Jump to content
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
NoZoupForYou

Steel and Stalingrad - What’s the right answer?

144 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

3,013
[BRZKR]
WoWS Community Contributors
1,612 posts
5,537 battles

My opinion is likely unpopular.  I say leave it as it is and some ships should be rewards.  It would also be unfair to those that worked hard to achieve them.

However, I’m not sold that my opinion is right or fair.  It’s just my opinion.  I’m interested to hear what you all think is right or fair.  Are the new steel missions the right move?  Why?  Let’s have a discussion about it.  A civil discussion.  Disclosure.  I don’t own Stalingrad.  No steel.  No time for steel.

https://youtu.be/qClAZhjHvAI

 

  • Cool 10
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
179
[808]
Supertester
360 posts
5,943 battles

‘Content’ for this game is acquiring ships.

 

Whats the point in having exclusive content that will alienate an ever dwindling player base.  I recall that after three months

this game has a 10%retentation rate.  

 

Following another thread, the drunk or stoned players that gravitate to repetitive gameplay need goals too.

 

I say if someone is sitting in front of their computer willing to put effort into a hobby they should have the opportunity to access any and all content.

 

  • Cool 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
346
[RM-I]
[RM-I]
Members
841 posts
7,202 battles

I agree. I think it builds incentive to play better and strive to become the best clan. There’s only one way to win a Super Bowl championship ring. I don’t see the difference between the two instances.

  • Cool 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
115
[RED]
[RED]
Members
195 posts
10,750 battles

Steel should be more available. Perhaps the best rewards for high achieving players in competitive play should be along the lines of camos, flags, maybe special commanders (with or without perks), or straight up ship clones with different names (i.e. Boise/ Julio).

And leave ships available to all via some method of payment/ grinding.

  • Cool 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,962
[90TH]
[90TH]
Alpha Tester
7,236 posts
8,389 battles

Steel for the Scrubs!

Spoiler

(anyone who has followed an existing thread knows my real opinion)

16 minutes ago, NoZoupForYou said:

My opinion is likely unpopular.  I say leave it as it is and some ships should be rewards.  It would also be unfair to those that worked hard to achieve them.

I can sense competition for who can earn the most downvotes on this topic.

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/175618-steel-for-the-scrubs/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
346
[RM-I]
[RM-I]
Members
841 posts
7,202 battles
Just now, Theodin said:

‘Content’ for this game is acquiring ships.

 

Whats the point in having exclusive content that will alienate an ever dwindling player base.  I recall that after three months

this game has a 10%retentation rate.  

 

Following another thread, the drunk or stoned players that gravitate to repetitive gameplay need goals too.

 

I say if someone is sitting in front of their computer willing to put effort into a hobby they should have the opportunity to access any and all content.

 

I dare say that any clan or player has the same opportunities to get these ships. 

I know I am not the greatest player, but I strive to do better each game. If my clan had the time for clan battles, I know we would strive to be the best there as well, with the goal to always do better and learn from the mistakes. This way when we are able to buy a Stalingrad or win a black, we earned it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
438
[WMD]
Members
825 posts
7,065 battles

Someone mentioned in a previous thread that the steel event and mission look like a way for WG to get the new T10 BB into people's hands faster. That makes good sense to me, why model and test a ship almost nobody will be able to get for a long time. The knock on effect will be that less competative players might get a few of the lower end steel ships, and maybe a Stalingrad for a select few.

I don't recall WG saying that steel will always be available in events either, maybe this is a one and done event.

Personally I don't have any interest in any of the steel ships so I don't really care what they do with steel, but I also get why people don't like powerful/OP ships locked away so only the best can get them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
528 posts

In regards to the vid, I don't like the phrase "worked hard" in regards to a game. You play a game because it's fun and relaxing. It's a hobby. Going to your job and putting food on the table is "work"  This is exactly the attitude the soils the gaming community to a certain degree.  You didn't work for anything in regards to rewards in this game. You simply had the time available to grind a certain mode that maybe others didn't. You can fail your way to rank #1 if you simply play enough ranked battles so it's not about skill. It's about time. I'm not familiar with clan battles in ships but I know for a fact in tanks that there are plenty of folks who get the reward tanks for simply going along for the ride. 

