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enderland07

Why is everyone so upset about the steel thing

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People seem overly upset about this, on both sides.

First, unless the event gives an absurd amount of steel, it's not going to give people the Stalingrad. With a coupon, it will take 21,000 steel to get the Stalingrad. While it is possible that WG will give out close to this much in their Christmas event it seems incredibly unlikely the event will give out close to this much steel (plz WG no), which means the event itself is not going to be giving out free Stalingrads. Sorry Oprah, no Stalingrad memes for you.

Second, the Stalingrad isn't OP so I'm not sure why people are so obsessed with the Stalingrad itself. Nearly every thread about the event steel is focused on the Stalingrad. Ignoring the fact that Black/Flint/Bourgogne exist too. It seems people have an irrational obsession with the Stalingrad. What WG could do which to me would hilariously prove this point is make a steel-only premium version of the Montana, otherwise identical - that ship will be "so overpowered" because it'd primarily be in the hands of good players. Any ship which is primarily owned by good players will be overpowered relative to the rest of its tier by stats.  

Third, what we should all be able to agree on, is that WG could alleviate a lot of concern and drama purely by making data more available about when and what ships are upcoming for what costs. For all we know the entire reason they are doing this is because the Alaska will be a steel purchase. Or maybe they have plans to make significantly more steel ships, so even the free steel won't get you close to getting most of the steel ships without CW/ranked. Or even including how much steel snowflakes will get from this upcoming event - instead of vague "subject to change" wording. More tangible information will lead to much more sensible responses from the community. Vague

Fourth, WG needs to figure out whether currency inflation is a problem or not. In spite of lamenting currencies being devalued they are within weeks of that proposing devaluing yet another currency. I mean whatever WG it is your game but it seems hypocritical to be simultaneously raising prices on coal and presumably free xp ships because of currency inflation and then immediately make the only real limited resource more available.

In my opinion the worst outcome of more easily accessible steel actually has nothing to do with the TX ships but rather the Flint/Black (which are considerably cheaper and imo both of which are considerably worse for the game than Stalingrad) becoming more easily available.

And last, WG hasn't even said how much steel will be part of this event (or pay-2-steal-steel campaign). So optimism and pessimism seem a bit premature.

To anyone overly emotional in this, I give a picture of the most aesthetic ship which ever existed (#fite-me) :fish_viking:

image.thumb.png.243106af9a247e6ad328cd2cdb0363a1.png

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*cough* Flints everywhere *cough* (Winter flu I seem to have caught)

an Atlanta with dfaa&smoke, @tier7 what's wrong with that? Hell, I want one.

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8 minutes ago, LoveBote said:

*cough* Flints everywhere *cough* (Winter flu I seem to have caught)

an Atlanta with dfaa&smoke, @tier7 what's wrong with that? Hell, I want one.

Luckily no radar.

But that's why you div with an Atlanta/Belfast :fish_boom:

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1st Iteration:  Climb this mountain get a prize.

2nd Iteration:  Walk up this hill, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

3rd Iteration:  Walk across this plain, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

4th Iteration:  Walk down into this valley, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

5th Iteration:  Don't bother trying at all, here is the same prize as the mountain climber.

I can empathize why the mountain climbers feel a bit triggered by those who will do far less and have access to the same reward.  A dilution of the challenge makes those who earned it before...reasonably unhappy.

OP, while we differ in opinions, I will still give you +1 because your argument is sound and not filled with worthless input. (Edit - cant give +1 for a few more hours.)

Edited by Kongo_Pride
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22 minutes ago, enderland07 said:

Ignoring the fact that Black/Flint/Bourgogne exist too.

You can count the Bourgogne out of this argument, as it's even more expensive than the Stalingrad. The Black exists in the T10 meta where a bad move in a DD will kill you, and that SHOULD keep it under control if the population grows rapidly out of this. The Flint, on the other hand, could be a problem. Tier 5 is not going to enjoy that.

25 minutes ago, enderland07 said:

WG hasn't even said how much steel will be part of this event

This is the most important thing, and the quantities involved are a matter of conjecture, and, well... 

 

 

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Basically it's because some people think that since they played a mode of the game that others don't like, that they are entitled. I am personally happy that I won't be forced to play a mode that I don't particularly like. Some people can not play Clan Battles due to the realities of life and some are too bipolar to play Ranked.  They might go out and hurt some one after a session. Good on WG for this. I think other ships should be made available to the general public too. Alpha, Beta and ST ships should really not be exclusive. I know the testers tend not to agree that these ships should be available to the public. They say i got this ship for investing my time, why should you be able to get it? To this I would say, you got the ship for free, I would have to work for or pay for it. The real issue for me is that, I began a Qwest to own every ship and won't be able to do so, unless these ships are some how made available. I can't help the fact that I learned about this game after Alpha and Beta testing. The testers, I feel are totally entitled to these ships, they earned them and got them for free. Let's be realistic, making these ships exclusive is discrimination. It seems that in America at least, we are working to avoid discrimination or should we not, have let the women have a vote.

