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Dr_Venture

American DD's - love it

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So i gotta say this...by far the most fun line I've ever experienced. These destroyers have been a good balance of speed, firepower, and torpedoes. Many people told me the line was power creeped, the guns were bad, the torps don't hurt as much...and I gotta say...they are kinda right...but not if that makes sense? 

The line really teaches you how to be map observant and understand how zooming in all the way is a bad idea. The ships leading up to Mahan had torps that you needed to be close to fire. I basically ignored my torps unless I was in a DD knife fight, or somehow got up on a battleship or cruiser without getting popped. Mahan with the 9.2's kept me honest, but once I got the detect down even further I was stealth torping like a boss. The guns from Mahan to Benson felt like night and day, Bensen just feels so flat for some reason. Fletcher seems a little bit floaty, but maybe it's just me. 

I've found the second hulls to be totally pointless, you really don't need the added AA...the extra gun range is kinda pointless (but if you wanna sell german bb's outside of their secondary range cool.

I'm on the Fletcher right now, TOTES stock and it's not even an issue at all...I have N-E-V-E-R experienced this in any ship I've played in the game. I'll probably skip the range and just roll with the torps and second hull...for the sheer fact it's got more AA and hit points. 

Does anyone got any additional tips and tricks for the Fletcher to get the most abuse outta her? I went with a gunboat/conceal builder. 5.6? concealment with a 2 second something reload...this thing just eats ships apart.

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It's a good, all-around line with some shining examples.  IV Clemson, VIII Benson, IX Fletcher, X Gearing.  The Premiums VII Sims and VIII Kidd also stand out for a variety of reasons.

 

Fletcher in particular is a highlight DD, the blend of speed, agility, fast responding guns, fast ROF, and powerful torps with respectable range.  5.8km detection is the best she can get with Full Stealth Build (CE + Concealment Camo + CSM1).  Play her the same way you did Benson, just be more respectful on getting too close due to Radar and increased DD competition in high tier.  There are more and more DDs that can out spot your 5.8km concealment these days compared to when it was just IJN / USN / RU / German DDs.

 

If anything, the one that's going to feel very different is Gearing, due to Tier X DDs generally having sh*t maneuverability compared to VIII-IX DDs.  I love Gearings torpedo options and her firepower, but man does she sail like a pig.  That poor handling she has is the sole reason why I dislike using her.  But on the opposite side, I hate dealing with Gearing's normal torpedoes as well as her recent Fletcher torpedo option.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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1 minute ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's a good, all-around line with some shining examples.  IV Clemson, VIII Benson, IX Fletcher, X Gearing.  The Premiums VII Sims and VIII Kidd also stand out for a variety of reasons.

 

Fletcher in particular is a highlight DD, the blend of speed, agility, fast responding guns, fast ROF, and powerful torps with respectable range.  5.8km detection is the best she can get with Full Stealth Build (CE + Concealment Camo + CSM1).  Play her the same way you did Benson, just be more respectful on getting too close due to Radar and increased DD competition in high tier.  There are more and more DDs that can out spot your 5.8km concealment these days compared to when it was just IJN / USN / RU / German DDs.

 

If anything, the one that's going to feel very different is Gearing, due to Tier X DDs generally having sh*t maneuverability compared to VIII-X DDs.  I love Gearings torpedo options and her firepower, but man does she sail like a pig.

I've got a gumo, that thing turns like a bear with a stomach full of cocaine (spoiler...not at all.)

I may very well get the Kidd because it's a premium fletcher a tier lower with a heal and stupid AA.

Whats the skinny on the Simms anyway?

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3 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's a good, all-around line with some shining examples.  IV Clemson, VIII Benson, IX Fletcher, X Gearing.  The Premiums VII Sims and VIII Kidd also stand out for a variety of reasons.

(Sims; see below...)

1 minute ago, Dr_Venture said:

I've got a gumo, that thing turns like a bear with a stomach full of cocaine (spoiler...not at all.)

I may very well get the Kidd because it's a premium fletcher a tier lower with a heal and stupid AA.

Whats the skinny on the Simms anyway?

No idea personally why Sims is so loved; I like Mahan more.