I think there are a bunch of folks that will be put off by "steel for the masses" because then their shiny new OP ship won't be so rare anymore and people love to be in elite crowds, possessing rare things that not many have. It's called vanity. That's your real reason for not wanting others to be able to get steel. 

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,238
[WUDPS]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
5,034 posts
4,848 battles

They perhaps want to make it so other people can get the grad and not dominate clan by being the only group who's got em.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
171
[AAA]
Members
502 posts
8,293 battles
2 minutes ago, VeatherVitch said:

Someone mentioned in a previous thread that the steel event and mission look like a way for WG to get the new T10 BB into people's hands faster. That makes good sense to me, why model and test a ship almost nobody will be able to get for a long time. The knock on effect will be that less competative players might get a few of the lower end steel ships, and maybe a Stalingrad for a select few.

I don't recall WG saying that steel will always be available in events either, maybe this is a one and done event.

Personally I don't have any interest in any of the steel ships so I don't really care what they do with steel, but I also get why people don't like powerful/OP ships locked away so only the best can get them.

Actually this would be an opportunity for WG to remove lots of 'currency' glut from the system.

Also they never said steel is exclusive to clan battles and ranked, but they didn't say anything else exactly. They just had mentioned that there would be more ways of earning steel and they didn't give any specifics when it was introduced.

I also feel the same way about steel ships. Have 10k and if this event goes through then would have enough steel to buy the Stalin but most likely wouldn't buy it. I dont enjoy playing bow tanking, island hugging cruisers or battleships (that takes out the tier 10 steel ship out of the purchase list too). So I am going to hoard steel for a very long time just like I am hoarding 250k coal. For me enjoyment is more important than I don't have that 'op' ship. In fact I have all of the so called 'op' premiums but its been ages since I played them. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
171
[AAA]
Members
502 posts
8,293 battles
1 minute ago, General_Lee_Miserable said:

In regards to the vid, I don't like the phrase "worked hard" in regards to a game. You play a game because it's fun and relaxing. It's a hobby. Going to your job and putting food on the table is "work"  This is exactly the attitude the soils the gaming community to a certain degree.  You didn't work for anything in regards to rewards in this game. You simply had the time available to grind a certain mode that maybe others didn't. You can fail your way to rank #1 if you simply play enough ranked battles so it's not about skill. It's about time. I'm not familiar with clan battles in ships but I know for a fact in tanks that there are plenty of folks who get the reward tanks for simply going along for the ride. 

I think there are a bunch of folks that will be put off by "steel for the masses" because then their shiny new OP ship won't be so rare anymore and people love to be in elite crowds, possessing rare things that not many have. It's called vanity. That's your real reason for not wanting others to be able to get steel. 

You must go to the thread which reads "steel for scrubs". People have defined hobby in so many different ways including putting serious effort, competitions, working hard towards a goal and so on. 

Yeah so called elites think it will rob them of that status and scrubs think it would give them the elite status. But in fact nothing would change as these ships would not make anyone unicum or pull down the stats of unicum. If suddenly wargaming decides to pull the plug (I am invested a lot in this game and hope it would last for a few years as I am enjoying this game every time I play) all "my precious" would vanish into thin air :)

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
389
[WOLF6]
Members
705 posts
6,194 battles
27 minutes ago, NoZoupForYou said:

My opinion is likely unpopular.  I say leave it as it is and some ships should be rewards.  It would also be unfair to those that worked hard to achieve them.

However, I’m not sold that my opinion is right or fair.  It’s just my opinion.  I’m interested to hear what you all think is right or fair.  Are the new steel missions the right move?  Why?  Let’s have a discussion about it.  A civil discussion.  Disclosure.  I don’t own Stalingrad.  No steel.  No time for steel.

https://youtu.be/qClAZhjHvAI

 

Dam it , I'm out of down votes for today but this post certainly warrants one . You "work" hard at a job , you "play" a game . This is a load of crap .

