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Ericson38

Tier 8 against T10

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Second game in Lightning, in a T-9-10 game, being chased and torped to oblivion by a Gearing. I thought this kind of play crap was fixed, what is GOING ON  ? One other T8 DD on other side. Everyone else buffed up. I just started this ship. Give it a BIG BREAK WG..

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4 minutes ago, SmokeHenge said:

Usually don’t have problems with Gearings in my Lightning.

Wow, you are great, maybe a nerf would make it more fair to the Gearings in general. Go play a game now.

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Tier 8 DDs are perfectly capable of competing in tier 10 battles.  Oh, I wouldn't want to run across a Harugumo in my Lightning.  But in general, the Lightning's 5.5 km concealment will let it be competitive in most circumstances.  You should be able to outspot most enemy DDs.  

If people spent as much energy trying to play productively and competitively in their tier 8's in tier 10 battles as they do complaining about it, those players would do a lot better rather than sabotaging their efforts with all their negativity. 

 

EDIT:  Guys, this is really obvious stuff.  I think that far too many players seem to think that if the ship they're playing doesn't feel capable of completely carrying a team when bottom tier, then the ship stinks and/or that there's a problem with MM.  That's nonsense.  When you're bottom tier, you shouldn't have to be thinking about carrying the team, at least for the entire battle.  Maybe making a key play at a critical point in the game, of course.  

Furthermore, you guys who complain so vehemently and constantly about tier 8 MM really are sabotaging your efforts with your negativity.  You're creating a self-fulfilling prophecy of failure because you're more concerned with complaining than with going out there and finding ways to help your team. It just seems like you've created a mindset geared for failure.

Edited by Crucis
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Well let me figure out the ship before you weight in on it. How about that. Only MM knows the stats, not you.

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33 minutes ago, Ericson38 said:

Well let me figure out the ship before you weight in on it. How about that. Only MM knows the stats, not you.

 Little salty?

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You have 10k battles.  You aren't used to being uptiered yet? :cap_old:

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I have to "pick my battles" when I'm in my Kagero........  That's all there is to do !  Fight the fights you can win and help where you can...........  I don't see huge issues that are class of ship problems.........yes, a Khab against a Kagero in a gun fight is counter-intuitive so, don't put your self in that position.   Sometimes you have no choice.....  That's isn't 100% of the time though...  I am the LAST person to talk about GuD........but, I can say with 100% confidence:  chose the fight you can win....  Use the advantages of your ship and you can't control the rest..........  Complaining that the sun rises in the East isn't going to change the rising of the sun and WG has no intentions of changing MM anytime in the near future.....

Edited by Asym_KS
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10 minutes ago, Xeilin said:

You have 10k battles.  You aren't used to being uptiered yet? :cap_old:

Was thinking the same thing.

This shouldn't be a problem for you at this point and the Lightning is a very good ship.

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12 minutes ago, Asym_KS said:

I have to "pick my battles" when I'm in my Kagero........  That's all there is to do !  Fight the fights you can win and help where you can...........  I don't see huge issues that are class of ship problems.........yes, a Khab against a Kagero in a gun fight is counter-intuitive so, don't put your self in that position.   Sometimes you have no choice.....  That's isn't 100% of the time though...  I am the LAST person to talk about GuD........but, I can say with 100% confidence:  chose the fight you can win....  Use the advantages of your ship and you can't control the rest..........  Complaining that the sun rises in the East isn't going to change the rising of the sun and WG has no intentions of changing MM anytime in the near future.....

 

See, Asym understands this fairly simple principle.  Pick your fights, help where you can, and do the best you can.  There will always be times when you could run into a ship that will make mincemeat of your ship.  Like a tier 8 DD running into a Minotaur or Worcester.  But before people run straight for the it's bad MM, just remember that most tier 10 DDs are going to be in nearly as deep a trouble if they run into a Mino or Woostah.  The problem isn't running into the DM or Woostah.  It's being smart enough to do your best to avoid running into them, if at all possible.  And also consider that that same tier 8 DD is going to probably be in a world of hurt if she runs into a tier 8 Cleveland or Edinburgh.

Good post, Asym.  +1  :cap_like:

 

 

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1 hour ago, Crucis said:

Tier 8 DDs are perfectly capable of competing in tier 10 battles.  Oh, I wouldn't want to run across a Harugumo in my Lightning.  But in general, the Lightning's 5.5 km concealment will let it be competitive in most circumstances.  You should be able to outspot most enemy DDs.  

Of course not, that is why tier 8 destroyers are allowed to compete in tier 10 Ranked or clan wars......... 

The fact is it is "good enough" for anything but competitive play because they know that allowing normal matchmaking in competitive play wouldn't be fair.. 