Edited by Sovereigndawg
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3 minutes ago, Kongo_Pride said:

1st Iteration:  Climb this mountain get a prize.

2nd Iteration:  Walk up this hill, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

3rd Iteration:  Walk across this plain, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

4th Iteration:  Walk down into this valley, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

5th Iteration:  Don't bother trying at all, here is the same prize as the mountain climber.

I can empathize why the mountain climbers feel a bit triggered by those who will do far less and have access to the same reward.  A dilution of the challenge makes those who earned it before...reasonably unhappy.

OP, while we differ in opinions, I will still give you +1 because your argument is sound and not filled with worthless input. (Edit - cant give +1 for a few more hours.)

I have some worthless input for ya! :Smile-_tongue: 

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53 minutes ago, Kongo_Pride said:

I can empathize why the mountain climbers feel a bit triggered by those who will do far less and have access to the same reward.

According to the mountain climbers, they do it because they like it. I would rather be fishing, what makes climbing a mountain any better than Fishing? You can get the trophy for climbing the mountain and I will get the trophy for the biggest fish but in this game, I personally think that exclusive ships should not be the trophy.

Edited by Sovereigndawg
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WG keeps introducing new currencies, making old ones worthless. Credits have lost it's value. What do you do with 500 mil of credits? FXP still have some use for getting premium ships. i really wish that WG would allow conversions into newer currencies.

 

As for easier access for the same award, you may have noticed that T10 rank that awards steel still haven't shown up . 

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27 minutes ago, enderland07 said:

People seem overly upset about this, on both sides.

First, unless the event gives an absurd amount of steel, it's not going to give people the Stalingrad. With a coupon, it will take 21,000 steel to get the Stalingrad. While it is possible that WG will give out close to this much in their Christmas event it seems incredibly unlikely the event will give out close to this much steel (plz WG no), which means the event itself is not going to be giving out free Stalingrads. Sorry Oprah, no Stalingrad memes for you.

Second, the Stalingrad isn't OP so I'm not sure why people are so obsessed with the Stalingrad itself. Nearly every thread about the event steel is focused on the Stalingrad. Ignoring the fact that Black/Flint/Bourgogne exist too. It seems people have an irrational obsession with the Stalingrad. What WG could do which to me would hilariously prove this point is make a steel-only premium version of the Montana, otherwise identical - that ship will be "so overpowered" because it'd primarily be in the hands of good players. Any ship which is primarily owned by good players will be overpowered relative to the rest of its tier by stats.  

Third, what we should all be able to agree on, is that WG could alleviate a lot of concern and drama purely by making data more available about when and what ships are upcoming for what costs. For all we know the entire reason they are doing this is because the Alaska will be a steel purchase. Or maybe they have plans to make significantly more steel ships, so even the free steel won't get you close to getting most of the steel ships without CW/ranked. Or even including how much steel snowflakes will get from this upcoming event - instead of vague "subject to change" wording. More tangible information will lead to much more sensible responses from the community. Vague

Fourth, WG needs to figure out whether currency inflation is a problem or not. In spite of lamenting currencies being devalued they are within weeks of that proposing devaluing yet another currency. I mean whatever WG it is your game but it seems hypocritical to be simultaneously raising prices on coal and presumably free xp ships because of currency inflation and then immediately make the only real limited resource more available.

In my opinion the worst outcome of more easily accessible steel actually has nothing to do with the TX ships but rather the Flint/Black (which are considerably cheaper and imo both of which are considerably worse for the game than Stalingrad) becoming more easily available.

And last, WG hasn't even said how much steel will be part of this event (or pay-2-steal-steel campaign). So optimism and pessimism seem a bit premature.

To anyone overly emotional in this, I give a picture of the most aesthetic ship which ever existed (#fite-me) :fish_viking:

 

1)  I don't really care about what ships other people have,  or how they got them -- I only care about what ships I can get.  If it's some ACTUALLY unbalanced ship, then the problem is the ship, not how people are getting it.

2)  As an aside, this is another reason why raw basic stats for a ship can't be the only frame of reference in balance -- how plays it, how it's played, etc, need to be part of the equation. 

3)  YES, Wargaming needs to stop operating behind a shroud by default all the time.  All the secrecy does is DIScourage people from spending.  Uncertainty is a drag on any market or economy, even the faux-economies of video games. 

4)  See also, stating that 'F'XP has an inflation problem, then giving it away in containers, including big chunks in the Black Friday containers, and putting out a mission chain with 50000 'F'XP to complete one of the missions in a shortish timeframe, encouraging people to get A LOT MORE OF THE SUPPOSEDLY INFLATION-AFFLICTED CURRENCY.

 

 

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I believe all ships should be available to everyone(expect premium ships)

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14 minutes ago, MajorRenegade said:

I believe all ships should be available to everyone(expect premium ships)

A good example of an oxymoron.

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2 minutes ago, LoveBote said:

A good example of an oxymoron.

do I smell a hint of insult?