The only time Sims was ever worth a damn to me was in the original Final Frontier; where it and Leningrad could be used to race north and nuke the Eastern Cleveland before it could even get on the map.

Benson was worse, (36%wr,) (Sims 50% wr, but I hated it so much it only lasted 10 games in Randoms before getting parked.)

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21 minutes ago, Dr_Venture said:

I've got a gumo, that thing turns like a bear with a stomach full of cocaine (spoiler...not at all.)

I may very well get the Kidd because it's a premium fletcher a tier lower with a heal and stupid AA.

Whats the skinny on the Simms anyway?

Sims?

- 6.8km detection, which is typical with Tier VII DDs.  Still, that sucks.  When you're dealing with stealthier VIII-IX DDs, it really sucks.  5.8km detection Fletcher & Benson, 6.1km detection Akizuki, etc.  Things no lower tier DD wants to get involved with.

- Terrible torpedoes.  You either have the fast, short ranged ones or the long ranged, weak, SIMS SLOWPEDOES / SIMS WATER MINES!

- Same floaty USN DD shells which makes nailing distant, smaller targets a PITA.

+ Those same floaty USN DD shells of course lets you lob shells over islands to farm damage off some players.

+ A candidate for a good USN DD AA Buiild.  She has Defensive Fire access.

+ Smaller ship profile than Mahan.  Mahan is large and is built to eat shells.

Spoiler

Qjt8dEd.jpg

Sims is slimmer.

NCAjjuW.jpg

 

+ Respectable speed and great agility, better than Mahan.  Sims vs Mahan: 38.5kts vs 35kts, 500m turning circle radius vs 560m, both at 2.1 second rudder shift with SGM2 upgrade installed.

+ USN DD guns like Benson, Fletcher.  Very fast 180 degree turret traverse while Mahan is slow traversing, 12.3 seconds for Mahan, 5.3 seconds for Sims.  Fast firing guns.

+ Something that goes forgotten these days, is Sims has a baked in XP bonus.  When Ranked came out with the "Save your Star" system, lots of people complained about Sims' XP Bonus.

 

IMO, the worst thing about her is the concealment.  Again, it's typical for VII DDs, but it's not fun fighting Tier VIII-IX DDs that outspot and outgun you, as well as having better torpedoes.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway
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US DDs are truly going to come into their own with the carrier rework. They suffered with the smoke nerf (can no longer blanket heavy cruisers and battleships with the large and long smoke they have). Until the rework comes about they are surpassed by the Pan Asian variants.

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On ‎11‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 4:10 PM, Dr_Venture said:

Whats the skinny on the Simms anyway?

I guess hydro on DDs have become so commonplace that everybody that responded to this left it out as part of it's "skinny"...at least I do believe it has hydro but not sure of it's ranges or anything like that as I don't own it...I do believe it is the standard hydro of all tech tree cruisers besides the Germans though.

My bad...was mistaking it for the Yo Lang.

For collectors it has the distinction of being 1 of the 1st 3 ships ever in the game. Originally the game was pay to play only (before there was a tech tree or more than just 1 server) & the only 3 ships there were (from cheapest to most expensive) were the Yubari-Simms-Gremy...there probably would have been an RN ship of some sort or another but at the time IRL Russia & England were not getting along so well...thus the reason for RN ships being so late to the party (in the game) despite their prevalence during the actual wars.

Edited by IfYouSeeKhaos

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1 hour ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

I guess hydro on DDs have become so commonplace that everybody that responded to this left it out as part of it's "skinny"...at least I do believe it has hydro but not sure of it's ranges or anything like that as I don't own it...I do believe it is the standard hydro of all tech tree cruisers besides the Germans though.

For collectors it has the distinction of being 1 of the 1st 3 ships ever in the game. Originally the game was pay to play only (before there was a tech tree or more than just 1 server) & the only 3 ships there were (from cheapest to most expensive) were the Yubari-Simms-Gremy...there probably would have been an RN ship of some sort or another but at the time IRL Russia & England were not getting along so well...thus the reason for RN ships being so late to the party (in the game) despite their prevalence during the actual wars.

