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Cit_the_bed

If you change fire duration for Stalingrad and Kronshtadt you must offer refund ability

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I spend too much time and XP to have ship nerfed. Whole game change, I can understand (stealth fire change, etc)

Focused change that only affects expensive to get ships after you have already taken my time and money? Not acceptable.

Refund ability must be given.

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We already have so many threads on this. Why do we need a new one?

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Dude! Both boats are much in the edge of being OP. Some extra seconds on fire won’t change that. I have spec’d my Kronstadt Captain for fire prevention already today. Love that ship but I am aware it’s a tad too much. I am ok and happy with this change. Don’t own Balansgrad but meet her frequently. Don’t think this very little soft nerf will do her any bad. The opposite is true - it’s actually a good idea.

 

No need for a refund option at all. 

 

 

Edited by lron_Dog_of_Jutland
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If a small fire duration increase changes the ships to be unplayable... perhaps you shouldn't have bought them in the first place.

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My company start adding extra vacation days for nightshift two years ago. I want those also for the other 22 years I worked nightshifts. If you don't give it to me, I will quit. I wasted so much time working for you...

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All the tech tree ships require time to achieve. Some, even use money to achieve them, and yet they must suffer said ship getting nerfed. So, do we refund all players every time a ship in this game changes in a way they may not like? Every little nerf? No, we don't. 

Simply put Stalingrad, Kronstadt, Alaska and Azuma are not true premiums, and I believe that was intentional (and why Jean Bart in the store was a mistake) because they are technically not premiums sold in a store - they are a ship one can, and should, work to. Which means that they can tweak balance however they need and want to without the legal ramifications of changing a product they sold as technically they did not sell it. JB currently being the only coal/steel ship that they can't touch unless there's another legal loophole they have. 

That, and while we can debate on the legitimacy of it - they chose their words carefully for a reason. "All "super cruisers" will have their fire duration set to 60 seconds" which brings them in line with other similar ships, balanced as BB's in game - but identifies it as a global change to a type of ship that applies to those 4, Hood, and maybe Kongo and Scharn/Gnei while still excluding Graf Spee. Meaning that technically it is an overall change, not a targeted change, and therefore, allowable.

 

Look, I don't agree with the change, I think they should stay at 45 seconds, or at most up it to 50 seconds and that applies to Alaska, Azuma, and any future battlecruisers. or "Super Cruisers" if that's what they want to call them. But quite frankly, they have covered every legal basis possible that allows them to make changes to those two ships, without a need to give anyone a refund. 

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1 hour ago, Cit_the_bed said:

I spend too much time and XP to have ship nerfed. Whole game change, I can understand (stealth fire change, etc)

Focused change that only affects expensive to get ships after you have already taken my time and money? Not acceptable.

Refund ability must be given.

FXP and Steel are free in-game currencies. Why should you get a refund? Isn't it just like any other ship change to tech tree ships? You buy those with free in-game currencies.

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1 hour ago, Cit_the_bed said:

I spend too much time and XP to have ship nerfed. Whole game change, I can understand (stealth fire change, etc)

Focused change that only affects expensive to get ships after you have already taken my time and money? Not acceptable.

Refund ability must be given.

What if the Fire duration is nerfed, but shell damage or fire chance is raised?

Not every change to premium vehicles with Wargaming is a nerf. For example in World of Tanks Blitz they nerfed Premium Ammo so that the Premium AP Ammo still could one but little less damage than regular Ammo, HEAT ammo similar kind of thing, but also tracks and spaced amor could safely absorb the damage same as it does with HE. And of course HESH has its limits and counters.

The result in tanks was some of my favorite premium and regular tanks were Buffed. This was accomplished because when they seemingly were taking “nerfs” they were in fact taking armor buffs. And if your aim is reasonable you did not need the premium Ammo much anyway thanks to the AP being more than sufficient.

So before crying foul on changes to premium ships and regular ships like the matter of the fire duration. Step back and take a look at all aspects of the matter since you may find something delightful. Of course once in a while there is a legitimate problem across the board, but since the focus is on premium vehicles there usually is compensation in performance or else Wargaming would look really bad for doing such th Now and it could hurt their sales.

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6 minutes ago, WanderingGhost said:

"All "super cruisers" will have their fire duration set to 60 seconds" which brings them in line with other similar ships, balanced as BB's in game - but identifies it as a global change to a type of ship that applies to those 4, Hood, and maybe Kongo and Scharn/Gnei while still excluding Graf Spee.

My understanding is that they are treated as BBs and already get BB fire durations.

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7 minutes ago, WanderingGhost said:

All the tech tree ships require time to achieve. Some, even use money to achieve them, and yet they must suffer said ship getting nerfed. So, do we refund all players every time a ship in this game changes in a way they may not like? Every little nerf? No, we don't. 

Simply put Stalingrad, Kronstadt, Alaska and Azuma are not true premiums, and I believe that was intentional (and why Jean Bart in the store was a mistake) because they are technically not premiums sold in a store - they are a ship one can, and should, work to. Which means that they can tweak balance however they need and want to without the legal ramifications of changing a product they sold as technically they did not sell it. JB currently being the only coal/steel ship that they can't touch unless there's another legal loophole they have. 

