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xalmgrey

So played the new CV's

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So after playing a few rounds on the test server a few things come to mind:

AA needs more flak, its not very punishing. I don't really worry about plane loss due to the fact that i can be in the air in one group at a time only so if you mess up it's really just another chance to play a different squadron. The feeling that losing my planes means i'm useless in game is gone making AA less of a concern at all. I kept buzzing around the same ships over and over which is exactly what i'm going to hate come live. Being harassed like this without any real way to fight back actively. I can't imagine 3 CV's picking one guy in a game. It would be over for them right away. I'm really concerned about all these DoT's being added. Its hard enough now to judge when to use DCP due to being on fire nearly all the time now and its looking to get worse. Is DCP going to see some kind of buffing? It is not fun to have DoT's running like mad on your ship. People hate being on fire now with HE, they won't like what these carriers bring at all.

I do actually like following the planes with the new FPS feeling it is a nice change to me, diving at the enemy and flying low for a torp run but it feels so incredibly removed from WoWS game play. It feels like a whole other game inside this one. So in the end the biggest problem with the new carrier iteration like the last will be skill level disparity. This new system will not come easy to everyone. It feels removed from the scaled pace of the game.

I honestly don't like where this is going personally. I love the combat the game has now with the three ship classes (AKA when you get lucky and there's no CV's in the game). It feels right. You add this CV and once again you add something that just ruins the great balance it has with the rock, paper, scissors system by adding a chainsaw to it.

 

Edited by xalmgrey
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The main problems that WG are supposedly fixing aren't being addressed at all. WoWs PC is basically the testbed for WoWs XBOX, and we are the lab rats for this test. 

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1 minute ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

The main problems that WG are supposedly fixing aren't being addressed at all. WoWs PC is basically the testbed for WoWs XBOX, and we are the lab rats for this test. 

And honestly that is what it feels like.

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2 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

So after playing a few rounds on the test server a few things come to mind:

AA needs more flak, its not very punishing. I don't really worry about plane loss due to the fact that i can be in the air in one group at a time only so if you mess up it's really just another chance to play a different squadron. The feeling that losing my planes means i'm useless in game is gone making AA less of a concern at all. I kept buzzing around the same ships over and over which is exactly what i'm going to hate come live. Being harassed like this without any real way to fight back actively. I can't imagine 3 CV's picking one guy in a game. It would be over for them right away. I'm really concerned about all these DoT's being added. Its hard enough now to judge when to use DCP due to being on fire nearly all the time now and its looking to get worse. Is DCP going to see some kind of buffing? It is not fun to have DoT's running like mad on your ship. People hate being on fire now with HE, they won't like what these carriers bring at all.

I do actually like following the planes with the new FPS feeling it is a nice change to me, diving at the enemy and flying low for a torp run but it feels so incredibly removed from WoWS game play. It feels like a whole other game inside this one. So in the end the biggest problem with the new carrier iteration like the last will be skill level disparity. This new system will not come easy to everyone. It feels removed from the scaled pace of the game.

I honestly don't like where this is going personally. I love the combat the game has now with the three ship classes. It feels right. You add this CV and once again you add something that just ruins the great balance it has with the rock, paper, scissors system by adding a chainsaw to it.

 

And this was exactly my concern after watching the videos that are out....:Smile_amazed:

Spending you're time turning in circles while the planes wait out your dfaa or simply look for their best shot at you. Fun and engaging?

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1 minute ago, awiggin said:

And this was exactly my concern after watching the videos that are out....:Smile_amazed:

Spending you're time turning in circles while the planes wait out your dfaa or simply look for their best shot at you. Fun and engaging?

I don't know how enjoyable people and going to find having to put yourself broadside to the enemy constantly because you are dodging torps and using AA that doesn't seem to do much to deter the enemy from pounding your face in. CV's will have just as much influence over the game as they do now, just in a different way.

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19 minutes ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

The main problems that WG are supposedly fixing aren't being addressed at all. WoWs PC is basically the testbed for WoWs XBOX, and we are the lab rats for this test. 

If you spent any real amount of time on the console version I doubt you would say that.

Edited by Ruthless4u

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Consider the following:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

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2 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Consider the following:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

But the solution is to find a balance not a simple...this or that.

While the old system wasn't great...there was some counter-play between CVs and Def AA armed ships...currently there is very little and without the risk of being deplaned there really isn't any risk/reward for the CV and that's the natural balance between all the surface ships: CAs risk getting cit'd by BBs for hurling HE at them, DDs risk being spotted and countered by CAs for getting torp runs off etc ...

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14 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Consider the following:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

There's no battle between the CV and the target. It feels punishing to have something attack you over and over with no way to reply. Gamers don't like playing games that leave them powerless. Fighting the CV iteration coming does leave you feeling powerless with the current AA. Specially knowing that the CV will just come again with new planes. The war of attrition is gone, and that was an important balance aspect of CV's they did get right. AA should punish planes, specially certain ships. It's not that way anymore with infinite planes. You don't feel like the CV payed for anything he did at you even if you shot planes down because he is magically making more.

Edited by xalmgrey
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5 minutes ago, xalmgrey said:

There's no battle between the CV and the target. It feels punishing to have something attack you over and over with no way to reply. Gamers don't like playing games that leave them powerless. Fighting the CV iteration coming does leave you feeling powerless with the current AA. Specially knowing that the CV will just come again with new planes. The war of attrition is gone, and that was an important balance aspect of CV's they did get right. AA should punish planes, specially certain ships. It's not that way anymore with infinite planes. You don't feel like the CV payed for anything he did at you even if you shot planes down because he is magically making more.

