are “ Too Strong” since some ships have no AA or essentially none, some ships have ok AA, and other ships have strong AA as one of the main things about the ships. So if you complained and got the AA reduced based on the strong AA ships then those few ships would be only things playable because all the rest of the ships would be completely helpless against the CV planes.

Also when testing planes vs the ships and their AA, be certain to take note if the target has Def AA or can carry that Consumable, because if bots happen to be able to use that Consumable then that would make a major difference. Example is my Graf Spee AA is pretty weak on its own, but once Def AA is activated it can shoot down a few planes.

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1 hour ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

being a carrier is no longer an I win button and really is a deterrant to BB's stopping and backing and anything hiding behind islands.

Even though for the most part, in current gameplay, CV's have some of the lowest winrate's on average, are not typically even top damage dealers, and unless your one of the ships with god AA that eviscerates planes current RTS gameplay with multiple groups punishes these exact things way more than the new version does?

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2 hours ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

Greetings WG.

So..   based on the changes between PTS1 and PTS2.

1)  Added torp bombers to t4..   good move..  not to deadly but something to try and get ready for higher tiers.

2)  Torp Bombers at t4 came with option T to launch fighters..  not sure if this was intentional or accidental...   I think accidental because rockets and bombs don't have them.

3)  If carrier is sunk in battle but you still have a T option to launch fighters..  it will still launch fighters and say launching fighters even though carrier is sunk.

4)  If you go back to carrier and are on it, at the exact point it is destroyed, you cannot move camera away or do anything, you are locked to the position it sank in.. only returning to port works.

5)  AA...  again played both nations all tiers...   whilst I think PTS1 was too low in AA effect, certainly at T4/6/8  it is now too strong.  Considering we are fighting bots, not players.   It is easy to see when a player does come in that it completely changes the dynamic.  My gut feel is that the AA should be based at a mid point between PTS1 and PTS2  but thats me..  you will have the data to determine that.

6)  Enjoying the gameplay..  being a carrier is no longer an I win button and really is a deterrant to BB's stopping and backing and anything hiding behind islands.

Regards

Malice

 

1) You drop exactly ONE torpedo at T4. Brain required to hit with 1 torp is about at the level of candy crush. You will do that gazillion of repetitions.

2) Fighter mechanics is so bad that it does not matter since most of the time a player has no real idea of how and when it works or not, so you won't learn anything at T4 anyway

3) Stupid bug obviously

5) AA is lame [edited]. All the real damage comes from flak. If you avoid flak there is no real damage. Players are given zero explanation about what is happening and how to deal with it. At the same time once you figure out that flak is just totally negated by variable speed which is using the engine boost energy. You will have to use that break accelerate break with every time you are in the flak AA aura and its is boring and repetitive to no end, but you have to do it because it is "the gameplay".

 

Regardless of the damage, the new system is even worse than it was gameplay wise. Arcade and repetitive micromanagement non stop.

 

 

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the cv rework is finish wargamimg have nerf their damage nerf the amount of squadron in the sky and now they buff aa to ridicule lv like in live this after nerfing the class into the ground

its done cv are finish ,i was hopefull that the rework was gonna be nicely done but i had my doubt since wargaming have never been able to balance cv since close beta days so now what i thaught was gonna happen has happen

it is messed up tho that in testing the aa was found to be balance and now they decide to change it and destroy all the work they had done on the rework ,you wont even be able to play coop now with your cv cause they balance the aa with bots so go figure so even bots can wreck your planes AWSOME

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I've been having decent fun with the rework, save for one, MONSTROUSLY aggravating thing: the mouse controls.

1) The mouse controls are way too sluggish to respond, and way to slow once they finally do. Even for fine aim, presumably what the mouse controls are for, they're just waaaaay too slow.

2) To make matters worse, the mouse controls only work withing a fairly narrow arc of your current course, which doesn't appear to be shown on the hud or minimap. If you're trying to use the mouse to turn smoothly as you fly around but you accidentally turn the camera just a -touch- too far, you end up not turning at all. Since the mouse controls are so incredibly sluggish and slow to respond, I often don't even notice that my turn hasn't actually gone in until a few seconds later.

3) I constantly feel like the mouse controls are FIGHTING me. For the aforementioned reasons, I tend to try to use WASD as much possible (even for fine-tuning aim). Unfortunately, if my mouse is pointed in the rough direction I'm flying, my planes will start slowly drifting off the course I want (and just set with WASD) to sluggishly follow the mouse. Again, because it's so slow, I often don't even notice it until the planes have started turning quite far from where I'd like them to be pointed.