Sims doesn't have Hydro.  You may be thinking of German Z-39 Premium in this tier or Tech Tree Maass,

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2 hours ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Sims doesn't have Hydro.  You may be thinking of German Z-39 Premium in this tier or Tech Tree Maass,

Really? I've been under the impression it had it way back in ranked & that was 1of the other advantages besides the extra hidden XP boost it had that made it so popular...but I definitely wasn't thinking of the Z-39 as it wasn't around then.

Somebody on the forums said it had it back then & because I didn't have it & didn't now any better & just believed it...my bad.

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1 hour ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

Really? I've been under the impression it had it way back in ranked & that was 1of the other advantages besides the extra hidden XP boost it had that made it so popular...but I definitely wasn't thinking of the Z-39 as it wasn't around then.

Somebody on the forums said it had it back then & because I didn't have it & didn't now any better & just believed it...my bad.

Ohh, he may have been thinking of Lo Yang.  It's a pretty old DD and she had Hydro.  Her Hydro originally was pretty weak but did get buffed long ago to some very useful ranges.  Lo Yang *IS* the USS Benson, handed to the Republic of China.  In WoWS she's basically Benson-C Hull with Hydro.

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5 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Ohh, he may have been thinking of Lo Yang.  It's a pretty old DD and she had Hydro.  Her Hydro originally was pretty weak but did get buffed long ago to some very useful ranges.  Lo Yang *IS* the USS Benson, handed to the Republic of China.  In WoWS she's basically Benson-C Hull with Hydro.

Oh yeah...that's the 1 I was thinking of.

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13 hours ago, Dr_Venture said:

 

Glad to see you are enjoying it, my most enjoyable line :) 

For the Fletcher, I run a full torpedo build but there is no bad choice.  Fit the ship according to your playstyle, that is the strength of the American Destroyers :) 

torpedo reload mod

PT  
AR / LS

SE / TAE
CE / RPF 

(One I get my Gearing legendary, torpedo mod will be swapped out for reload mod in order to make up the penalty.) 
 

If you ever want to division up some Fletchers or Blacks let me know I am always up for it if I am on. 

 

o7 

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9 hours ago, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

I guess hydro on DDs have become so commonplace that everybody that responded to this left it out as part of it's "skinny"...at least I do believe it has hydro but not sure of it's ranges or anything like that as I don't own it...I do believe it is the standard hydro of all tech tree cruisers besides the Germans though.

For collectors it has the distinction of being 1 of the 1st 3 ships ever in the game. Originally the game was pay to play only (before there was a tech tree or more than just 1 server) & the only 3 ships there were (from cheapest to most expensive) were the Yubari-Simms-Gremy...there probably would have been an RN ship of some sort or another but at the time IRL Russia & England were not getting along so well...thus the reason for RN ships being so late to the party (in the game) despite their prevalence during the actual wars.

That doesn't sound accurate 

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7 hours ago, Cobraclutch said:

Glad to see you are enjoying it, my most enjoyable line :) 

For the Fletcher, I run a full torpedo build but there is no bad choice.  Fit the ship according to your playstyle, that is the strength of the American Destroyers :) 

torpedo reload mod

PT  
AR / LS

SE / TAE
CE / RPF 

(One I get my Gearing legendary, torpedo mod will be swapped out for reload mod in order to make up the penalty.) 
 

If you ever want to division up some Fletchers or Blacks let me know I am always up for it if I am on. 

 

o7 

I'm on usually after 11pm EST, same ingame name. Shoot me a PM if you discord.

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22 hours ago, Phil_Swift_With_Flextape said:

That doesn't sound accurate 

My bad on the 1st part...I was thinking of the Yo Lang for the hydro.

As for the 2nd part that's completely accurate though...my buddy was part of the original testers when the game 1st came out & he said those 3 ships were the only options.

The Yubari didn't have it's special upgrade at the time but I'm not sure what changed for Sims or Gremy since then (if anything) but the reason the Gremy was removed from the game for future purchases is it was originally designed to be OP & is the origin of the term "Russian bias" in WoWS.

