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Daniel_Allan_Clark

Multitasking Problems - Manual Secondaries

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So, now that Wargaming has posited that the majority of the player base is unable to do more than one thing at a time (steer ship and command aircraft)...can we remove the requirement to select the ship for my secondaries to fire upon when using the captain skill 'manual secondaries'?

 

Secondary builds are so rare...and the new meta of releasing light cruisers as destroyers (Harugamos, Khabarovsks, etc.) means the lack of survivability skills is enough of a drawback that merely applying the buff to all secondaries and allowing them to fire at all targets in range should be both a good quality of life change and a path to building more diversity in the BB captain skills.

 

What does the forum think? Why do CV players have their life easier than BB players?

Do we really think forcing a BB captain to have to drive his ship, aim his guns, deal with consumables, AND manage his secondary guns isn't too taxing?

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Isn´t too taxing, but... that change would be welcome, as the manual AA (fire without selecting, boost damage and precision if selecting)

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Yeah, just for grins, I think WG should implement it so that when you zoom in to aim, you can no longer steer your ship with WASD, only with the autopilot on the minimap. Clearly shooting and driving are too much for us to handle. I wonder how well that would go over.

 

 

 

Seriously, overall I like the CV rework. But for the love of all that is holy, allow us to use the consumables on the CV while flying. If I can steer with the minimap, and hit repair, fighter, heal, etc, while flying, I'll be happy. And I don't think it's that hard of a concept to grasp. Even better, allow us to put the planes in a holding pattern (just fly in circles where we leave them) and allow us to go back to the CV, and then return to the planes once we've dealt with the problem. If you can't handle that, don't use it. But forcing us to return the entire flight just to repair a flood is downright moronic.

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3 minutes ago, Fastwolf66 said:

Isn´t too taxing, but... that change would be welcome, as the manual AA (fire without selecting, boost damage and precision if selecting)

Because of the way AA currently works, the mechanics of the change would not be the same...manual AA applies a modifier to the DPS of the guns. Manual secondaries applies an accuracy buff to the guns whenever they fire. The requirement to select a target was meant as a means to prevent this skill from becoming a must have skill. WG does not have an easy means of applying multiple accuracy parameters to the same guns based on target selection.

 

I contend that the plethora of HE spam ships have made fire prevention and concealment expert so important that captains wishing to spec secondary would still have a hard choice to make.

 

This also burdens the BB captain with, according to WG CV logic, an unacceptable amount of multitasking...particularly in a brawl.

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I have many ships with secondary builds, and I've never had any issues selecting targets for those, or for AA. And, for giggles, I do all that while aiming my main guns, driving my ship, and communicating with my team and div mates.

 

It's really not hard, it just takes practice. Also, without MFCS, your secondaries already fire at virtually everything in range.

Edited by Th3KrimzonD3mon
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after cv rework, all ships need to select AA side or something like that? i think that's additional chore without merit

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Which post of mine past do you want to quote, why can't manual secondaries act like regular secondaries until you focus them? So many time I don't opt for manual because the tactical advantage of having the secondaries open fire automatically. They should act like normal until you use manual. I mean really, it costs four points.

Edited by Sovereigndawg
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3 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

So, now that Wargaming has posited that the majority of the player base is unable to do more than one thing at a time (steer ship and command aircraft)...can we remove the requirement to select the ship for my secondaries to fire upon when using the captain skill 'manual secondaries'?

 

Secondary builds are so rare...and the new meta of releasing light cruisers as destroyers (Harugamos, Khabarovsks, etc.) means the lack of survivability skills is enough of a drawback that merely applying the buff to all secondaries and allowing them to fire at all targets in range should be both a good quality of life change and a path to building more diversity in the BB captain skills.

 

What does the forum think? Why do CV players have their life easier than BB players?

Do we really think forcing a BB captain to have to drive his ship, aim his guns, deal with consumables, AND manage his secondary guns isn't too taxing?

No, but if there are two sides to a ship, and both sides have secondaries, we should be able to manually select targets on both sides of the ship.  

 

As as far as multitasking goes, just always designate targets for your secondaries even if you don’t have manual secondaries set up and you won’t notice you do it soon enough.  

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8 hours ago, comtedumas said:

No, but if there are two sides to a ship, and both sides have secondaries, we should be able to manually select targets on both sides of the ship.  

 

As as far as multitasking goes, just always designate targets for your secondaries even if you don’t have manual secondaries set up and you won’t notice you do it soon enough.  