4) All of these problems are the worst when trying to aim an attack. The mouse controls are way too slow, so I find I HAVE to use WASD most of the time- especially with the constant dodging of flak that's required. In order to actually stay on the heading I want though, I have to also turn the mouse with my plane or else they'll start drifting back to where I'm pointing. Since adjusting your aim slows or reverses the tightening of the aiming sights, this drift (and the subsequent required correction of it) has a serious impact on the accuracy of my attacks. This especially painful with USN carriers which take an AGE to aim, and are severely punished for adjusting their aim.

 

Further feedback:

1) I don't understand the tiny tim rockets that the USN CVs get. They are more awkward to aim (needing to be in-line with the target), less reliable when it comes to getting hits (by virtue of having way less rockets), seem to generally do less damage than the regular rockets even when the DO hit. I've tried them in quite a few matches thinking I must be missing something (I mean, they're the special thing USN CVs get), but they... just seem to kinda suck. If there's a thing they're particularly great at (or a good reason to pick them over regular rockets), I haven't found it and would love to know what it is.

2) Dodging though flak is pretty cool and exciting, but it really gets out of hand some times. Even against some DDs, the flak can get pretty oppressive. Often times the shells burst basically on top of my planes even when I've been flying evasively, and when I'm very close to the ship and putting the finishing touches on an attack, the flak is still blasting away. It's unavoidable when you're trying to actually aim your attack (if you want your sights t be even remotely tight), and often gets so crazy I can't even SEE my sights though all the explosions. Many ships are practically untouchable on their own, and god help you if there's anybody else in the general vicinity. With the bigger focus on several small attacks instead of the occasional quick big strike, having to spend a bunch of time waiting for someone to not be hidden behind a literal wall of flak explosions really hurts.

3) It would be really nice if there was a visual cue to show that a ship is using defensive fire (like the thick black smoke that shows up when a ship is using engine boost), and some sort of indication showing that a ship has focused its AA to a particular side. It doesn't need to be a big obvious indicator on the HUD, but some, well, something that a keen-eyed player could look out for would be much appreciated. It's very hard to tell if the AA you're facing is strong because the player is doing something (defensive fire or AA focused to that side), or if the ship just naturally has really good AA and / or is receiving long-range coverage from a friend. Since the crazy flak walls can kill you pretty much instantly, you don't really get a chance to asses what's going on. Your only choices are to just assume their AA is always that strong and try to avoid the large areas of the map they cover, or risk wasting a bunch of time trying to attack them again perhaps from another side and potentially get insta-wasted again. More feedback of what was going on would make for a more satisfying experience imo.

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AA is pretty decent now, it now punishes you for just flying over multiple ships unlike last PTS. 

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5 hours ago, alex08060 said:

AA is pretty decent now, it now punishes you for just flying over multiple ships unlike last PTS. 

In many cases, it also punishes you for attempting to attack a lone target, even if you use plenty of evasive maneuvers on the approach. In fact, flying TO the target is often the less dangerous part, so long as you weave around; it's that part where you have to fly faily straight towards the target (you know, to aim your attack) that can quickly get extremely, squadron-wipingly, nasty.

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15 minutes ago, Frenotx said:

In many cases, it also punishes you for attempting to attack a lone target, even if you use plenty of evasive maneuvers on the approach. In fact, flying TO the target is often the less dangerous part, so long as you weave around; it's that part where you have to fly faily straight towards the target (you know, to aim your attack) that can quickly get extremely, squadron-wipingly, nasty.

You gotta learn to vary speed on the approach..   faster and slower, that reduces the AA accuracy..  just remember if you close in on boost, your aiming reticule doesn't shrink much if at all, so get into approach as early as you can then boost in, then slow and drop and then boost again away from the target to not loose as many planes as you pass over.  There are a lot of subtleties in the new carrier play that will take a while to learn.

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53 minutes ago, MaliceA4Thought said:

You gotta learn to vary speed on the approach..   faster and slower, that reduces the AA accuracy..  just remember if you close in on boost, your aiming reticule doesn't shrink much if at all, so get into approach as early as you can then boost in, then slow and drop and then boost again away from the target to not loose as many planes as you pass over.  There are a lot of subtleties in the new carrier play that will take a while to learn.

Thanks for the tip. I do vary my speed a lot, both to throw off the AA and to get into / out of position as quickly and efficiently as possible. It definitely helps, but I've still run into of plenty of situations where continuous walls of flak stretch from one edge of my screen to the other, layered several bursts thick. I've had full-health, all-green, all-planes  squadrons get wiped out in the time between initiating an attack run and (trying) to pull the trigger. A few seconds. The camera violently jutters around as it keeps adjusting after another plane dies, my aiming reticle gets completely obscured by the flak, and I'm abruptly greeted with the "return to the carrier" message. I could be getting unlucky (certainly not a rare thing for me), but it's been far from a singular event.

