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liangshepherd

Can we treat the cv drivers like all other drivers?

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When I team up my friend, who exclusively plays cv, I notice there are disproportional blames on him when things don't go well. He is a decent driver with a PR of 1700 in cv. Granted, he is still new to the tier 10 and he is having some troubles dealing with some much experienced cv players. I am a worse player and I only play cruisers and  bbs and I almost never get blamed.

Today we went up against a very good cv player (win rate on Midway over 60% in 1000 battles). We barely won the first one and lose the second one. And in the second one, multiple players requested air cover, requested spotting a dd and such and such. When inevitably we got bombed into oblivion, they deemed that my friend is a really bad cv player and place all the blames on him. I don't know if it counts anything, but we end up in the top spots on both games. Is it really fair, to always have the cv player as an escape goat?

I notice the dds and cvs, which have larger impact on the game, would easily be mocked/blamed in the game comparing to cruisers or bbs. When things go well, everyone would think they are a big part of it. But when things go to hell, which is roughly 50% of the time, maybe we should not just throw the teammates under the bus? It is not the player's fault when the ships they play have a larger impact on the game.  

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12 minutes ago, liangshepherd said:

I notice the dds and cvs, which have larger impact on the game, would easily be mocked/blamed in the game comparing to cruisers or bbs. When things go well, everyone would think they are a big part of it. But when things go to hell, which is roughly 50% of the time, maybe we should not just throw the teammates under the bus? It is not the player's fault when the ships they play have a larger impact on the game.  

CVs will always get the blame, and I feel it is usually justified. No one ship has so much say on how the match goes. It may not be your fault that the other CV is a unicum, but many will still blame you for NOT being a unicum. I have heard people actually cursing out a 55% win rate cv when he was up against a 65%er. The ranters were basically saying that he should have played a different class of ship and then the CV would have been stuck in cue and the team wouldn't have had to face it.

I personally hate CVs and feel they imbalance the game, but I understand the frustration on both sides.

Edited by Prothall
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CVs hold a lot more responsibility on field control and general tide of battle, much more than any other ship class in the entire game. A lot of times, CVs do get a lot of blame, some of it reasonable, but not quite at the same time. It's important to communicate and see what your team wants to do and support their cause. A lot of blame comes from miscommunication, and is a fault on both ends. 

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19 minutes ago, liangshepherd said:

When I team up my friend, who exclusively plays cv, I notice there are disproportional blames on him when things don't go well. He is a decent driver with a PR of 1700 in cv. Granted, he is still new to the tier 10 and he is having some troubles dealing with some much experienced cv players. I am a worse player and I only play cruisers and  bbs and I almost never get blamed.

Today we went up against a very good cv player (win rate on Midway over 60% in 1000 battles). We barely won the first one and lose the second one. And in the second one, multiple players requested air cover, requested spotting a dd and such and such. When inevitably we got bombed into oblivion, they deemed that my friend is a really bad cv player and place all the blames on him. I don't know if it counts anything, but we end up in the top spots on both games. Is it really fair, to always have the cv player as an escape goat?

I notice the dds and cvs, which have larger impact on the game, would easily be mocked/blamed in the game comparing to cruisers or bbs. When things go well, everyone would think they are a big part of it. But when things go to hell, which is roughly 50% of the time, maybe we should not just throw the teammates under the bus? It is not the player's fault when the ships they play have a larger impact on the game.  

Nope. They are choosing to bring a CV into random therefore plaguing other players, they better know how to play it or gtfo quite frankly. If your CV wasn't in que we might not have had one that match. Simple. If you do bring it you better be better than the other guy. If you can't play one well keep it to COOP where no one has to suffer for your entertainment.

 

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1 minute ago, xalmgrey said:

Nope. They are choosing to bring a CV into random therefore plaguing other players, they better know how to play it or gtfo quite frankly. If your CV wasn't in que we might not have had one that match. Simple. If you do bring it you better be better than the other guy. If you can't play one well keep it to COOP where no one has to suffer for your entertainment.