+2/-2 matchmaking has always reminded me of a last gasp of a country fighting for it's life. Kind of like Nazi Germany sending it's children to halt the Russian advance. Did they have a chance? Ehh a slight chance and it seems some did fairly well. Was it fair? It was war, fair really isn't a concept for real battle. The whole thing reeks of desperation IMHO, and since we are talking about a game, fairness should be a concept held in higher regard. The whole "can do well" argument really only applies to some players who will do well no matter what because they are good. Most players are average or below average. To help level a playing field, especially in games, we tend to balance in favor of fairness. 

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With good positioning and play you can top the leader board in a t8 in a t10 mach

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10 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

Of course not, that is why tier 8 destroyers are allowed to compete in tier 10 Ranked or clan wars......... 

The fact is it is "good enough" for anything but competitive play because they know that allowing normal matchmaking in competitive play wouldn't be fair.. 

+2/-2 matchmaking has always reminded me of a last gasp of a country fighting for it's life. Kind of like Nazi Germany sending it's children to halt the Russian advance. Did they have a chance? Ehh a slight chance and it seems some did fairly well. Was it fair? It was war, fair really isn't a concept for real battle. The whole thing reeks of desperation IMHO, and since we are talking about a game, fairness should be a concept held in higher regard. The whole "can do well" argument really only applies to some players who will do well no matter what because they are good. Most players are average or below average. To help level a playing field, especially in games, we tend to balance in favor of fairness. 

The game shouldn't have to freakin' hand hold bad players just so their feelings aren't hurt by doing poorly.  At some point, either have to man up or accept that you don't measure up.

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2 minutes ago, AtomicMan3 said:

With good positioning and play you can top the leader board in a t8 in a t10 match

Plus the fact that as a bottom tier ship, you get extra credit for damaging higher tier ships, just as top tier ships don't get as much credit for damaging bottom tier enemies as they do for same tier enemies.  Have a good game in a bottom tier ship and it will be reflected in the credits and XP you earn.

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2 hours ago, Ericson38 said:

Second game in Lightning, in a T-9-10 game, being chased and torped to oblivion by a Gearing. I thought this kind of play crap was fixed, what is GOING ON  ? One other T8 DD on other side. Everyone else buffed up. I just started this ship. Give it a BIG BREAK WG..

 

 

 

 

Oh look a MM whine thread.  Hardly ever see these.

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11 minutes ago, Turbotush said:

MM should be +1/-0.

but ...but ...i wont be able to do any seal clubing T7s with me Musashi, if that happens.  :Smile_sad: 

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The game should be fun.

Being continuously disadvantaged, even if you can overcome it, isn't fun.

It's not fun to feel the deck is stacked against you.

 

Things should be looked at more if the T8 MM change hasn't been effective.

 

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54 minutes ago, Turbotush said:

MM should be +1/-0.

How does -0 work? You will never see any ship in tier lower than you? Then how do you get +1, meaning you will see ships in higher tier? But they are not supposed to see you.

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I am all for a good challenge and mainly a DD player. Heck I even did grind all the way to the gearing when a Mahan had 6km torps(or less even)

But tier 8 MM is in pretty bad shape these days. I would say conservatively that 75% of my tier VIII ships get up tiered.

Some times I wonder why even play tier VIII ships? 

 

 

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52 minutes ago, mofton said:

The game should be fun.

Being continuously disadvantaged, even if you can overcome it, isn't fun.

It's not fun to feel the deck is stacked against you.

 

Things should be looked at more if the T8 MM change hasn't been effective.

 

Oh baloney.  We have different definitions of fun.  I think that facing up to a challenge is fun.  You seem to think that getting gimmes is fun.

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2 minutes ago, Learux said:

I am all for a good challenge and mainly a DD player. Heck I even did grind all the way to the gearing when a Mahan had 6km torps(or less even)

But tier 8 MM is in pretty bad shape these days. I would say conservatively that 75% of my tier VIII ships get up tiered.

Some times I wonder why even play tier VIII ships? 

 

 

I play my tier 8 premium DDs quite a lot these days, and I don't have any significant trouble being useful when bottom tier.  Just a few minutes ago, I ran my Le Terrible in a tier 10 battle on Hotspot.  We ended up with one of those passing storms and I was able to be a real pain in the tush to the enemy with my slashing torpedo runs, and occasional gunfire. Actually landed 4 torps on a GK.  Didn't sink him, of course, but certainly put a hurting on him.

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Yo

24 minutes ago, Crucis said:

I play my tier 8 premium DDs quite a lot these days, and I don't have any significant trouble being useful when bottom tier.  Just a few minutes ago, I ran my Le Terrible in a tier 10 battle on Hotspot.  We ended up with one of those passing storms and I was able to be a real pain in the tush to the enemy with my slashing torpedo runs, and occasional gunfire. Actually landed 4 torps on a GK.  Didn't sink him, of course, but certainly put a hurting on him.

Great for you, but one swallow doth not a summer make.

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