Note that it's not the norm, either. While all flak-equipped ships seem to be able to keep using their flak even at point-blank range, it's usually not so dense as to be impossible to avoid or survive. Those few ships / situations though... Absurdly over the top.

 

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Greetings WG.

No problems with the other ships and missions , win 2 battles on Tier IV, VI , VII and X, but with the CVs, this last round it became too much difficult because of the AA , in Tier VIII and X you can´t  get even near a ship without losing  all the planes, I tried to master lauching torpedos from faaaaar away, it´s an exercise of patience and time of battle lost.  When the ships stick together, better leave the squadrons at the CV and wait the other ships make some damage and make them stray away, then you go. Battleships with hard AA, tier X Montana as example, impossible to get near and engage , all planes lost...so let the Montana to the other ships do their job and let´s look for some cruisers. In my opinion, AAs are more deadly this new 2nd round than the other. I also had the 1 2 3 keys not working again , I believe that  it has something with pressing F after a failure attack and send what is left of the squadron to the CV, ok you press F and you go back to the CV, but then no 12 3 keys, then after the flying planes arrive, it turns back to work, I think that is what is happening, python attached. I want to thank you for your hard work on the 0.8 test, it was fun to learn to fly and fight with  the planes, but after this 3 rounds and hours and hours of playing , I´m tired of playing the CVs , my contribution to the battle  is minimal and I lose too many planes to the High Tier AAs,  I can help spotting and adding some damage and even sink some  ships here and there  but it became so frustrating  that it became boring, so I thought  wait a second , why am I playing CVs if I have lots of fun every night playing with the other ships ? Many thanks again for the hard work. Cheers.

python.log

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They may need to take out IJN CVs until they fixed their planes if there is no PTS round 3, USN CVs are currently OK. 

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I don't know about anyone else but I never had any issue putting Squadrons up. I understand they have a cooldown but I got fairly stupid losing aircraft but always seemed to have another squad waiting. Between this and the RPF skill on the squadrons, I am very concerned that carriers might be way to strong at the ends of games.  " I would like to thank Jingles for pointing out the RPF issue as I did not test it." 

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Lead A6M2 of CV Ryujo has graphical artifacts at right side wing root. Mentioned this before but nothing was done.

Also noticed that the damage done by torpedoes is not very high. So did a little research. Tier 6 and above

IJN CV's: Damage done by one torpedo. Ryujo=6500, Shokaku=7237 , Hakuryu=10,333 4 Torpedoes dropped at a time

USN CV's Ranger=5567, Lexington=6467 3 Torpedoes dropped at a time, Midway=5367 But in this case 6 torpedoes are dropped at a time.

Seems pretty close. But as far as a single torp hitting a target IJN wins out slightly.

 

 

Edited by JustinOldDude

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Provided if IJN planes doesn’t get turn into Swiss cheese first. 

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4 hours ago, alex08060 said:

Provided if IJN planes doesn’t get turn into Swiss cheese first. 

Yep they are made of balsa wood!  Not very tough.

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repost from another thread to share my thoughts here.

I think the rework is a step in the right direction but I feel it still needs a lot of work. I was not a cv player before. I played them a little mostly for missions. Now I am able to do 40k+ at tier 4 every game with ease, at tier 6 I was doing 60k+, I did struggle at tier 8 because the AA gets better and I was learning how to avoid flak so I struggled a lot. By tier 10 I had pretty much got the hang of avoiding flak and was doing 90k+ every game.

My biggest issues are the following, with my personal feeling of the solution following the -

1) flak is to easy to avoid once you get the hang of it. - I think flak needs to be a lot more random so it is much harder to avoid

2) flak is to brutal if you make a mistake and fly into it - lower the damage done from flak explosions so they don't just auto delete a squadron

3) continues AA dmg is way to weak. as long as you avoid the flak you can fly around 3-4 ships and it doesn't matter. - I feel continues AA needs to be doubled, tripled, or more so you have to leave the AA range between runs.

4) HE bombs seem pretty weak at the moment. - they just need a flat buff

5) lack of AA range it makes it almost impossible to provide AA support for friendlies - either increase the base range of AA or let the skills/upgrades increase the range like they use to.

So what I would do is make the flak more random so it is hard to avoid it all. cut flak dmg in half, triple continues AA dmg and then tweak as needed for balance from there. HE bombs not sure maybe a higher pen would do it, not sure their pen now so not sure how much it needs to go up by. I would also put the range bonus back on captain skills and upgrades and again tweak it down as needed to reach a good balance.

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