Missing my point. Wargaming has ALREADY said that we can't handle doing more than one thing at a time.

 

So, therefore we should expect a quality of life improvement on the other classes, this being a win win for the players and the state of the gameplay meta.

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Battleships have ~30 second reloads. Like, what else are you doing during that time?

If you’re running a secondary focused build, don’t you think you should be focused on your secondaries?

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Clicking on a ship for manual secondaries and even planes for manual AA is not even close to driving a and running a CV.  One click - 2 max - and you are done and in a CV you are simply starting.  They are not even close to an equivalent in any way, shape, or form.  I can't remember which ships I have manual AA or secondaries so I always click on the planes/ships in any BB just in case. 

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5 minutes ago, Gavroche_ said:

Battleships have ~30 second reloads. Like, what else are you doing during that time?

If you’re running a secondary focused build, don’t you think you should be focused on your secondaries?

CVs have only 1 airplane squadron. Pushing consumables takes literally one click. WG thinks this is too much to handle.

I'm just applying their logic to other classes...and pointing out how it will improve the diversity of captain builds.

Why do you not want this quality of life improvement?

3 minutes ago, CylonRed said:

Clicking on a ship for manual secondaries and even planes for manual AA is not even close to driving a and running a CV.  One click - 2 max - and you are done and in a CV you are simply starting.  They are not even close to an equivalent in any way, shape, or form.  I can't remember which ships I have manual AA or secondaries so I always click on the planes/ships in any BB just in case. 

So, one click for DCP is somehow different?

In short, if you missed it, WG stated that even having CV consumables be used when controlling the planes was too much effort...too hard of a multitask.

This change would be beneficial for the meta AND make a variety of captain builds viable for BBs. It's definitely a good idea.

Why don't you want it to be implemented?

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11 minutes ago, Gavroche_ said:

If you’re running a secondary focused build, don’t you think you should be focused on your secondaries?

You mean actually spend some effort with the auto-kill sphere? /s

I like people (not u, Gavroche) who call torpedoes "wall of skill" sarcastically while asking for buff and easy mode for secondary which requires absolutely no player skill. Hell. You can sink a ship with secondary without even knowing the ship is there.

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10 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

CVs have only 1 airplane squadron. Pushing consumables takes literally one click. WG thinks this is too much to handle.

I'm just applying their logic to other classes...and pointing out how it will improve the diversity of captain builds.

Why do you not want this quality of life improvement?

First, I 100% disagree with the new CV system. There’s no play/counterplay and it’s severely dumbed down. I disagree with WG’s logic there and I would 100% disagree with their logic if they tried to apply that to BBs. 

Frankly, I think you should really take a look at yourself if you can’t find the singular second it takes to designate a secondary target between your  30 second reload and 20 second rudder shift. It’s literally the most basic thing!!!

Edit: spelling

Edited by Gavroche_
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Just now, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

CVs have only 1 airplane squadron. Pushing consumables takes literally one click. WG thinks this is too much to handle.

I'm just applying their logic to other classes...and pointing out how it will improve the diversity of captain builds.

Why do you not want this quality of life improvement?

So, one click for DCP is somehow different?

In short, if you missed it, WG stated that even having CV consumables be used when controlling the planes was too much effort...too hard of a multitask.

This change would be beneficial for the meta AND make a variety of captain builds viable for BBs. It's definitely a good idea.

Why don't you want it to be implemented?

Sure, we all know WG is lying about the reasoning behind not allowing players to control the ship without recalling the planes.  Its about a balance compromise, not unlike choosing between HE or AP.  If CVs faced the same threat as the rest of the surface ships maybe WG would allow you to control both the ship and planes.

Still, you're being petty and a bit childish by trying to shame WG into balancing the game the way you want it to be balanced.  That isn't going to happen.    

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15 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

CVs have only 1 airplane squadron. Pushing consumables takes literally one click. WG thinks this is too much to handle.

I'm just applying their logic to other classes...and pointing out how it will improve the diversity of captain builds.

Why do you not want this quality of life improvement?

So, one click for DCP is somehow different?

In short, if you missed it, WG stated that even having CV consumables be used when controlling the planes was too much effort...too hard of a multitask.

This change would be beneficial for the meta AND make a variety of captain builds viable for BBs. It's definitely a good idea.

Why don't you want it to be implemented?