 

Spoken like a true elitist. Maybe your suffering IS their entertainment

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4 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

Nope. They are choosing to bring a CV into random therefore plaguing other players, they better know how to play it or gtfo quite frankly. If your CV wasn't in que we might not have had one that match. Simple. If you do bring it you better be better than the other guy. If you can't play one well keep it to COOP where no one has to suffer for your entertainment.

 

Right, because you have the authority to tell other people based on their stats and effort in that specific class that they have no right to play CVs and they should either git gud or gtfo. People like you just show how toxic and backward thinking the wows playerbase can be. 

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25 minutes ago, liangshepherd said:

When I team up my friend, who exclusively plays cv, I notice there are disproportional blames on him when things don't go well. He is a decent driver with a PR of 1700 in cv. Granted, he is still new to the tier 10 and he is having some troubles dealing with some much experienced cv players. I am a worse player and I only play cruisers and  bbs and I almost never get blamed.

 

This is because the CV cannot be carried. Any normal ship can be carried, even a whole crappy team can be carried by a good div -- the other day my div mates and I accounted for 11 Reds in one match. But a crappy CV drags his whole team down, making good play by others pretty much useless. 

If he can't play CV at a high level he should not be loading into high tier matches. It is partly because of players like your friend that I no longer play high tiers. I got tired of losing because we got the 39% Midway and Red got the 63% Hak. 

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7 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

Nope. They are choosing to bring a CV into random therefore plaguing other players, they better know how to play it or gtfo quite frankly. If your CV wasn't in que we might not have had one that match. Simple. If you do bring it you better be better than the other guy. If you can't play one well keep it to COOP where no one has to suffer for your entertainment.

 

Anyone sub-100% in CVs needs to get out of this thread.

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1 minute ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

Right, because you have the authority to tell other people based on their stats and effort in that specific class that they have no right to play CVs and they should either git gud or gtfo. People like you just show how toxic and backward thinking the wows playerbase can be. 

It's not a question of "right". If you are selfish enough to bring a CV you can't play to a competitive match involving other humans, you deserve the abuse you get. 

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27 minutes ago, liangshepherd said:

When I team up my friend, who exclusively plays cv, I notice there are disproportional blames on him when things don't go well. He is a decent driver with a PR of 1700 in cv. Granted, he is still new to the tier 10 and he is having some troubles dealing with some much experienced cv players. I am a worse player and I only play cruisers and  bbs and I almost never get blamed.

Today we went up against a very good cv player (win rate on Midway over 60% in 1000 battles). We barely won the first one and lose the second one. And in the second one, multiple players requested air cover, requested spotting a dd and such and such. When inevitably we got bombed into oblivion, they deemed that my friend is a really bad cv player and place all the blames on him. I don't know if it counts anything, but we end up in the top spots on both games. Is it really fair, to always have the cv player as an escape goat?

I notice the dds and cvs, which have larger impact on the game, would easily be mocked/blamed in the game comparing to cruisers or bbs. When things go well, everyone would think they are a big part of it. But when things go to hell, which is roughly 50% of the time, maybe we should not just throw the teammates under the bus? It is not the player's fault when the ships they play have a larger impact on the game.  

It isn't your friend's fault that he had to go against a super unicum and then get blamed for his plays. CVs are a pretty sensitive topic more than ever, and people are very easy to blame them if something goes wrong. This coupled with the winter holidays can easily ignite arguments in the chat. 

 

My advice is to just ignore them and play to your heart's content. If you lose too much, you might just want to either call it a day or change classes for a couple games. Unless your friend is really bad at cvs and has no idea what they are doing, it is not his fault. 

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12 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

Nope. They are choosing to bring a CV into random therefore plaguing other players, they better know how to play it or gtfo quite frankly. If your CV wasn't in que we might not have had one that match. Simple. If you do bring it you better be better than the other guy. If you can't play one well keep it to COOP where no one has to suffer for your entertainment.

 

That's a bit harsh, IMO.  Someone can be a very average player, and even average in CVs.  But if that player runs into a CV unicums main in a battle, he's screwed.  It's NOT his fault.  It's the fault of the design of carriers, and a big reason for this rework.