  • Cool 3
  • Funny 1
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
381
[KSC]
Members
1,042 posts
4,538 battles

I'm of the opinion that the Stalingrad and Bonjovi are meant to be end game content.  There is nothing wrong with having items that are meant to be there as a reward for achieving something.  Having things like these ships incentives the top players to keep playing.  I know I've personally kept playing far more than I would have otherwise, because I want to get these ships.  It has made me go from a casual player to someone who is running a competitive team, with goals to get better every season.  

I'd be alright with small amounts of steel being given out for something like completing a campaign or doing missions ect. but the vast quantity they seem to be planning on giving out is way too much.  If a co-op player can obtain something that was meant to be end game PVP content within a month, that's far too much.  

 

Edit; put JB instead of Bonjovi.  I meant the steel ship, not the ship in the premium shop lol

Edited by XpliCT_

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
381
[KSC]
Members
1,042 posts
4,538 battles
5 minutes ago, retic1959 said:

Dam it , I'm out of down votes for today but this post certainly warrants one . You "work" hard at a job , you "play" a game . This is a load of crap .

So the players who dedicate time to improving, learning strategies and making the meta don't "work" harder than those who boot up the game, play a few matches, and have no interest in improving?  

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
389
[WOLF6]
Members
705 posts
6,194 battles
Just now, XpliCT_ said:

So the players who dedicate time to improving, learning strategies and making the meta don't "work" harder than those who boot up the game, play a few matches, and have no interest in improving?  

It's a game , meant for entertainment . At best it's a hobby . Work pays the bills . You can call it whatever you want but it's nothing more than a game .

  • Cool 4
  • Boring 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,120
[NGAGE]
Members
3,397 posts
8,397 battles

One thing to consider is that even if a generous amount of steel is given once a year, if WG keeps making content to keep up with the pace that competitive players can earn steel, casual players will still never get all the available content.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
438
[WMD]
Members
825 posts
7,065 battles
5 minutes ago, XpliCT_ said:

So the players who dedicate time to improving, learning strategies and making the meta don't "work" harder than those who boot up the game, play a few matches, and have no interest in improving?  

Those (filthy casual)players won't get much steel from the events that are planned either.

What the planned steel give aways will do is allow more people to access the "special" content. Not wanting more people to get the special content is elitism plain and simple, don't try to dress it up in the "nobility" of hard work.

 

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
550
[CUTER]
Members
810 posts
21,402 battles
27 minutes ago, General_Lee_Miserable said:

In regards to the vid, I don't like the phrase "worked hard" in regards to a game. You play a game because it's fun and relaxing. It's a hobby. Going to your job and putting food on the table is "work"  This is exactly the attitude the soils the gaming community to a certain degree.  You didn't work for anything in regards to rewards in this game. You simply had the time available to grind a certain mode that maybe others didn't. You can fail your way to rank #1 if you simply play enough ranked battles so it's not about skill. It's about time. I'm not familiar with clan battles in ships but I know for a fact in tanks that there are plenty of folks who get the reward tanks for simply going along for the ride. 

I think there are a bunch of folks that will be put off by "steel for the masses" because then their shiny new OP ship won't be so rare anymore and people love to be in elite crowds, possessing rare things that not many have. It's called vanity. That's your real reason for not wanting others to be able to get steel. 

One of my hobbies is running.  I train and work very hard at it.  When I finish in the top portion of a race I am rewarded with trophies, which we runners call hardware.  It sits atop shelves and looks nice. 

Your thought that I should just be having fun and not earning a top prize for racing is folly and unfortunately bias as your argument is filled with many poor assumptions.  Vanity...for example...has nothing to do with individual effort and initiative. 

Hobbies can and often are the result of hard work.  Ever put a model together?  Many would describe model building as a hobby.  Saving money for that one car, tank, plane or ship and then the painting and gluing process.  Tedious is often the filler word, not fun, especially in making models.  Try doing 10x400m dashes...strenuous...not fun.  Clan Battles and Ranked for months straight...mentally exhausting and towards the end...not fun at all.  But at the end...there was a sense of accomplishment, and I was proud of the hours I spent getting to that ebd result and exclusive reward for being good at what I did.  Or the simple fact I needed to improve to get better...and be more competitive/careful.