Edited by IfYouSeeKhaos
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On ‎11‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 6:21 PM, Estimated_Prophet said:

The only time Sims was ever worth a damn to me was in the original Final Frontier;

Given its AA, it can play very well in Dynamo.  Not as heavy AA as the Kidd one tier up, but it's pretty good for a DD.  And Dynamo calls for a ship that has solid AA, good RoF, good smoke, and maneuverability.  Torps are kind of a 'nice to have' here.  So in Dynamo, Sims can be a rock star.  I hope they keep Dynamo in the rotation.  It's the most fun I've had in the Sims since they broke Ultimate Frontier.  

But the Sims is one of the oldest ships in WoWS.  And (at least on NA) according to WoWS-Numbers, it's the weakest.  Lowest WR% and lowest average damage.  But 4th in XP.  That's maybe due to the baked in XP booster it apparently has.  And it's tops in planes killed.  But IMO, it's dreadful torps really hurt it.  As was said above, you either chose the YOLO torps that do decent damage, or the longer range slowpedos that merely annoy enemy ships.  Several people have said that they've hit BB's with a full spread of those sea mines and failed to sink it.  The sea mines are more 'area denial' torps than anything.  Fire them down a known approach, maybe hit a target in the next battle.  

But in randoms, it's just an older, weaker ship.  

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On 11/6/2018 at 7:21 PM, Estimated_Prophet said:

(Sims; see below...)

No idea personally why Sims is so loved; I like Mahan more.

The only time Sims was ever worth a damn to me was in the original Final Frontier; where it and Leningrad could be used to race north and nuke the Eastern Cleveland before it could even get on the map.

Benson was worse, (36%wr,) (Sims 50% wr, but I hated it so much it only lasted 10 games in Randoms before getting parked.)

  The difference is that Sims has more modern and improved guns vs Mahan.   They're faster and more accurate, imo.   I played both in the recent dunkirk op, and Sims was hands down better.  Shot down WAY more planes (counter-intuitive, right since it still has mainly .50 bmg's for AA- but it's the 5"/38's doing the work), and got more S-boat kills.  It's also faster- which can make a big difference, too.

  Don't get me wrong, Mahan was one of my all time favorites to play- I had a blast in it, and did very well.   But so was Sims.

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Glad you are having fun, but you will get much better results by ditching the gunboat build and going torpedo boat. How are you not getting curb-stomped by cruisers and BBs with the horrific arc/gun bloom combo?

Theres only so much fun to be had when your gun bloom is a good 5k beyond your guns effective range and everything other than IJN destroyers eat you for lunch because they don’t let you get within 5k of them. 

I await the day that the dark days of Patch 6.3 are undone and the USN ships are once again competitive. 

USN can do well, but it’s all with torpedo builds and minimal gun useage. 

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Yeah my opinion they're my favorite destroyer to fly out of all of them 

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4 hours ago, ZARDOZ_II said:

Given its AA, it can play very well in Dynamo.  Not as heavy AA as the Kidd one tier up, but it's pretty good for a DD.  And Dynamo calls for a ship that has solid AA, good RoF, good smoke, and maneuverability.  Torps are kind of a 'nice to have' here.  So in Dynamo, Sims can be a rock star.  I hope they keep Dynamo in the rotation.  It's the most fun I've had in the Sims ...

Forgot about Dynamo; used Sims and it’s DFAA to good effect there.

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4 hours ago, Fletcher7_1944 said:

  The difference is that Sims has more modern and improved guns vs Mahan.   They're faster and more accurate, imo.   I played both in the recent dunkirk op, and Sims was hands down better.  Shot down WAY more planes (counter-intuitive, right since it still has mainly .50 bmg's for AA- but it's the 5"/38's doing the work), and got more S-boat kills.  It's also faster- which can make a big difference, too.

  Don't get me wrong, Mahan was one of my all time favorites to play- I had a blast in it, and did very well.   But so was Sims.

Yes to Dynamo; forgot about that.

Mahan grew on me me because I took it cold into the first T7 Ranked, and came out with a 60% wr.

So cold in fact I forgot to install ANY modules, (something I didn’t actually realize until going back to Mahan months later,) and still got that 60% wr.

Edited by Estimated_Prophet

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