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5 minutes ago, Crucis said:

That's a bit harsh, IMO.  Someone can be a very average player, and even average in CVs.  But if that player runs into a CV unicums main in a battle, he's screwed.  It's NOT his fault.  It's the fault of the design of carriers, and a big reason for this rework.

A bit harsh and yet the reality. The reality being is whomever picking to bring a CV into a game is signing everyone else up to play with it. So blame is good where blame is due.

Really this feeling that keeps people from playing CV's because of how they are treated is honestly fine with me at this point if it keeps them nice and rare. I'm sick of battles being dictated by one ship.

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CV unlike other ship have the very same playstyle from T4 to T10.

 

Putting aside the AA, if you can't succeed a torps attack on a T6 BB, you won't necessarily succeed your torps attack with a T10. However if you can cross drop DD at T10, then you should have no issue doing the same at T6. 

 

Now the big, BIG complain I have regarding CV is the impact it has. You can't carry a CV game without bringing another CV. Therefore if you're in a CV game with a garbage CV player against a unicum CV player, there is 99% chance you lose. A unicum DD will have no where as much impact as a unicum CV even though it's probably the ship that hold the most impact regarding outcome outside of CVs. While loosing a CA / BB or DD can be manageable, loosing a CV is loosing 2/3 of the game. Have fun having your ship perma spotted as a DD by an aircraft you can't take down because you don't have Def AA nor good AA. Good luck trying create crossfire when your team is being forced to move as a blob to not get ambush and hit by the CV.

 

I'll never treat a CV player the same way I treat a BB player as long as CV will have so much impact on the game. Is it the player's fault for being not as good as the other CV ? No. Blame the game for that. 

 

 

Edited by AlcatrazNC

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21 minutes ago, BoJohno said:

Spoken like a true elitist. Maybe your suffering IS their entertainment

Spoken like a true greedy person who plagues others for his entertainment. You bring it and suck you get the salt. Its that simple.

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I didn't expect this post would be another cv thread battleground. My intention is just promoting a bit of civility in the game during the holiday. For some of you, clearly you are very angry at how things are with the cv.  I agree with you that one ship should not dictate the game. But yelling at a cv player would not make things better.

But again, reasoning doesn't seem to go well on the internet...

 

 

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16 minutes ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

It isn't your friend's fault that he had to go against a super unicum and then get blamed for his plays. CVs are a pretty sensitive topic more than ever, and people are very easy to blame them if something goes wrong. This coupled with the winter holidays can easily ignite arguments in the chat. 

 

My advice is to just ignore them and play to your heart's content. If you lose too much, you might just want to either call it a day or change classes for a couple games. Unless your friend is really bad at cvs and has no idea what they are doing, it is not his fault. 

So keep playing randoms in your CV even if you can't play it dragging your team down. Nice advice. Keep on ruining the time for other players instead of practicing in COOP where you waste no ones time.

Great advice, if you love salt.

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9 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

So keep playing randoms in your CV even if you can't play it dragging your team down. Nice advice. Keep on ruining the time for other players instead of practicing in COOP where you waste no ones time.

Pretty sure he's playing for his enjoyment, not yours.

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23 minutes ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

It isn't your friend's fault that he had to go against a super unicum and then get blamed for his plays. CVs are a pretty sensitive topic more than ever, and people are very easy to blame them if something goes wrong. This coupled with the winter holidays can easily ignite arguments in the chat. 

 

My advice is to just ignore them and play to your heart's content. If you lose too much, you might just want to either call it a day or change classes for a couple games. Unless your friend is really bad at cvs and has no idea what they are doing, it is not his fault. 

Thank you. My friend is doing just fine, his win rate is above average. But by the look of the thread, it seems that only the best cv players are allowed to play in random. And all the best cv players can be trained in co-op until they are 100% sure that they can take down anyone.

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1 minute ago, BoJohno said:

Pretty sure he's playing for his enjoyment, not yours.

What do you think the other people on the team are playing for? Your enjoyment affects them severely. When should people start considering others feelings instead of just their own? Never because its online and F2P?

So now that we got it settled that you don't care what you do to your team, i don't feel bad about slinging the salt at the CV when they come in and ruin MY fun. So there you go. We've gained nothing.