That, and while we can debate on the legitimacy of it - they chose their words carefully for a reason. "All "super cruisers" will have their fire duration set to 60 seconds" which brings them in line with other similar ships, balanced as BB's in game - but identifies it as a global change to a type of ship that applies to those 4, Hood, and maybe Kongo and Scharn/Gnei while still excluding Graf Spee. Meaning that technically it is an overall change, not a targeted change, and therefore, allowable.

 

Look, I don't agree with the change, I think they should stay at 45 seconds, or at most up it to 50 seconds and that applies to Alaska, Azuma, and any future battlecruisers. or "Super Cruisers" if that's what they want to call them. But quite frankly, they have covered every legal basis possible that allows them to make changes to those two ships, without a need to give anyone a refund. 

Graf Spee is a special case due to the fact it only has 6 main guns that are 12’ BB guns. Reload is slow than other CAs, but they hit harder and so chances of doing much fire damage is lower. Honestly I rarely use HE on Graf Spee since the AP seems to keep good pen right out to its max range and the ability to citadel ships and do AP damage which repair parties can heal less on are good perks.

Not sure we will ever hear much about Graf Spee needing nerfs because it fire spammed ships to death anymore than main guns on some regular BB  main guns do, except of course for some RN BBs that were purpose built to fire Spam by Wargaming.

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I bitched like hell years ago when the Sims was heavily nerfed with the introduction of the high arcing USN guns.   The ship went from being a OP joy to play to nearly mediocre overnight.  It was a cash purchase and it was a global nerf.  If they didn't credit us with all the screaming back then...they damn sure aren't going to do it now.

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Well, even if they offer a refound, i wouldnt do it for my Kron. But ill be very disapointed with WG. Considering that only two released ships are being affected by this change (Kron and Stalingrad) they cant even use the excuse of "global change". Also, why Graf Spee isnt affected by this change? Its a super crusier too. 

 

If they go with this, this creates a precedent of nerfing premiums that will make me think twice before buying more premium ships.

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Can we all agree that nerfing a ship AFTER a ton of them got bought smells just a wee bit rank? 

"Lets put all these Ford Pintos on sale before Consumer reports hits the stands!" 

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15 minutes ago, Erebthoron said:

My company start adding extra vacation days for nightshift two years ago. I want those also for the other 22 years I worked nightshifts. If you don't give it to me, I will quit. I wasted so much time working for you...

Your ridiculous example doesn't work here at all and barely makes sense. I would assume English is not your first language and if it is. Well....

....

I gave you widget A and I took your money. You used widget A and liked it. I then came in and I changed it to be less effective at its job and told you to bad that's what you have to deal with now. Even though you paid for something that works differently this is what you get now. You will take it and like it. 

Oh, yes you could quit your job or you could transfer to the night shift. Both are something you can do but you can't get your funds back for something that was different when you bought it if they don't offer. 

Something tells me this went right over your head

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4 minutes ago, MasterofGladness said:

Your ridiculous example doesn't work here at all and barely makes sense. I would assume English is not your first language and if it is. Well....

....

I gave you widget A and I took your money. You used widget A and liked it. I then came in and I changed it to be less effective at its job and told you to bad that's what you have to deal with now. Even though you paid for something that works differently this is what you get now. You will take it and like it. 

Oh, yes you could quit your job or you could transfer to the night shift. Both are something you can do but you can't get your funds back for something that was different when you bought it if they don't offer. 

Something tells me this went right over your head

It's a more sincer demand then asking for a refund of ingame currency because of a minor ship nerf.

And yes, not a native speaker and I'm just typing here while I do work in a complete other language. SInce I'm already do multitasking here, I'm getting to old to add another task.

 

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WG, like any other software company, reserves the right to change ships - period and anyone who plays - agrees to this.  Don't like it - you should not have started to play.

Edited by CylonRed
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26 minutes ago, Sir_Davos_Seaworth said:

Can we all agree that nerfing a ship AFTER a ton of them got bought smells just a wee bit rank? 

"Lets put all these Ford Pintos on sale before Consumer reports hits the stands!" 

Pretty much how the Pinto played out, actually.

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Oh no, your OP ship is....still OP. I mean seriously, give me a break. Are you saying you wouln't have bought it if the fire duration was 60sec instead of 45?

Also, it states right in the EULA that WG can change whatever the hell they want, so you have no case here.

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What happens to those people who got Kronstadt from a crate? Does that become a 750K XP refund? Because... that would be huge for me o.o

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Well said I spend 750000 free xp to get the Kronshtadt. 

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1 hour ago, Rickjoshi1765 said:

But the Xp you used was free.  Go get more like the rest of us

Or was it?

OP might be screaming and raging because they paid money to convert XP for Kronshtadt, although most if not all Stalingrads in the game right now are probably still from Ranked and Snowflake steel.

However, I note with distaste that OP's user name references the act of faecal incontinence, and the standard of their thinking on this matter is not much more pleasant IMO.

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Guys these ships are available for free. With the expection of Jean Bart these ships were  not premium ships.You have to grind for them just like ships in the tech tree. As in the tech tree grind some people choose to convert doubloons to free xp to run up the tech tree faster but that was a chose a person makes for  you to  not spend the time to grind out xp to get these . It's no different with these ships some people chose to convert free xp with doubloons to get these ships faster instead of for free thus war gaming can do whatever the wish to these. Remember the main word is you could have gotten these for free. If you spent money it was your chose not to get it for free. Stalingrad is a reward ship or can get with steel also something you can get for free if you decide to spend the time and join an active clan.

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