If you don't want to invest the effort, then I am afraid you don't deserve the reward at the end.  No dinner, no desert.

Also, for those who don't share my opinion, please go read the children's book, The Little Red Hen.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Little_Red_Hen

I agree with @NoZoupForYou his logic makes sense...and no I don't have a Stalingrad and no I don't deserve one because I have not earned it yet.  And yes, I am a very active player on this game (my current favorite hobby) and in these forums.

Edited by Kongo_Pride
  • Cool 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,539
[WOLFG]
Members
5,322 posts
3,131 battles

One thing to consider is that if they are going to have more steel available, they are also likely to have more content.

What will be the next steel ship? (besides what is already going to be steel).

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,120
[NGAGE]
Members
3,397 posts
8,397 battles

 

1 minute ago, DrHolmes52 said:

What will be the next steel ship? (besides what is already going to be steel).

 

Alaska?

:Smile_hiding:

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alpha Tester
2,257 posts
54 minutes ago, NoZoupForYou said:

My opinion is likely unpopular.  I say leave it as it is and some ships should be rewards.  It would also be unfair to those that worked hard to achieve them.

However, I’m not sold that my opinion is right or fair.  It’s just my opinion.  I’m interested to hear what you all think is right or fair.  Are the new steel missions the right move?  Why?  Let’s have a discussion about it.  A civil discussion.  Disclosure.  I don’t own Stalingrad.  No steel.  No time for steel.

https://youtu.be/qClAZhjHvAI

I have always been of the belief that rare, exclusive ships should be restricted to only paper/fake ships. Stalingrad was neither built nor saw combat service, thus I couldn't care less about it. Quite frankly I had never heard of this ship until I started playing WoWS, and even then it's history left me very unimpressed. However, I cannot condone WG's decision to make real ships like Flint and Black exclusive to steel and ranked battles only. If they want a rare, exclusive ship, they can do it to whatever paper/fake ship they pull out of their rear ends. Leave the real ships for the masses. I'm sure we all remember what happened when WG told us that Alabama, a very real and iconic ship, will be for STs only.

WG has already screwed up several real ships like Belfast and Missouri, meaning new players are very unlikely to ever get one. I hope they don't make that mistake again but who am I kidding.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
253
[MEIST]
Members
1,076 posts
4,264 battles
21 minutes ago, retic1959 said:

Dam it , I'm out of down votes for today but this post certainly warrants one . You "work" hard at a job , you "play" a game . This is a load of crap .

Damn it, I am out of down votes for today, but this post certainly warrants one. :Smile_teethhappy:

Edited by jager_geist
  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
366
[MIA-I]
Privateers
1,251 posts
12,573 battles

1. Very few players will find themselves on a unicum clan. There is a high level of toxicity associated with play at that level. 

2. Even high-proficiency players feel that ranked at T10 is the opposite of fun, is actually an endurance test rather than a matter of just skillful play. 

3. The rewards seem to be ships with unique competitive advantages, which further walls off average players from the content. If the rewards were cosmetic in nature, rather than just observably better than other ships of the same tier and type, this would be less of an issue. Black and Flint were minor improvements, with tradeoffs, on their tech tree counterparts, Stalingrad and Bourgogne are just better. 

4. An average player will simply not be able to acquire a reasonable amount of steel over a period of years. This builds resentment and eventually disenchantment with the game, costing WG revenue in the end. 

5. WG's income, and the future of the game, rely on the goodwill of the average player. By the decision to make Steel more available, WG is demonstrating that they are aware of this fact. 

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,120
[NGAGE]
Members
3,397 posts
8,397 battles
3 minutes ago, LancerUlysses said:

1. Very few players will find themselves on a unicum clan. There is a high level of toxicity associated with play at that level. 

Uh what?

I'm not sure MIA is a "unicum clan" by your standards but both my current and previous clans (where I also got a Stalingrad flag) were not remotely toxic.

Edited by enderland07
  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×