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vorlonagent

Free XP Economics

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WG has stated that they think there's too much Free XP in the game and expressed concern that it will result in too many FXP premium ships showing up in battles.  I think they are thinking the same thing RE Coal if the price for the Jean Bart is any clue.  They think higher prices for ships will solve this problem, presumably by draining off the excess and raising the bar to access.  It won't work.  In fact it will make things worse.  If...IF...one assumption I am making is right.

The problem was never "too much FXP in the game".  It has always been that there's not enough things to spend FXP on that compete successfully with those big shiny ships.  

The assumption I am making is that we out here in the player base are saving our Free XP and coal to buy those nice shiny, expensive ships.  I know I am but that could also be my bias.  Raising the price for FXP/Coal ships does two things.  1) It annoys me.  Annoy me enough and I quit the game.  2) It also means I will simply continue to save my resources until I have enough to buy a shiny I want.

If the players are saving coal or FXP for a big purchase, raising prices just means more FXP or Coal in the game because I have to save more to get what I want.   If there are no shinies I want, I will continue to save hoping for one in the future or maybe a re-release.  Woe to WG if they offer a ship that's shinier than expected for a reasonable price, re-release a popular past shiny or simply underestimate how much to jack successive ship prices.  The players will pounce en masse and WG will get exactly what they do not want: a glut of a particular FXP/Coal ship in the game.  It's a matter of time really.  It will happen unless frustration drives players off instead.

The problem is there's a limited number of things we can spend FXP on.  We can spend FXP on ship advancement or FXP premium ships.  That's it.  Even worse WG gives us a way to convert unused ship XP into FXP that in turn has nowhere to go!.  If I decide to grind my ships to Tier 10 instead of using Free XP to smooth my way there, I have nothing else to spend my Free XP on besides ships.  

This is not rocket surgery.  It is a basic tenet of how MMOs work.  Game economies stabilize when the amount of currency generated by play has enough places ("sinks") to leave play again. Not enough sinks, it builds up.  WoWS' Free XP economy simply doesn't have enough sinks besides ships.  The WoWS design team should understand this.   I don't understand how the designers of this game could possibly think that a simple price increase was going to do any good.  It's at best a short-term fix to a long-term problem and comes at the price of antagonizing the players.  And the problem isn't new.  It existed since WoWs entered open-beta.  

So FXP needs other things it can buy.  What might those be? One very obvious thing would be other in-game currency.  Pay a doubloon and convert, say, 300 free XP into 3000 credits.  Non-Premium accounts might do this.  Or maybe turn 100 free xp into 1 coal.  I wouldn't recommend converting FXP into Steel or gold however.  Especially not gold.  But it might be interesting to convert FXP into oil, but WG has show themselves to be concerned about too much oil as well.

One thing that makes tons of money for other MMOs is visual customization.  What would people pay to rig their ship with Christmas lights separate from the camo they use?  What would people pay to be able to rename their ships, even if they were the only one those those renames?  Maybe FXP isn't the currency to use for these things but coal would be and converting FXP to coal would make it possible to spend FXP.  Converting FXP to coal would mean there would be no reason to even continue offering FXP ships in the tech tree.  Just put them all in the Arsenal.

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35 minutes ago, vorlonagent said:

It has always been that there's not enough things to spend FXP on that compete successfully with those big shiny ships.  

Really? Seems to me that FXP is used all the time for modules to avoid the stock grind. Some people use it to skip ships entirely.

Having said that I think you argument might apply to Coal even better and I think WG knows this. I expect to see more things to purchase and more options in the Arsenal. 

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I did skip past a lot of ships.. didn't do myself any favors but I also use a lot of free xp on commanders. 

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WoWS could get around a lot of the "fxp inflation" by allowing us to convert FXP to ECXP at a reasonable rate.

If I could convert 1:5 or something, I'd convert a lot. But right now it's 1:1 which is a terrible conversion rate.

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The problem isn't how much free xp is banked as much as how easy it is to earn in the game.

With the right flags and camo you can pull in upwards of 1100% free xp per match

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It's a round robin problem.

I was happily spending my free XP on ship upgrades and new tech tree ships, then BAM here comes Missouri. I need how much Free XP??? Great I have like 240 points.... :Smile_sad:

So the folks that play those game 24/7 skewed the numbers and WG decided to make Free XP a currency instead of what it was meant to be used for (helping grow through the tech tree).