If the planes flew them,selves to the target and auto dropped you would have a point but they don't.  Your premise of it is the same is flawed at the most basic level and you repeat as the WG decision is not accurate.  That is what I am pointing out - nothing more.  So please do not decide for me as to what I think about the proposal.

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37 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Missing my point. Wargaming has ALREADY said that we can't handle doing more than one thing at a time.

 

So, therefore we should expect a quality of life improvement on the other classes, this being a win win for the players and the state of the gameplay meta.

They are missing your point, which is just to be passive aggressively petulant......

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11 hours ago, Sovereigndawg said:

Which post of mine past do you want to quote, why can't manual secondaries act like regular secondaries until you focus them? So many time I don't opt for manual because the tactical advantage of having the secondaries open fire automatically. They should act like normal until you use manual. I mean really, it costs four points.

Agreed. They absolutely should function like normal and not just sit there useless until you select a target.

Another option is to reduce the bonus for the selected target, but give a bonus when a target is not selected. 

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50 minutes ago, chewonit said:

You mean actually spend some effort with the auto-kill sphere? /s

I like people (not u, Gavroche) who call torpedoes "wall of skill" sarcastically while asking for buff and easy mode for secondary which requires absolutely no player skill. Hell. You can sink a ship with secondary without even knowing the ship is there.

You uh,  you don't use secondary focused ships,  do you?  The likelihood of even HITTING a target a target without manual secondaries something like 10%.  If you get sunk by a ships secondaries without manual fire then you were heavily damaged by something else and got extremely unlucky.  

More on topic,  eh.  I do think secondaries should continue firing with manual and only increase in accuracy when you manually target.  

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1 hour ago, Gavroche_ said:

First, I 100% disagree with the new CV system. There’s no play/counterplay and it’s severely dumbed down. I disagree with WG’s logic there and I would 100% disagree with their logic if they tried to apply that to BBs. 

Frankly, I think you should really take a look at yourself if you can’t find the singular second it takes to designate a secondary target between your  30 second reload and 20 second rudder shift. It’s literally the most basic thing!!!

Edit: spelling

What I think about CVs is clearly irrelevant. I consider myself a CV main (or I did, until WG decided to change everything). I am fully aware of the sillyness of WG logic.

However, I have learned that WG believes what they say, no matter how silly. So...why not change secondaries too? It's logical and positive for the game, in my opinion.

 

Can you think of a negative to the game meta of making my proposed change?

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10 hours ago, comtedumas said:

No, but if there are two sides to a ship, and both sides have secondaries, we should be able to manually select targets on both sides of the ship.  

I'm in 100% agreement.     I love secondary builds on my bb's, and being we invested the 4 points on our captain's skills (usually 8 points, adding the 20% additional distance), we should benefit from the secondary guns on both sides of our ship.    

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2 hours ago, Skpstr said:

They are missing your point, which is just to be passive aggressively petulant......

Not at all. If we don't want to burden the player with too much to do...then my proposal helps with that and also helps provide more diversity in useable captain builds.

I fail to see the drawback.

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WG should change manual secondaries to this. They auto fire like normal but have improved accuracy, when you manually select the target you get a large boost to accuracy with say 10% increased damage and +1-2% increased fire chance.  You can lock 2 targets 1 for each side of your ship, if both targets are on the same side then the secondaries will target the closer target unless you reselect the target.  Its simple it gives secondaries a needed boost to effectiveness, because right now secondary builds are just for fun they are not that effective.

Yes they can rack up big number games but most secondary build battles they only do around 20-30k dmg, almost all the big damage comes from our main guns or torpedos.  Id really like to see games where you had 300+ secondary hits doing about 45-50k dmg off the secondaries on average.  At current 300 hits is more like 20k which is rather pitiful considering the points/equipment invested into the build for a huge amount of shots landed.  

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Just now, JToney3449 said:

Id really like to see games where you had 300+ secondary hits doing about 45-50k dmg off the secondaries on average.

The average T10 DD game will net 45-50k damage and you think BBs should get that with a no skill mechanic??? :Smile_facepalm:

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1 hour ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Not at all. If we don't want to burden the player with too much to do...then my proposal helps with that and also helps provide more diversity in useable captain builds.

I fail to see the drawback.

Mainly because, as far as driving the CV and consumable use, I think pretty much everyone, regardless of what they think of the rework, is in agreement that WG is drinking the cough syrup.

We don't want to burden the playerbase with too much to do, but in the case of driving CVs and consumable use, we are more or less unanimously decided that WG is mistaken about what is "too much". 

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