This x1000. As I said in a previous topic, a CV with infinite planes is as ridiculous as a BB with infinite HP.

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26 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

Expect it is a losing battle for the ship that should be winning, the AA CA.  Sure they might not nuke you out right but they are going to constantly chip away at you and with an unlimited supply of planes, you are going down.   From all the videos and streams I have seen, AA CAs are pointless on the test server.  I am installing the test client right now but I after watching Notser most recent video of him in an AA build Mino I am fully expecting to be disappointed.

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Watched Notser clip about DD's at the PTS. A full AA spec Gearing couldn't shot down one plane while he was constandly harassed.

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28 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Consider the following:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

Consider the following.

At least some of the ships in the old system can shoot down enough of the planes that the carrier can't kill them on a whim.  In the old system, my Hindy and Des Moines both have several battles with almost 60 planes shot down, and most of those were because the enemy carrier tried to kill me, lost all its planes in the first attempt, and spent most of the rest of the battle looking for easier targets.

In the new system, the carrier takes a bit longer to kill whatever it targets, but they're still dead, and none of the ships can fight back or do anything to mitigate it other than desperately weaving and dodging.

 

 

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37 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

Consider the following:

A ship in the new system can survive constant harassment by a single CV. In the current system: If that carrier wants you dead, you're dead. So constant harassment may be annoying, but it will be survivable.

Disagree about the current system. Several ships can survive CV strikes alone especially high tier US BB and CA/L with aft/bft. I deplaned a Midway in a Alabama, and I tend to bunch up with USN bbs and shred planes.

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11 minutes ago, Bril01 said:

Expect it is a losing battle for the ship that should be winning, the AA CA.  Sure they might not nuke you out right but they are going to constantly chip away at you and with an unlimited supply of planes, you are going down.   From all the videos and streams I have seen, AA CAs are pointless on the test server.  I am installing the test client right now but I after watching Notser most recent video of him in an AA build Mino I am fully expecting to be disappointed.

Wonder how much AA you get if you don't switch the sectors all the time. One guy a reddit bragged he shot down 70+ planes while never using AA sectors.

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Just now, Erebthoron said:

Wonder how much AA you get if you don't switch the sectors all the time. One guy a reddit bragged he shot down 70+ planes while never using AA sectors.

Well considering it takes up to 15 seconds for the switch to take place, it would be possible.  I mean if you are being strafed back and forth by a wave, you would probably be better off not resetting it as you would probably end up chasing the planes.  By the time your sector reset, the wave would already be passing over.

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4 minutes ago, Bril01 said:

Well considering it takes up to 15 seconds for the switch to take place, it would be possible.  I mean if you are being strafed back and forth by a wave, you would probably be better off not resetting it as you would probably end up chasing the planes.  By the time your sector reset, the wave would already be passing over.

Still, this defies the reason why they add this option to the game.

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WG, do you get the feeling that you can please ALL the players SOME of the time and SOME of the players ALL the time but you can't please ALL the players ALL the time?

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4 minutes ago, Th3KrimzonD3mon said:

CV balance change #1 had dang well better be limiting the hangers of the CV's.

Yeah agreed. With the current AA iteration, giving CV's infinite planes is not a good idea. There should be a moment where a CV player has to gamble his planes to make the hit. With infinite planes you don't have to worry at all.

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17 minutes ago, wstugamd said:

I deplaned a Midway in a Alabama

You shot down 116 Tier 10 aircraft with an Alabama? Lol, no.

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There's no torpedo bombers in tier 4 and by tier 8 planes take up to a full minute to get one up to flight deck...

...it's not enough............

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Just come from a match in my DM where a Midway was able to strike me through defensive fire multiple times, with rockets and dive bombers, doing about 5k per run. VERY BALANS. Now that's not a lot compared to current but the damage adds up, and the most important part of it all being that i was in a Des Moines. (also that there was nothing i could do besides hope in my aa with defensive fire, which did [edited] all to save me)

The only enjoyable thing about that match was deleting his Worcester butt buddy in 3 salvos, American Piercing rounds are great.

Edited by clowlock

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Most of my frustration with the up and coming CV is this:

If i'm out of position currently with the rock/paper/scissors system i can be punished accordingly for it and if it was because i was horribly out of position / flanked i can learn from that. I can say "well i shouldn't have pushed my BB into a cap in the start of a game with no spotting and be mad i got torped by the DD waiting" it was my fault. I screwed up. I won't do that again. Or getting caught broadside to a BB in a cruiser and being mad i got deleted.

There's a lesson for me to learn from my mistake and rectify it.

With what this CV is bringing feels like you are getting punished and there's nothing to learn from the encounter. Because it's one sided. You are relying on a pretty much automated system to fight off a player that has singled you out. The only thing i take from that is frustration. It makes what is normally fun and enjoyable not so much.

Yes i know its that way now with CV's except that if he runs at my Mo with his planes, he won't be doing it more than once. Plus i honestly don't see that many CV's around anymore to consider them a huge problem. I've also been having more of a blast in randoms because of it.

Edit: Just look at Clan Battles. CV's are not allowed. Even WG knows they tilt the playing field too much to be considered taking serious. Something to consider.

Edited by xalmgrey
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