So, now I am hoarding it, knowing WG is gonna come out with some new shiny - thus raising the numbers that WG is looking at saying that people have too much free XP, so they raise the prices, meaning more hoarding, meaning higher prices, meaning....

See what I mean? Free XP should NEVER have become a currency. :Smile_facepalm:

Edited by capncrunch21
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1 hour ago, Capn_Nugget said:

I did skip past a lot of ships.. didn't do myself any favors but I also use a lot of free xp on commanders. 

^^^^^ This and I never take a ship into battle stock so use fxp to get the module upgrades

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1 hour ago, capncrunch21 said:

 

So the folks that play those game 24/7 skewed the numbers and WG decided to make Free XP a currency instead of what it was meant to be used for (helping grow through the tech tree).

 

You don't need to play 24/7 to amass large amounts of free xp.

All the bonuses available allows the players able to get them to farm obscene amounts of free xp.

I could make roughly 150k free xp in one night for 2-3 hrs of gaming using those bonuses and being in a full div for ops.

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I use my FXP for modules on new boats, but I make way more grinding the new boats then I spend. It just grows and grows. 

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The only reason free xp is "inflated" is because they hardly ever release free xp ships. it's just a [edited] reason to raise prices. Why buy special signal flags to rack up free xp while you grind if you can't get ships with it. They could release lower tier ships more often. Why does it always have to be 750,000 free xp? Look at the Nelson, 375,000... They need like 3-4 more ships at that level, immediately.

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6 hours ago, paradat said:

Really? Seems to me that FXP is used all the time for modules to avoid the stock grind. Some people use it to skip ships entirely.

Key phrase, "Some people".  I actually did this with the first 100,000 FXP I ever earned.  I hated the grind on the pre-cruiser-split T7 Pensacola and Free-XPed to the New Orleans.  Post-split, I suddenly had a Baltimore, which made it all worth it.

The question is how well ship advancement competes against a big, shiny FXP premium.  That varies.

I know what the FXP ships are supposed to be for.  They're supposed to be for the players who have everything.  WG releases a new ship line and these players Free-XP their way to the top on Day 1 and still have a million to spare.  FXP ships give therm something to spend FXP on while waiting for the next ship line.  FXP ships aren't for plebs like me.  But at least some of the plebs like me want those ships too and if enough of them are saving their FXP like I am, that's your "too much FXP in the game" problem right there.

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1 hour ago, HorrorRoach said:

The only reason free xp is "inflated" is because they hardly ever release free xp ships. it's just a [edited] reason to raise prices. Why buy special signal flags to rack up free xp while you grind if you can't get ships with it. They could release lower tier ships more often. Why does it always have to be 750,000 free xp? Look at the Nelson, 375,000... They need like 3-4 more ships at that level, immediately.

Exactly

 

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Just now, HorrorRoach said:

The only reason free xp is "inflated" is because they hardly ever release free xp ships. it's just a [edited] reason to raise prices. Why buy special signal flags to rack up free xp while you grind if you can't get ships with it. They could release lower tier ships more often. Why does it always have to be 750,000 free xp? Look at the Nelson, 375,000... They need like 3-4 more ships at that level, immediately.

Problem is that there is a finite need for ships in this game.  I am at the point where I really have to be interested in a new premium to go for it, FXP or not.  I have a credit grinder, Missouri.  I have a Elite Commander EXP grinder, Musashi.  I have USN trainers, Missouri, Arizona, Texas, Arkansas B, Albany.  I have IJN trainers, Musashi, Atago B, Ishizuchi, Yubari, Mikasa, Tachibana Lima.  I have RN trainers, Cossack, Hood, Nelson, Warspite.  I have KM trainers, Scharnhorst, Graf Spee.  I have a MN trainer, Dunkerque.  I have a RN trainer, Giulio Cesare.  Heck, I even have Commonwealth, Russian and Pan-Asian trainers.  What more do I need?

I also have 250k FXP saved up that I spent not a dime to convert from Elite EXP.  This is because, except for Emerald, I have never used it on tech tree ships, not even prior to Missouri being introduced.

So, if they add a bunch of ships like Nelson that can be purchased for FXP that can reasonably be gotten without spending any money on the game, how is WG going to make money on them?  If they essentially give away so many premium ships for free at least some of their market, such as myself, will not have any real reason to spend money.

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6 hours ago, enderland07 said:

WoWS could get around a lot of the "fxp inflation" by allowing us to convert FXP to ECXP at a reasonable rate.