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Just now, MajorRenegade said:

do I smell a hint of insult?

your sense of smell is off.

Spoiler
oxymoron
/ˌɒksɪˈmɔːrɒn/
noun
 
  1. a figure of speech in which apparently contradictory terms appear in conjunction (e.g. faith unfaithful kept him falsely true ).

 

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Just now, LoveBote said:

your sense of smell is off.

  Hide contents
oxymoron
/ˌɒksɪˈmɔːrɒn/
noun
 
  1. a figure of speech in which apparently contradictory terms appear in conjunction (e.g. faith unfaithful kept him falsely true ).

 

I need to redo English class :fish_boom:

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Well they now added another ship to steel before anyone would really have an opportunity to even afford it.  Then they come out with new "causal" ways to obtain it after months of ranked sprint with no steel, no CBs, etc.  I can understand some grumbling. 

In the end, WG is going to have to do something different with steel to make it unique, but instead they seemingly are just making it rare-coal.  I don't know what their plan is.  I've no problem with competitive gameplay modes giving exclusive access for a while or better income or whatever, but obviously the idea that WG is going to eventually have a dozen or more steel ships with extremely limited permanent distribution does not seem sustainable.  Hell, not even the top players could even earn steel on NA (thanks cancelled xrealm tests) for what, 3-4 months?

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58 minutes ago, Kongo_Pride said:

1st Iteration:  Climb this mountain get a prize.

2nd Iteration:  Walk up this hill, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

3rd Iteration:  Walk across this plain, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

4th Iteration:  Walk down into this valley, get the same prize as the mountain climber.

5th Iteration:  Don't bother trying at all, here is the same prize as the mountain climber.

I can empathize why the mountain climbers feel a bit triggered by those who will do far less and have access to the same reward.  A dilution of the challenge makes those who earned it before...reasonably unhappy.

OP, while we differ in opinions, I will still give you +1 because your argument is sound and not filled with worthless input. (Edit - cant give +1 for a few more hours.)

Silliest thing I've read on this forum yet... 

How can you say that? You have ZERO info as to how difficult the missions will be to get steel. They could be extremely difficult. So, I wouldn't just jump to conclusions that people will have easy access to steel. WG is simply giving folks another way to get it. Not everyone has no job and can play clan battles at ungodly times and for extreme amounts of time.  Get of your high horse....because it's not as high as you think. 

Now I hope WG does this OFTEN, just because I know it's going to irk you. 

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58 minutes ago, Ducati_Black said:

I have some worthless input for ya! :Smile-_tongue: 

That's what she said..

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1 hour ago, Kongo_Pride said:

OP, while we differ in opinions, I will still give you +1 because your argument is sound and not filled with worthless input. (Edit - cant give +1 for a few more hours.)

I think our perspective is much closer than you might think, just that I care less.

And also see it more like one person standing on the top of the mountain after getting there by their own efforts while the other person was dragged up there and is laying facedown on the mountaintop. So maybe that helps ;-)

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Well, as I see it WGing doesn't know what they are doing. That's why we have so many currency's and terrible idea's being tested.

My head wants to explode every time I have to grind a new currency. I'm in a don't give a crap mode right now. Cossack is one of the examples.

They just need to start trimming the currency system down and stop making new ones.

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7 minutes ago, MorbidGamer said:

Well, as I see it WGing doesn't know what they are doing. That's why we have so many currency's and terrible idea's being tested.

My head wants to explode every time I have to grind a new currency. I'm in a don't give a crap mode right now. Cossack is one of the examples.

 They just need to start trimming the currency system down and stop making new ones.

I've pretty much stopped grinding all the campaign crap.

Luckily WG made it so the Cossack still cost money even if you ground out everything, so my motivation to get it was already close to zero. But yeah... there's some serious event fatigue for me here.

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I’ve always been opposed to WG’s policy of playable trophies, so I personally don’t care if they hand out Steel or not. I have exclusive preorder ships (and tanks in WoT), and I don’t care when/if WG sells them. It’s enough for me that I got something just for playing a game that I enjoy, and while a unique flag or special camo would be appreciated, I take no pleasure in knowing that I have something that other players can’t obtain. Likewise, I have no sympathy for people that get up in arms over other players having a chance to own their personal special pixel ship.

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1 hour ago, _RC1138 said:

As is often the case, kings of hills hate it when they see a challenger.

It's more like kings of the hill hate it when half the court gets a throne and a crown, without having to strangle their brother and fight a series of bloody wars.....

I don't really care, I'm not getting one of those ships unless it's the prize for a permanent campaign.

I know you're pretty well-educated. How would you feel if some kid out of high school had all your knowledge and experience implanted into his brain, and instantly became your rival at work?

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Just now, Skpstr said:

I know you're pretty well-educated. How would you feel if some kid out of high school had all your knowledge and experience implanted into his brain, and instantly became your rival at work?

The better analogy would be how you'd feel if that high school kid was given the same job for the same pay.

He'd eventually get fired as he wouldn't have the skills to go with the job but it'd still be annoying for a while ;-)

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