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1meanDad

Repulse and Prince of Wales

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Like the Pearl Harbor threads, surprised there is nothing posted about the lost of HMS Repulse and HMS Prince of Wales. There is a lot of significance to that battle and loss

May they rest in peace.

 

48360296_2049578175133817_4148049590223896576_o.jpg

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I'm sure there are threads on these ships somewhere, but considering the current highlight timeline is for Pearl Harbor, these ships had no direct significance to that battle.

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A lesson on why removing fighter squadrons from the CV rework was monumentally stupid. The #1 job of a CV is to provide air cover for ships of the fleet... ships with no air cover are sitting ducks for enemy bombers. 

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8 minutes ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

Yet nearly no one cares because pearl harbor was apparently more "significant". 

To the USN, yes. Though I'm sure the RN remembers. 

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17 minutes ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

Yet nearly no one cares because pearl harbor was apparently more "significant". 

I would argue, and am, that while the loss of those 2 Brit ships was a indeed a very bad blow to the British the Japanese attack on Pearl was indeed much more significant. Sank a bunch of the U.S. Pacific fleet, brought the U.S. into the war VERY intent on achieving ultimate victory, and prompted Hitler to declare war on the U.S which created the unbeatable allied combination of Russia, Great Britain, and the U.S. against the axis. Pretty significant IMO. Very.  Huge. 

Edited by dmckay
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6 minutes ago, dmckay said:

I would argue, and am, that while the loss of those 2 Brit ships was a indeed a very bad blow to the British the Japanese attack on Pearl was indeed much more significant. Sank a bunch of the U.S. Pacific fleet, brought the U.S. into the war VERY intent on achieving ultimate victory, and prompted Hitler to declare war on the U.S which created the unbeatable allied combination of Russia, Great Britain, and the U.S. against the axis. Pretty significant IMO. Very.  Huge. 

YEP Pearl Harbor attack was a much bigger deal. 

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The really sad part about those 2 ships is how metal slavagers are slowly tearing them apart. Ships like the Bismarck and Yamoto are lucky they sunk in deep waters.

Edited by Krupp_Sabot
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Most Americans won't even know what Guadalcanal was, how much it meant to the Pacific War effort, despite the massive commitment made for that campaign and to keep the lines to Australia open (who had many of her military fighting the Germans a world away).  The extent of most Americans' knowledge of the Pacific War in WWII is Pearl Harbor, Midway, the Atom Bombs, the Japanese Surrender, and that was it.  They don't know of the struggles that happened elsewhere in between all those events.  So it doesn't surprise me that what happened to Repulse, Prince of Wales flew under the radar here.

 

The loss of PoW was important for many factors for both the Allies and Japan.  In "Japanese Destroyer Captain" the author noted the shock upon hearing Battleship Prince of Wales was destroyed solely by airpower while at sea.  Churchill took PoW's loss like a hard punch to the gut.

 

With the USN Pacific Battle Line in ruins at Pearl Harbor, the amount of traditional, bonafide surface threats that could face the IJN went to zero at that stage of the war.  The Allies would fall into disarray and being outmatched, outfought by the IJN until Coral Sea and Midway.  No Capital Ship threat presented by the Allies until Coral Sea.

 

Anyways.  The sad part is there's all sorts of warning signs leading up to the disaster.  The UK was hard pressed at this stage of the war and put priorities elsewhere and their Pacific / South Asia holdings were barely getting extras to improve their situation.  Aircraft in particular was shuffled for anywhere else but these regions.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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Repulse and PoW were sunk when the British were actively at war with the Japanese. There was none of the "infamy" element that accompanied Pearl; tragic and disastrous though they were, they were straight-up combat losses with no other baggage.

Edited by Ensign_Cthulhu

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2 hours ago, 1meanDad said:

Like the Pearl Harbor threads, surprised there is nothing posted about the lost of HMS Repulse and HMS Prince of Wales. There is a lot of significance to that battle and loss

May they rest in peace.

 

48360296_2049578175133817_4148049590223896576_o.jpg

I always wonder if the sailors on those ships knew they were about to be sunk or did they believe they were in a battleship and battlecruiser and were safe.

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the 1st time a capital ship underway was sunk by just air power, a very historical event. 

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2 hours ago, dmckay said:

I would argue, and am, that while the loss of those 2 Brit ships was a indeed a very bad blow to the British the Japanese attack on Pearl was indeed much more significant. Sank a bunch of the U.S. Pacific fleet, brought the U.S. into the war VERY intent on achieving ultimate victory, and prompted Hitler to declare war on the U.S which created the unbeatable allied combination of Russia, Great Britain, and the U.S. against the axis. Pretty significant IMO. Very.  Huge. 

Perhaps, but the loss of Prince of Wales and Repulse, and soon after the fall of Singapore, had two major long term consequences*: 

1) Australia and New Zealand became convinced that the then global superpower (Britain) could no longer defend them, and made efforts to become close US allies - been going for over 70 years now.

2) Post-war, the loss made a contribution to the idea that Britain could no longer support her Asian empire, ultimately culminating in pulling back ‘east of Suez’ and paths to independence for various former colonies. 

These geopolitical events were in addition to the military lesson that the age of the battleship was over.

So, the loss of these ships is not insignificant - it was the symbolic fall of the first truly global empire. True, by comparison the impact is less direct (attack=declaration of war is hard to beat for causality), but we still witness the consequences. 

 

*At great risk of oversimplification, of course.

Edited by UltimateNewbie

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3 hours ago, iEatChickenMcNuggets said:

Yet nearly no one cares because pearl harbor was apparently more "significant". 

Yet the loss of those ships was very significant. PoW and Repulse were the most powerful Allied Warships in the SW Pacific at the time and their loss doomed the remaining Allied Naval Forces.

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I would doubt that Pearl Harbor is a very significant day in England compared to the loss of the Repulse or POW (or the battle of Jutland).

Same with Russia compared to Tsushima.

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The whole Malayan/East Indies campaign was a tragedy, born of futility (naval assets under air threat with no fighter cover to speak of), politics (USN sacrificing the Asiatic Fleet to support a doomed defense of UK/Netherlands colonies), and general pre-war short-sightedness.

The crews of many brave ships paid with their lives.

As WoWS runs of of new lines, we may yet see some of these, like PoW, Repulse, Exeter, and Houston. @Lert would love to see De Ruyter, Java, and the Admiral-class DD's. We already have Perth, Boise, Marblehead, and Pensacola which were all involved to one extent or another in SE Asia.

I always thought WOWS screwed the pooch with the US cruiser line split by overlooking the Northampton class. Houston would have made a fine Premium edition of that.

Edited by So_lt_Goes

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5 hours ago, ReddNekk said:

Yet the loss of those ships was very significant. PoW and Repulse were the most powerful Allied Warships in the SW Pacific at the time and their loss doomed the remaining Allied Naval Forces.

I’m was being sarcastic you know. When I say “no one”, I meant the typical freedumb USN loving fanboi. Not me. 

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