If I could convert 1:5 or something, I'd convert a lot. But right now it's 1:1 which is a terrible conversion rate.

^^^^^ This. Aside from stock modules, FXP premiums and thinking back to all the times I'd seen the Seattle get utterly wrecked no matter how well played it was and going 'NOPE!', I have no use for FXP since it is literally 'too valuable to waste' on captains and I like to grind my way up the tech trees. If they instead had a 

FXP => ECXP exchange mechanism of something like 1:5 as you say if free or even a doubloon facilitated exchange of 1:10 or something, WG would drain a lot of FXP pools really quickly, return a lot of its value and even make a quick buck. And if they were worried about 19 point captain seal clubbers infesting lower tiers, they could restrict captain skills to something like only 1 point skills working at T1-2, only 1 and 2 points for T3-4 or only the first 10 points working and etc... 

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Perhaps I'm an oddball, but I've been using some coal to buy the immunity to magazine detonation signals.  The way I see it, those are mandatory in stuff like clan wars, and I recently dropped under 100 remaining.

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Devs complain that there is too much FXP in the game. Ok, I can accept that. 

So why do so many SIGNALS AND CAMO crates give out Papa Papa flags, 500 FXP, and 400 coal? WG has total control over the drop rate of those items. I cant get rid of Papa Papas fast enough, I get so many.

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1 hour ago, Tembin said:

Perhaps I'm an oddball, but I've been using some coal to buy the immunity to magazine detonation signals.  The way I see it, those are mandatory in stuff like clan wars, and I recently dropped under 100 remaining.

Actually I only use my coal to buy signals, particularly Sierra Mike since it's hard to get and it's incredibly useful.

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I used to use my free xp on ship modules but I realized I wasn't doing myself any favors there.

I focus on ships now.  Nelson first.  Then Kronstadt.  Then Musashi with coal.  Now I have enough for the next tier 9 fxp ship and the Salem (as soon as I get another coupon).

There just isn't anything interesting worth spending my free xp on.  As for coal, I already have all the little ships and the commanders.  I'm not buying signals, I have enough freebies.  

Great big, shiny ships!  That's what I want.

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Well, one solution to soak up free XP just lying around is to create more 100% garbage ships like the Emerald* or the Izumo for players to free XP past. But yes, more mid-tier free XP ships wouldn’t go astray - particularly if they were made jointly purchasable in the premium shop to earn $$$ two ways. 

 

 

Sorry @Estimated_Prophet, you know I wub you.

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46 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Well, one solution to soak up free XP just lying around is to create more 100% garbage ships like the Emerald* or the Izumo for players to free XP past. But yes, more mid-tier free XP ships wouldn’t go astray - particularly if they were made jointly purchasable in the premium shop to earn $$$ two ways. 

Sorry @Estimated_Prophet, you know I wub you.

Well; part of the reason I may have so much fxp is because of my original experience using it to bypass ‘unwanted’ ships...

By gaming the hell out of Wickes, South Carolina, St Louis, and probably Eire, Sampson, and Chester, then converting the ship xp; I took the following path...

Erie, Chester, St Louis, Cleveland (old T6,) Des Moines.

Realizing my idiocy after the fact, I swore I’d never skip ships like that again.

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6 minutes ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Well; part of the reason I may have so much fxp is because of my original experience using it to bypass ‘unwanted’ ships...

By gaming the hell out of Wickes, South Carolina, St Louis, and probably Eire, Sampson, and Chester, then converting the ship xp; I took the following path...

Erie, Chester, St Louis, Cleveland (old T6,) Des Moines.

Realizing my idiocy after the fact, I swore I’d never skip ships like that again.

Ouch, really?

In coop too??!?

That must have taken rather a lot of battles!!!!

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13 minutes ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Ouch, really?

In coop too??!?

That must have taken rather a lot of battles!!!!

Back then I was more into Randoms, so it wasn’t quite that bad...

...depending on how you look at it...

...I calculated at one point I was averaging 18-20 games a day...

...18-20 RANDOMS a (week)day... (weekends sometimes averaged twice that,)

...so 5-6 hours a day; plus work, sleep, and everything else.

Ahhh... the good, BAD ole’ days; when I tried to play every ship I had for first wins; and wasn’t really any good at any line or class...

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With the upcoming CV rework, removing odd tier cvs, and literally thousands of players urgently grinding the CV tech trees in advance of the rework, we can expect a massive glut of compensatory free xp, credits and players in need of new toys.

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