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3 minutes ago, liangshepherd said:

Thank you. My friend is doing just fine, his win rate is above average. But by the look of the thread, it seems that only the best cv players are allowed to play in random. And all the best cv players can be trained in co-op until they are 100% sure that they can take down anyone.

Or you can just accept that salt comes with the CV and suck it up or don't bring it in. Instead you make a plea to a community that largely hates CV's.

Really the thread feels more like trolling.

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3 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

What do you think the other people on the team are playing for? Your enjoyment affects them severely. When should people start considering others feelings instead of just their own?

I would imagine the other people are playing because they like the game. If he has a ship for that tier he's just as entitled to play a match as you are. He plays his best and has fun. Most people I assume do the same. If how well someone else plays a video game "affects you severely" or is "inconsiderate of your feelings" in all honesty I think you need to re-assess your priorities and remember why you started playing in the first place. It's been made abundantly clear you're not a fan of CV's, but attitude like your are the reason new players aren't making the move to random in any ship.

 

11 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

So now that we got it settled that you don't care what you do to your team

Half true. I play my best every match. Sometimes good, sometimes not so much. Do I play to meet their expectations? No. I play to have fun. Do I care if I don't meet those expectations? Nope. Still playing to have fun. Does a complete strangers opinion of my skill level in a game that actually means nothing matter? Still nope. 

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9 minutes ago, BoJohno said:

I would imagine the other people are playing because they like the game. If he has a ship for that tier he's just as entitled to play a match as you are. He plays his best and has fun. Most people I assume do the same. If how well someone else plays a video game "affects you severely" or is "inconsiderate of your feelings" in all honesty I think you need to re-assess your priorities and remember why you started playing in the first place. It's been made abundantly clear you're not a fan of CV's, but attitude like your are the reason new players aren't making the move to random in any ship.

 

Half true. I play my best every match. Sometimes good, sometimes not so much. Do I play to meet their expectations? No. I play to have fun. Do I care if I don't meet those expectations? Nope. Still playing to have fun. Does a complete strangers opinion of my skill level in a game that actually means nothing matter? Still nope. 

No, i'm done like you considering others feelings. I feel just entitled to have fun just as you. If you bring something that ruins the match expect the hate that comes with it. Game after game i'm done with patience of this type. And i'm not alone. The players that hate CV's FAR out number the players that don't.

Don't expect sympathy in this community with CV's. Wrong place to ask for it.

 

If you feel pressured to NOT play them for whatever reason, GOOD! One less problem CV in que is a win for most of us.

Edited by xalmgrey
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Actually this just means CV is actually quite OP since they are so dominating and every non CV blame them if the CV driver is a noob or not gud enough to win a battle. 

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1 minute ago, xalmgrey said:

Don't expect sympathy in this community with CV's. Wrong place to ask for it.

For the record, I'm not a CV player. I also understand in the forums at least they aren't particularly popular. Unless I completely misunderstood the OP's intent he wasn't asking for sympathy for CV's either. He was simply asking that another player doing his best not be treated like crap. What exactly "ruins" a match? Attitudes like that are why some people avoid random all together. As long as you play to your own expectations, that's all that should matter. If your enjoyment of the game is based on the performance of others, once again I think your priorities are skewed. But whatever. To each their own. 

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Just now, BoJohno said:

For the record, I'm not a CV player. I also understand in the forums at least they aren't particularly popular. Unless I completely misunderstood the OP's intent he wasn't asking for sympathy for CV's either. He was simply asking that another player doing his best not be treated like crap. What exactly "ruins" a match? Attitudes like that are why some people avoid random all together. As long as you play to your own expectations, that's all that should matter. If your enjoyment of the game is based on the performance of others, once again I think your priorities are skewed. But whatever. To each their own. 

You can blame WG for the salt. When they put 14 players together with the sole victory to win using a MM that doesn't consider skill levels mixing in great and not so great players together its going to cause friction. Pairing people that want to win with casuals that don't give a crap is a recipe for what we have now. A skill based MM would alleviate a lot of this but thats a whole other discussion.

 

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